Caldwell Racing Technology 3.5

[noli]

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Mathew just shared these pics. This is the rotator. The rotator is the motor less fuel management.

HP..........500 ~ 600
mids.......15"
weight.....375 lbs
cowling....newly designed carbon fibre with graphics












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[Capt.Insane-o]

Now we're talkin'.

[Da Bull]

You bet Capt. As for me I`ll have to wait till they hit the used market if I live that long. But man would that be a riot on the back of my Riot!

[Rayzor]

These new motors are awesome in theory, but the reality is that I don't think they'll sell many of them. By the time they are fully in production and available, Mercury will have their new 500-600hp V8 available for less money and full warranty. Sure, the Mercury V8 will be bigger (20") and heavier (500-600#s), but that size and weight is ideal for the big boats that they will be going on. The small boats will work much better with the smaller/lighter CRT motor, but the guys with the small boats won't be able to afford them. I personally just don't see a market for this new 3.5 CRT. These CRTs would be awesome race motors for a class like the X-Cat series, so maybe that's where they would find their market. A spec motor for a larger X-Cat boat class (maybe 12-14 meters, instead of the 10 meter limit on X-Cat) would be very interesting - sort-of a replacement for Class 1. The current 10 meter X-Cats would be way too dangerous with a pair of lightweight 600hp engines hanging off the transom.....

[racer]

I would like to see some actual dyno numbers. I applaud them for what they are doing, it's a lot of work and very expensive to do.

[jpf091959]

Love it!

[noli]

These new motors are awesome in theory, but the reality is that I don't think they'll sell many of them. By the time they are fully in production and available, Mercury will have their new 500-600hp V8 available for less money and full warranty. Sure, the Mercury V8 will be bigger (20") and heavier (500-600#s), but that size and weight is ideal for the big boats that they will be going on. The small boats will work much better with the smaller/lighter CRT motor, but the guys with the small boats won't be able to afford them. I personally just don't see a market for this new 3.5 CRT. These CRTs would be awesome race motors for a class like the X-Cat series, so maybe that's where they would find their market. A spec motor for a larger X-Cat boat class (maybe 12-14 meters, instead of the 10 meter limit on X-Cat) would be very interesting - sort-of a replacement for Class 1. The current 10 meter X-Cats would be way too dangerous with a pair of lightweight 600hp engines hanging off the transom.....

I think that the better performing outboards will many times win over slower warrantied motors for some. When you're in the price range of say the new DW360 that some say have a boring acceleration with 400R motors and even with the fuel thirsty V8 500HP that's soon to come out will still leave folks in this size range wanting more power.

The 2 strokes will most probably out-accelarate its competition and give a big smile to its owners. The warrantied Merc motors will always appeal to most because of the warranty and the software and ease of use. But when you have guys where the price differential (can be) neglected, the CRT 3.5 will surely shine. When you have folks who are willing to open the CRT motor and do their own fixes and cylinder bore replacement within just hours and be back in the water quickly, warranty can be secondary. Also what if the CRT 3.5 become mainstream across the US such that Big marine stores will hold parts and get you back onto the water quickly because of the simplicity of these motors, this will be truly revolutionary.


The only thing I don't have an answer for is that these CRT motors are "race" motors. It seems that Mercury cannot sell the 400ROS to just anyone. But then again so are the 200XS ROS Merc are also race motors that anyone can purchase as many as they want without having to prove to anyone that their use will only be on a race circuit.

I think that time will tell and I sure hope that CRT will keep the 2 strokes alive. Remember these platforms are 2 stroke motors today. What if they move into 4 stroke platforms tomorrow and still deliver outstanding performance?

Sure is a good time to have expendable cash for any of these upcoming motors.






.

[Da Bull]

[QUOTE

The only thing I don't have an answer for is that these CRT motors are "race" motors. It seems that Mercury cannot sell the 400ROS to just anyone. But then again so are the 200XS ROS Merc are also race motors that anyone can purchase as many as they want without having to prove to anyone that their use will only be on a race circuit.

][/QUOTE]


Money talks

[powerabout]

with that kind of money you could fund a open source e-tec ecu for any custom 2 stroke?

[Esox4130]

You could buy 2 400r’s for price of just that powerhead haha

[powerabout]

does the 3.5 have the same bore spacing?

[Speed Jr.]

Seems like there are a lot of people who are biting their tongue to ask the serious questions and pointing out the obvious.

Anyone who thinks the 400r is a "slow accelerating" motor has a lack of education on the development of that engine. Mercury had to pull back the power curve to keep the gearcase together. Well guess what? Your mid and lower unit options will be even worse with this. Anyone who thinks this would be a viable option over a 400r or V8 500r again, makes no sense.

The only practical application would be a drag boat that goes a short distance at a time or a roundy round. Which is great. I look forward to seeing them.

It is mentioned above that unfortunately it will be priced out of most of us little race boat budgets. I think that's a fair statement.

Another fair statement would be if they sold a couple of these, then this model would have 100% growth in sales over the previous model.

It's got to be hard to market a motor at drag races that is supposed to be superior to what's out there but comparable in performance so they dont get weight added.

It's an interesting project from all fronts. I just want to see some in action.......from someone who bought one.

I know there will be people jumping on my thoughts above telling me why I'm wrong, just keep in mind I want to see these engines out running hard! They look awesome. It just hasn't happened with the 2.5 yet. Everytime someone posts about these like it's our savior to our sport I cant help but shake my head.

Jr.

[Rayzor]

I think that the better performing outboards will many times win over slower warrantied motors for some. When you're in the price range of say the new DW360 that some say have a boring acceleration with 400R motors and even with the fuel thirsty V8 500HP that's soon to come out will still leave folks in this size range wanting more power.

