White Is Wonderful!(post Omc Pics Here)

[BarryStrawn]

Epic fail. But good luck with the project and please post pictures.

[gmcgruther]

Epic fail. But good luck with the project and please post pictures.

I'm not here to do a pissin match, I'm having Either Dave or Monty build the engine to there 450 hp spec's and then we are adding on the turbo, Either way both said they won't mind being part of the project, I did call both for the information That I got. And the Exhaust chest has to be similar to Ray Leach's but with two stinger pipes, One for each side (Twin Turbo) or two stinger pipes leading to one Turbo. Monty and Dave gave me a wealth of knowledge that I still have a hard time trying to figure out. Between all the resource's I have know, they all want to see if this will work. By the way what's so epic fail? I was correct, two fire on one side and one on the the other then vise versa. So what the firing order is 123456, the order of the cylinders are not the same. It's like a chevy #1 on one side and #2 on the other and so on. I will post picture's of Turbo system but have to get permission from either Dave or Monty on the engine, depending on which one builds the engine.

[STV_Keith]

I know Monty and he's built a pair of V8's for me, and I certainly know of Dave Bush, even though I've never met the man. They both do top notch work in my book. That being said, if I were doing this type of project, I'd have the exhaust chest work done to mate it to the turbo, but leave as much of the rest of it alone as possible. Starting with a 250-300hp stock package, the turbo will add from 100-300 more HP. I think at that point, you'd be pushing the limits of the block, internals, etc. Starting with something that makes 450hp, you are going to stress those parts to the limit even sooner, with less boost.

I guess what I'm thinking is:

stock HP + turbo = 400-600hp, depending on boost
Dave/Monty power + low boost turbo = 500-600hp, depending on boost
Dave/Monty power + high boost turbo = 600+hp

The point is, if the end HP goal is the same, and you assume that the internals are going to hang on to the power (disregarding what the gearcase may think about it), then it would be cheaper to just do the exhaust mods you require and add boost, then to mod and then add boost. Take a 450hp NA motor and add boost, and you could have the potential for 800+. Unfortunately, I don't think there's any way under the sun that an OMC would stay together with that kind of power.

Either way, good luck. It's certainly a fun project, if you have the funds to see it through. At the very least, you'll be one of VERY few who have done it, and will have some info that few have. If it runs well and lives, you'll have a real monster there.

[BarryStrawn]

By the way what's so epic fail? I was correct, two fire on one side and one on the the other then vise versa. So what the firing order is 123456, the order of the cylinders are not the same. It's like a chevy #1 on one side and #2 on the other and so on.

You fail to understand the firing order and cylinder numbering. "two fire on one side and one on the the other then vise versa" is wrong. Forget about Ford and Chevy V8s The cylinders are 135 in a bank and 246 in the other. Firing 1-2-3-4-5-6 means it fires a cylinder in one bank, then one from the other bank and back and forth. Each bank has three cylinders separated by 120 degrees and a cylinder fires every 60 degrees. Not really that difficult.

[perfmarine1]

I was correct, two fire on one side and one on the the other then vise versa. So what the firing order is 123456, the order of the cylinders are not the same. It's like a chevy #1 on one side and #2 on the other and so on. I will post picture's of Turbo system but have to get permission from either Dave or Monty on the engine, depending on which one builds the engine.


This above statement is total BS. It is nothing like a chevy. Chevy is 4 stk.firing order 18436572,crank turns 2 times per power stroke. 2 stroke crank around tdc fires 1-2 then crank turnes 1/3 turn and 3-4 fires then crank turnes 1/3 turn and fires 5/6 and thats 1 turn of crank. cyls do not fire one on one side and two on the other somebody needs to go back too school just look at v-6 crank!!!!!!!!

[gmcgruther]

I was correct, two fire on one side and one on the the other then vise versa. So what the firing order is 123456, the order of the cylinders are not the same. It's like a chevy #1 on one side and #2 on the other and so on. I will post picture's of Turbo system but have to get permission from either Dave or Monty on the engine, depending on which one builds the engine.


This above statement is total BS. It is nothing like a chevy. Chevy is 4 stk.firing order 18436572,crank turns 2 times per power stroke. 2 stroke crank around tdc fires 1-2 then crank turnes 1/3 turn and 3-4 fires then crank turnes 1/3 turn and fires 5/6 and thats 1 turn of crank. cyls do not fire one on one side and two on the other somebody needs to go back too school just look at v-6 crank!!!!!!!!

Then please explain to me how all three on one side fires before any of the other side does, From what I see and understand when I rotate the crank there is two up and two down and two in the center am I correct? I know chevy has that firing order but the cylinder lay out is "if your looking at the front of the chevy sb" is Rt 1357 and Lt 2468 Now how is the cylinder lay out on the outboard v-6, not firing order either.

[gmcgruther]

Then please explain to me how all three on one side fires before any of the other side does, From what I see and understand when I rotate the crank there is two up and two down and two in the center am I correct? I know chevy has that firing order but the cylinder lay out is "if your looking at the front of the chevy sb" is Rt 1357 and Lt 2468 Now how is the cylinder lay out on the outboard v-6, not firing order either.

Please forget the above post, I see the firing order and the way it fires in cylinder numbering, So I see there is always positive exhaust pulse's in the Three into one header as I say. Dave did mention running a stinger pipe for each bank would greatly help on the turbo system. As Dave said, The stinger pipe will cause back pressure to help keep some of the in coming air from escaping out the exhaust. I see his point now. I'm sorry for getting all missed up. I'm having a real hard time getting information I need dearly to continue my project.

