300x stroker

[JPEROG]

I picked up 5 mph, acceleration and load carrying capability. I could probably pick up a few more mph's with some taller props, but mid 120"s is fast enough for me in a 32' boat.

Here is a video of a short test run https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftwuiX086Uk

Where do run that boat out of? 120s in an A outboard is rollin...

Joe

[JPEROG]

Cunninham Rods already makes a great billet rod....unfortunately they've only sold a total of 14 since about 2008 (when Galen Burden had them design some for my race motor). That's why they're now $500 per rod and that is without silver plating which runs about another $75-100 per rod if you can find someone to do it. If enough people got together to place a decent size order, I'd think they could be had for much less but there is still the silver plate issue to deal with.

For a race motor they make sense due to the high investment of having a block built and the extreme rpms & compression but imo these rods are overkill for a low rpm / low compression lake motor.

I am waiting for Chaz to chime in on this. I am in for 6 or possibly 12 if the price gets dropped enough.

Joe

[StratosVT]

I am waiting for Chaz to chime in on this. I am in for 6 or possibly 12 if the price gets dropped enough.

Joe

The real question is what is a low enough price to get a large group of people interested. As a reference point, I paid $350 per rod for the first ones made and then had to get them silvered. The last set ordered several years later were around $500 each. From the conversation I had with the guy at Cunningham many years ago, it sounds like they are a pain in the arse to make and the price is high due to the mishaps that are inevitable during the fracturing process. Realistically, I'd be shocked if they'd go back to the $350 price but you never know.....a large volume might get you there.

Unfortunately even if you can get a great price on the rods, the real roadblock is the silver plating. Cunningham won't do it and whoever chooses to be the lead dog on the deal will need to find somewhere to have them plated and there is a lot of risk in that process if not done properly.

[Chaz]

Stratos , I believe I met you a couple of years ago here in Palm City . And from your accurate story above , I know I saw the last set of rods you had built .
At the time , I chose to go a different way . I send $5000.00 as a deposit to have production started on an H beam rod from another company.
In order to use both ends of the rod as the bearing race , they have to use a steel such as 8620 (gear material) which can be carburized. It leaves the part case hardened on the outside and malleable on the inside so it will not shatter like glass .
We tossed around the idea of using a dowel pin to locate the cap which would be machined like a W at the mating surface so the needle could roll across an uninterrupted surface , because they were well aware that at least 1/3 of the "cracked cap" rods are unusable after parting the cap.
After that and the need to copper plate and the use of "stop paint" and still the fear of acid used during the plating process , they sent my deposit back after 10 weeks of debating it and said , thanks but no thanks ...
A couple other rod mfg's I have spoken to outside of the US have quoted 800 - 1000 each . I didn't get the feeling they wanted to hassle with it either.
After seeing what they are doing at the Porsche shop I do work for , I have been tempted to strip the silver off the thrust surface , hone both ends big and send a set of stock rods out to be DLC coated and see how that lives in a junk motor . If it lived , then they could be machined out of 4140 in a more normal fashion , including cracked cap , and then coated .
What I have told all of them is that the stock rod is strong enough to run the motor with no issue . being that it is a two stroke , it can and will stick a piston from time to time . Instead of just seizing up , where you can go home and put a new piston in . The way they are now , the five that still want to go will just break the rod and keep running . I guess if you have one motor and are 20 miles out in the ocean , that would be good as a get me home . But if you have umpteen hours in port work and sleeving , having that knife go around and saw the block in half is unacceptable .
WSM , Pro and Mercury will sell you brand new rods . You can even buy them for between 100 and 300 each . When asked , Will you build a rod that wraps the small end with a rib and flair's out to the big end bolt holes instead of a weak parallel beam .. they seem to be too busy to continue the conversation ..
Even these I had drawn up , the engineer couldn't get away from the straight side beam , instead chose to add a flair at the very bottom ...

[baja200merk]

Isn't there other factory rods out of fishing motors (of another color) that will do what u want? :P

i had one motor the block cracked along a glue line started getting a little water in one cyl. After a few trips out (I assume) it rusted up the big end of the rod so bad it lunched the bearing and locked the motor up on the big end at 3500. It bent the $2500 crank .020! Too far to just straiten and repair a journal. Point is If the plating or mating surface isn't perfect it will take out a very expensive crank at that point it doesn't matter how strong the rod is.

[mrcrsr]

I've been putting some time into looking into that, even going so far as to have the crank journals turned down to accept it, and doing a custom piston(which I've talked to je about. Thats why I went super light with my rotating assembly this time around to take stress off the rod. I'm not a believer in this stroker deal, for the costs vs return (180 something cc gain). There's alot of other things that can be done for less costs to increase power.

[StratosVT]

Stratos , I believe I met you a couple of years ago here in Palm City . And from your accurate story above , I know I saw the last set of rods you had built .

Yes sir, I remember meeting you at your shop. I was in town doing some work with Monty and he brought me with him to your shop. Think you were working on the Twisted boat at the time.

Through Monty I knew you had been working on getting some rods done. Awhile back (probably a yr or so) I had some conversations with the main guy in Italy at Auto Verdi about doing some rods. Although they're not a fractured cap rod, their mercury F1 rods have a very good reputation so my guess is a 3L version could work quite well. He felt it would be no problem for them to make them and for under $350 (without silver). I told him they would have to delivered ready to drop in a motor as I didn't want to deal with the plating. At that point in time he couldn't find anywhere to have them plated and that's where our communication ended.

[Chaz]

That Twisted boat is such a work of art , I hate to see it put away in mothballs .

I spoke to the Verdi guys . Never went any farther that the dry sump pump guys on the west coast . Might be worth a revisit .
I stopped in at the Porsche shop to drop off some stuff before they leave for Atlanta in the morning . While I was there , I told the boss about the issue of blocking similar metals with a silver plating ..
Running air cooled turbo motor's in the trunk ( I didn't really say that ) they tend to see more heat and friction than most .
They just picked up a new customer from the race in the Homestead /Miami race a couple weeks ago .
This motor was typical , in that it got hot and started pushing the heads off ... As you can see it burned the ex. guide and hump down and loads the hot side of the turbo with molten slag .



Part of the fix has been piston and chamber coatings ...





They are trying out something new in the ex ports that should stay put to really insane heat levels . Hope so , those are new billet heads with their latest CNC'd port .



Still to me , the most impressive out of all of them ( although each has their own place ) is the DLC (diamond like coating) It shines like black chrome , you can lap this valve in . The only thing that will show a mark is the seat . The stem never wears . They also do the cam and it's follower . After a full season of running against itself , it shows no wear . It's the perfect replacement for silver . It's only drawback , it's not for the faint of wallet . But once you get to a certain point , none of this stuff is ... Going for a World Championship
Chasin a pork sammich from Lil Jim bridge bait + tackle store ...

[StratosVT]

Very interesting. Would love to see someone try DLC in place of the silver on rods. Seems like it could/should be a better way to go.