The 2 strokes will most probably out-accelarate its competition and give a big smile to its owners. The warrantied Merc motors will always appeal to most because of the warranty and the software and ease of use. But when you have guys where the price differential (can be) neglected, the CRT 3.5 will surely shine. When you have folks who are willing to open the CRT motor and do their own fixes and cylinder bore replacement within just hours and be back in the water quickly, warranty can be secondary. Also what if the CRT 3.5 become mainstream across the US such that Big marine stores will hold parts and get you back onto the water quickly because of the simplicity of these motors, this will be truly revolutionary.


The only thing I don't have an answer for is that these CRT motors are "race" motors. It seems that Mercury cannot sell the 400ROS to just anyone. But then again so are the 200XS ROS Merc are also race motors that anyone can purchase as many as they want without having to prove to anyone that their use will only be on a race circuit.

I think that time will tell and I sure hope that CRT will keep the 2 strokes alive. Remember these platforms are 2 stroke motors today. What if they move into 4 stroke platforms tomorrow and still deliver outstanding performance?

Sure is a good time to have expendable cash for any of these upcoming motors.






.

I'm glad to see that CRT has you in their corner Noli, rooting for them, as I would like to see them succeed. I just know that it will not be in the mass consumer market. I'm glad that you brought up fuel consumption, because this is the other big reason CRT will have a very tough time winning over consumers in the performance boat market. That new 3.5L "old technology" fuel injected 2 stroke (not direct injected) is going to burn at least double the amount of fuel that mercury's new 4 stroke V8s will of equal horsepower. I know this for fact, as I have owned 300hp 2 stroke fuel injected motors that burned as much fuel as my 800hp 4 stroke carbureted motors. Equal HP 2 stroke motors will burn double the amount of fuel as an equal HP 4 stroke motor. For racing applications, fuel consumption is not a concern, but for high performance pleasure boat guys - it means a lot. I'm not trying to rain on CRT's parade, as they've obviously developed a pretty amazing powerhead, it's just several years too late is all. Had they released this powerhead back when all we had was the 2.5/280 and 3.0/300X, I think you would have possibly seen some demand from the consumer market as a high HP replacement powerhead that was closer to the warranty and fuel consumption of what was available at the time (though I still can't see outboard guys spending $60k on a powerhead back then). In today's rapidly advancing 4 stroke outboard market, no high performance pleasure boater is going to buy these old technology powerheads and build his own outboards (you still need a transom assembly, mid, lower, and steering) when he can just go down to his local Mercury Racing dealer and buy a complete motor for less money, that has similar performance while burning half the fuel, with warranties and dealer support. Everyone reading this probably knows there's not a more performance oriented outboard enthusiast than me, and I wouldn't even think of purchasing these CRT's for my 30. By the time I'd be finished building a set of motors with CRT powerheads, I'd be into the project $200k for power alone (with no warranties) - I might as well just put a set of big power inboards back in my 30 and go faster!

[90 5.0]

I'm glad to see that CRT has you in their corner Noli, rooting for them, as I would like to see them succeed. I just know that it will not be in the mass consumer market. I'm glad that you brought up fuel consumption, because this is the other big reason CRT will have a very tough time winning over consumers in the performance boat market. That new 3.5L "old technology" fuel injected 2 stroke (not direct injected) is going to burn at least double the amount of fuel that mercury's new 4 stroke V8s will of equal horsepower. I know this for fact, as I have owned 300hp 2 stroke fuel injected motors that burned as much fuel as my 800hp 4 stroke carbureted motors. Equal HP 2 stroke motors will burn double the amount of fuel as an equal HP 4 stroke motor. For racing applications, fuel consumption is not a concern, but for high performance pleasure boat guys - it means a lot. I'm not trying to rain on CRT's parade, as they've obviously developed a pretty amazing powerhead, it's just several years too late is all. Had they released this powerhead back when all we had was the 2.5/280 and 3.0/300X, I think you would have possibly seen some demand from the consumer market as a high HP replacement powerhead that was closer to the warranty and fuel consumption of what was available at the time (though I still can't see outboard guys spending $60k on a powerhead back then). In today's rapidly advancing 4 stroke outboard market, no high performance pleasure boater is going to buy these old technology powerheads and build his own outboards (you still need a transom assembly, mid, lower, and steering) when he can just go down to his local Mercury Racing dealer and buy a complete motor for less money, that has similar performance while burning half the fuel, with warranties and dealer support. Everyone reading this probably knows there's not a more performance oriented outboard enthusiast than me, and I wouldn't even think of purchasing these CRT's for my 30. By the time I'd be finished building a set of motors with CRT powerheads, I'd be into the project $200k for power alone (with no warranties) - I might as well just put a set of big power inboards back in my 30 and go faster!

I could be way off here but I can’t imagine any market for the big offshore pleasure boat market, like you say 400r’s 350 v8 hammers and the super badgers for the sho are gonna be where it’s at in that market imo.

I’m pretty sure these will be race boat only applications and that’s what they are shooting for anyway, with maybe the one to two guys out there with way to much money that throw them on offshore boats just to be different.

[JPEROG]

Outboard drag racing needs to have some real money injected into it. If lucas or someone with TV coverage gets involved then it might come back. I don't see anywhere near the the numbers of 30 years ago "maybe its just the guys that I am exposed to now" but we used to have groups together all of time with small wheels and buoys out". I guess that if I lived on the Fox chain and could do the Blarney stuff it would be a consideration, otherwise we need to have some national events in addition to Jasper in order for guys to want to lay out this kind of money on a drag toy. I'm not sure what class in circle racing is going to allow them but I hope its a decent size group that they can market to. Caldwell obviously is doing this out of passion only. The amount of money spent so far could retire 100 people on this board. Hats off to him on being able to do it and sticking with it.

Joe