New 4-stroke outboard prices.....insane!

[David]

We absolutely adore our 150 HO Etec. Fast, great pulling power for skiing, easy on fuel and oil, simple maintenance.

I almost bought a second 150 HO for my SS2000 but got a 200XS instead. Expensive compared to the Etec, harder to maintain, but I don't think I'd be driving a 150 HO at 90+

Nor can I put any of the 4 strokes on my SS2000. End of an era which is why we all bitch and complain.

[noli]

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Mercury 300R is 1 year out

if I can save $1,900 per month

I can own a new 300R Sport Master Lower in 1 year


300R jacos price = $22,800


22,800 / 12 = $1,900 I have to save each month....yesh!


waynes marine --> https://www.waynesmarine.net




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[engineermike]

You guys got me thinking and I decided to look up pricing across a 25 year span to see how modern outboard pricing stacks up agains income, inflation, and pickup truck prices.


1991
Median income $30,126
Mercury 260 $17,000 (56% of median income)
Mercury 150 $9,391 (31% of median income)
Base F150 $10,400 (35% of median income)
Top F150 $15,857 (53% of median income)


1991 prices, inflation adjusted
Median income $71,195
Mercury 260 $40,175 (56% of median income)
Mercury 150 $22,163 (31% of median income)
Base F150 $24,544 (35% of median income)
Top F150 $37,433 (53% of median income)


2016 (most recent income data available)
Median income $59,039
Mercury 400 $36,120 (61% of median income)
Mercury 150 $13,535 (23% of median income)
Base F150 $27,510 (47% of median income)
Top F150 $65,000 (110% of median income)


My initial observation is that median income hasn’t quite kept up with inflation, which sucks. The mid-range outboards are significantly cheaper (2/3 the price, actually) than they were 25 years ago and the most expensive 2016 merc racing outboard is +/-10% depending on how you compare. Even if the price of the top dog merc is +10%, you are still getting 50% more hp. If I were to compare the old 260 to, say, a current 250R, the current engine is actually 30% cheaper, inflation adjusted. So, at least at the 150-250 hp range, outboards are actually 30% cheaper today than they were 25 years ago once you account for inflation, as well as much more user-friendly and efficient.


Looks like we should be far more upset about truck prices because they actually have gone up considerably no matter how you look at it.


So what about the 450?
The cheapest one is what, $54k? That’s about 35% more than a new 260 was, inflation adjusted, or about 86% of current median income. It’s hard to compare to 1991 numbers because nothing even remotely like it existed back then. The closest thing to it today is the Yamaha 425 which starts at $44k. It’s not really the same class, though. The next closest thing out there is the 7-Marine 527 at $70k, which makes the 450R look cheap and light.

[JPEROG]

We absolutely adore our 150 HO Etec. Fast, great pulling power for skiing, easy on fuel and oil, simple maintenance.

I almost bought a second 150 HO for my SS2000 but got a 200XS instead. Expensive compared to the Etec, harder to maintain, but I don't think I'd be driving a 150 HO at 90+

Nor can I put any of the 4 strokes on my SS2000. End of an era which is why we all bitch and complain.

Don't look at it as the glass half empty. There will soon be a brand new Allison SS2000 with 4 cyl 4 stroke (light, quite, and very powerful). I don't know if it will become a production motor but its based off of one so it can be duplicated for sure. This stuff is just getting started.

I have touted for years about how good my old 300X motor runs but I can also tell you this: Every time out I use 35 gallons of fuel at $4.00 per gallon (93 non ethanol) =$140.00 and a gallon of oil at $20.00. I do this at least twice a week (last week I ran 4 days consecutive) and I changed my gear oil twice.

I will get better performance out of a new motor, no more oil to burn (change it every 40 hours of clock time will be my personal routine) and burn just over half the fuel. The most exciting part to me whats coming in the near future from the aftermarket world that will take most hulls (everything capable of running with a current 3L and up) into a whole to stratosphere.

Joe

[Markus]

Its funny that everyone thinks that the two stroke "would have sold" with modern technology. The new E-tecs have all of that "modern technology" and I can go pick up 10 of them today from dealers that have them in stock and discounted--They obviously are not selling. Mercury had non current two strokes from hell for years "they were not selling as well as the four strokes with the same h.p. rating". The other side of the coin is that if they had invested money in "more modern two stroke technology", they would have had to recoup that investment and prices would again have gone up.

Yep. You can bet that Mercury thought long and hard about the viability of the two-stroke.

[Markus]

As I stated in the post above, the overall market segment is too small for anyone to want to chase. I think that has been proven with several race sanctioning bodies that have approached other manufactures to "get in the game". If anyone has the ability to do it, Honda with all of their F1 experience and technology could build something outrageous but they choose to hunt for bigger markets.

My bet stands that you will never buy a new 300R or bigger outboard for prices lower then you can get them today. Mercury Racing and its supporting accessory divisions have a very niche market segment that we need to support.

Joe

I doubt that the majority of 450Rs go to racing. Fishing is where the money is. The sight of money usually brings competition. Competition brings down prices.

[JPEROG]

I doubt that the majority of 450Rs go to racing. Fishing is where the money is. The sight of money usually brings competition. Competition brings down prices.

I agree but all of the 450s come out of Mercury Racing "not the main production plant"-so they and all of the R motors are Racing products. There target audience was very well displayed at the Nashville debut.