[gmcgruther]

I know Monty and he's built a pair of V8's for me, and I certainly know of Dave Bush, even though I've never met the man. They both do top notch work in my book. That being said, if I were doing this type of project, I'd have the exhaust chest work done to mate it to the turbo, but leave as much of the rest of it alone as possible. Starting with a 250-300hp stock package, the turbo will add from 100-300 more HP. I think at that point, you'd be pushing the limits of the block, internals, etc. Starting with something that makes 450hp, you are going to stress those parts to the limit even sooner, with less boost.

I guess what I'm thinking is:

stock HP + turbo = 400-600hp, depending on boost
Dave/Monty power + low boost turbo = 500-600hp, depending on boost
Dave/Monty power + high boost turbo = 600+hp

The point is, if the end HP goal is the same, and you assume that the internals are going to hang on to the power (disregarding what the gearcase may think about it), then it would be cheaper to just do the exhaust mods you require and add boost, then to mod and then add boost. Take a 450hp NA motor and add boost, and you could have the potential for 800+. Unfortunately, I don't think there's any way under the sun that an OMC would stay together with that kind of power.

Either way, good luck. It's certainly a fun project, if you have the funds to see it through. At the very least, you'll be one of VERY few who have done it, and will have some info that few have. If it runs well and lives, you'll have a real monster there.

I asked Dave and Monty about power output of there nitrous engine(V-6's), I was really surprized that both said they have hit 800 hp on nitrous already and still learnin more to make more power. I asked both of them if that was based on there 400+ hp N/A race engine's and I got this reply "yes". The Both said that the blocks are good for about 1000 to 1100 hp and then your pushing it, My goal is only to take their race 400+ hp engine and make additional 200 ponies, I'd figured if you want to make really stupid power, it would be up the owner of the boat, not me. I just want to make it conservative and practical, not race only.

[perfmarine1]

Post some pictures of your boat and motor as they stand now,so we can all see before and after pics. This is a post your white motor pics thread remember!

[STV_Keith]

I asked Dave and Monty about power output of there nitrous engine(V-6's), I was really surprized that both said they have hit 800 hp on nitrous already and still learnin more to make more power. I asked both of them if that was based on there 400+ hp N/A race engine's and I got this reply "yes". The Both said that the blocks are good for about 1000 to 1100 hp and then your pushing it, My goal is only to take their race 400+ hp engine and make additional 200 ponies, I'd figured if you want to make really stupid power, it would be up the owner of the boat, not me. I just want to make it conservative and practical, not race only.

Fair enough. If the blocks will handle 1000+, what about the crank/rods/pistons/pins/head gaskets, etc? Where is the fuse and what is available to bullet-proof it?

[racer]

Comparing a nitrous engine is misleading because they are only at power for a very short period. Living at a sustained power level is a totally different story. Making power is one thing controlling the heat that power makes is another especially if run for long distances. To say a block is good for a power not obtained is an educated guess. What rpm are you hoping to make this power? I know both Dave and Gordon and have a lot of respect for both but you need to understand they are making power at big rpm.

[gmcgruther]

Fair enough. If the blocks will handle 1000+, what about the crank/rods/pistons/pins/head gaskets, etc? Where is the fuse and what is available to bullet-proof it?

They have yet to find out the power limits of modified stock rods, the crank is forged steel, the pistons of course would be forged, The block is another store, Both Guy's have said to me their very close to have a gernade on their hands. They both use aftermarket studs and bolts to hold this together but they are limits to Cast blocks, Now Dave has said to me there is a company out there that can make billet power head that can handle anything you can through at it but the price is a major factor. Dave also mentioned there is a guy that makes billet rods at 3k to 5k each(per rod) and those won't come apart period.

[gmcgruther]

Comparing a nitrous engine is misleading because they are only at power for a very short period. Living at a sustained power level is a totally different story. Making power is one thing controlling the heat that power makes is another especially if run for long distances. To say a block is good for a power not obtained is an educated guess. What rpm are you hoping to make this power? I know both Dave and Gordon and have a lot of respect for both but you need to understand they are making power at big rpm.

Nitrous is violent on parts and at take off where turbo or turbo's can be set to soft start and come on strong in the middle and hard at the end and not be as hard on engine parts. Dave has said to me his 450+hp engines only crank to 7500 maybe 8000 rpms and the video did prove that. That's my base rt there, Start with a 450+hp engine and add the turbo, I want to start small and work my way up, exsample 450+hp N/A then add boost lets say 5 psi and making 500hp now, So I can just turn up the boost gradualy and stop at about 800 or possible 900 hp. For you question on heat wise, Turbos will not cause excessive heat unless you are at full throttle at a substain period of time. 1/8 or 1/4 mile you'll be just fine but on a lake and screamin it from one side to the other, say good bye to your engine. The turbo or turbo's I'll be using are for short blast at a time. You can crusie with them and be fine, there want be lots of heat from the exhaust at that time and I plan on running a titanium exhaust that is ceramic coated and water cooled to. The intercooler will be simple air/water cooler it will be you ultimate choice to run this on a lake, I prefer it to be for drag racing or top speed.

[baja200merk]

I know both Dave and Gordon and have a lot of respect for both but you need to understand they are making power at big rpm.

BIG power a 1/4 mile at a time.

500hp with F1 reliability is much harder to obtain then 800hp for a 1/4.

[racer]

IMO a turbo engine will need to be ported different than a NA engine so a start at 450 might be a stretch. Power makes heat no way around that, sure a good innercooler will help. An omc block grows/shrinks a lot with temp change so keeping it consistent an even will be important cruising or running hard. Keeping cylinder pressure even may also be a chore considering the difference in the runners and the need for back pressure to keep the boosted charge in the cylinder. I dont think its going to be as easy as it sounds you think it will be to reach 900 and live, I have a feeling the front half will not hold the mains in place.