My point to all of this talk is that we need to be thankful for Brunswick having Mercury Racing as one of their divisions and be willing to support them as a result "not sit here and bad mouth them". Almost every person on this site utilizes product that they developed yet we see idiotic quotes like this "No matter how many "r" stickers they slap on their car motor crap, merc racing is dead. Just overpriced sea of sameness" on a high performance enthusiast site where at least 80% of its members require their product support.

There is no other manufacture that has a racing division to give us product allowing us to continue expanding our hobby and moving forward with new technology.

Joe

[gotboostedvr6]

Don't look at it as the glass half empty. There will soon be a brand new Allison SS2000 with 4 cyl 4 stroke (light, quite, and very powerful). I don't know if it will become a production motor but its based off of one so it can be duplicated for sure. This stuff is just getting started.

Honda? No doubt you can make big hp with a Honda 4cyl when they rev to the moon but will they make enough torque?

How will they improve the Honda gearcase?

[Tom Foley]

This happened with dirt bike engines years ago as they transitioned from 2 stroke to 4 stroke . Increased reliability was the claim but to make a high revving bike engine you need titanium valves and keepers and that does not translate to reliability . Not sure of the mercury technology yet but routine valve adjustments will be required for longevity and power as well as rigid oil change intervals in excess of what the factory recommends . Wait till they start dropping valves and burning up cams when they are out of warranty !! Oh boy .

[engineermike]

FYI from merc literature: “maintenance-free valve-train” of the engine”

[Risco]

This happened with dirt bike engines years ago as they transitioned from 2 stroke to 4 stroke . Increased reliability was the claim but to make a high revving bike engine you need titanium valves and keepers and that does not translate to reliability . Not sure of the mercury technology yet but routine valve adjustments will be required for longevity and power as well as rigid oil change intervals in excess of what the factory recommends . Wait till they start dropping valves and burning up cams when they are out of warranty !! Oh boy .

Can’t really compare Tom the Ktm dirt bike rev 12k and the 4.8v8 revs 6300 witch in face is very similar to my 5.0(2016)truck motor 6000rpm stock and same valve train different cam profile mustang does 7500. These are maintenance free vavle trains with the exception of chain and tensions ever 100000.

[Hot Shot Merc]

This happened with dirt bike engines years ago as they transitioned from 2 stroke to 4 stroke . Increased reliability was the claim but to make a high revving bike engine you need titanium valves and keepers and that does not translate to reliability . Not sure of the mercury technology yet but routine valve adjustments will be required for longevity and power as well as rigid oil change intervals in excess of what the factory recommends . Wait till they start dropping valves and burning up cams when they are out of warranty !! Oh boy .

Great points Tom. My 5.7 Hemi CRAP in my 2007 Dodge Ram dropped valves at 100k miles and destroyed my motor.

Another fact speaking of truck priced inflation is:

My brand new 1999 Ford F-150 lightning SVT SUPERCHARGED cost $28k.

My brand new 2000 Ford F-150 Extra cab v-8 STX package $26k

My brand new 2003 Ford F-150 100th anniversary Harley Davidson Edition loaded with leather also super charged and crew cab 20" wheels etc $28k

Fast Forward to present:

My brand new 2018 Ford F-150 STX Super cab 325 hp twin turbo v6 w/20" alum wheels,alum body panels and bed ect $27k..... No sign of inflation from 1999-2018 in my personal experience for very similar trucks.

Wheres the inflation equal to these new trucks i bought at nearly the same exact price over 15 years ago compared to my brand new 2003 Mercury 2.5 EFI 280 Offshore sportmaster cost me $16k to a 2019 450r at almost $60k?

My point is that average price of new trucks HAVE NOT gone up with inflation like stated compared to the prices of new merc racing engine. The reason some truck models cost so much today is they are full extra crap like computer screens,back up cameras,tail gates that cost $5k to replace or side view mirrors that cost $2K to replace etc but the average truck is the same price as 15 years ago. Fact!!!

Yes the new 450r is 150 hp more which is awesome but not $40k more awesome IMO. I guess IF i could afford a new 450r and had a big enough boat to hang one on I would definitely buy one. I am very impressed with it but would sell it the day before the warranty runs out

My dream boat package these days would be a 21 Skater/trick cat with a 450r. I think that would put a smile on my face for sure

[Hot Shot Merc]

In 2005 I bought a brand new Baja 23 Outlaw with 6.2 Mercruiser 320 hp with allum tandem axel trailer and full sunbrella snap on cover. That entire package cost $56k.

[engineermike]

Rob, you’re comparing bottom of the line new trucks to top of the line old trucks and claiming no inflation. Then go on to compare top of the line new motors to top of the line old motors to show how much they’ve gone up even though the new ones make 60% more power. Your comparison isn’t like for like. Comparing list price of an old 280 to a new 200 v8 would be equivalent to your f150 comparison.

[Whaaaaat]

"Be thankful" for rusty sportmaster driveshafts, $35 studs to hold anodes on, steel parts on "offshore" motors, $600 rings, motors that get heavier every year for the same power........ so thankful! Pass me some more of that koolaid my glass is half empty.

My neighbor has a Honda car civic R. The R is for racing right? I'm ordering enough R stickers for everything I own, lawnmower included, I'm gonna be a real racer when they come in.