1985 Checkmate Enticer/1974 Merc 1500

[mikevr007]

I am finally getting my 1985 Checkmate Enticer back together again. After a transom repair, completely new floor, all new interior, all new gauges and gauge panel, new engine harness, and a new boat harness, new axle, aluminum wheels and tires, I am going to be putting the 1974 Merc 1500 back on. I have purchased carb rebuild kits, tilt cylinder rebuild kits (one squeaked horribly), impeller kit, two (2) repair manuals, and a compression tester (couldn't find my old one...). I am planning on going through the motor myself using the factory procedures outlined in the manuals, of course this will be after replacing the impeller, lube, and installing the carb kits. A couple of questions....What do you think is a reasonable fee if I were to ask a OB mechanic to do the work for me (after I install the carb kits)? Time is just not on my side, but money is also tight. I can make more time, not more money. Also, should I do anything with the tilt motor? It's been drained for about a year now. It worked fine when I took my boat out of service. Is there anything else I should do before firing up?
Also (how many questions do I get?), when I bought the boat the transom had a 1/6 or 3/32 inch aluminum sheet over it, probably because of the rotting transom. Should I put it back on? It seems like it might help protect the new transom, I guess. Of course I have to drill new holes to mount the motor, should I trust that the old mounting holes are right? Are there measurements I can take to make sure the motor is at the right height etc? Sorry for the long post and I look forward to a reply. Thanks for all your previous help!!!

[sho305]

You may want to go to general or tech areas for some of those questions. Try searching for Checkmate; there is tons of stuff for you here. Before you put it on, I would determine mounting height, if you should use a jack, etc. Don't know what size hull you have, but someone here will know the right setup. I hope to do my 17' Checkmate vee in the next year. Does it have a pad? Are you sure the motor needs repair? I was told with my 120-122 compression to not bother yet, or get a leakdown tester to find wear. I have a '73 1500. I do need to have the LU resealed and a trim bushing replaced before I run it again. How about solid motor mounts? I want those.

Mine has an ugly metal plate on it, and I'll be using an aluminum plate under anything I mount a motor to over 100hp IMHO to spread the stress out. Make sure you do the holes right and get them sealed well. Glass them or use the tube method. Mine is raised 2" on the transom now, but it will need setback for my hull depending on how I pad it. Not sure if this Merc will go back on it though.

[mikevr007]

I probably won't use a jack plate even if someone suggests it. I'm really not going for all out speed. I just want a dependable all around good performing boat. I was told the boat did well over 50 the way it was setup before, that's good enough for me. BUT, if I can do better by just raising the motor I'll try it.
BTW, the Enticer is 16'6" and weighs about 750 lbs., vee hull. Neat little boat.
As far as the motor goes, the only thing I'm repairing is the tilt cylinders. The rest of it I am just giving it a good tune up to hopefully pre-empt any potential problems. I haven't even done any compression checks yet. We'll see! Yeah, I was reading on here some ideas on sealing the mounting holes and using tubing etc. Quite haven't made up my mind on that one yet.
Thanks for the reply !!
Later...

[walter651]

Mike, I put my enticer in the water today for the first time with a new 150.It had a 1987 115 Merc that I sold to help pay for the new one.My new v6 is 85lbs heavier than your six.Your 150 should push well over 50...my115 did 53mph(gps) at 5900rpm with a 20in Laser2 prop.I set my new engine up 1.5in above the transom and it seems to hang onto corners better than the 115 did.It was right down on top.My boat is a 1988 with a 22in tall transom;check yours some were 20in.Mercury sells a transom drilling guide with instructions that takes all the guesswork out of the job.It retails somewhere above 60.00.The metal plates are factory Checkmate;I saw a sticker that said 'boat warrantee void if engine installed without plates'.They are galvanized steel I believe.My setup is temporary while I break in my engine and save some dough for hyd. steering and hyd. jack plate.These are important to me on my boat.You may wish for them after your first ride.I hope some of this information is helpful and I hope your boat turns out well.

[sho305]

Yeah, you can get a manual jack here for as low as the $50 I paid for mine With the relatively light inline you need more setback and it should not be a problem if your transom is good. You must have the same size hull as my '73, but mine is a straight vee w/full strakes and no pad or round, and is a BR. Mine lists 930lbs factory and a 20" transom. With my inline jacked 2" on the transom, it still gets good bow lift with the Laser II 20p prop and you will need all that if you have no setback. I get best speed trimmed way out to a rooster about as high as the motor, not too far before it looses water. The Laser is very resistant to blowing out, and just starts to slip really. My stock 21 aluminum blows completely out way before that at maybe 1/2 the trim. I get 5600 to 6000 rpm depending on the day and moon phase Got 55 a couple times on the speedo and I figure real 50-52 with a prop calculator as it may be slipping at 6000rpm w/ all that trim.

I'm thinking like you Walter651 What kind of results are you getting with the V6 so far? Thinking about a viper for my inline and a V6 after I paint up the Checkmate. Going to pad it some, but like the way it cuts the wakes now. Sure handles nice but I know it will be squirrely at 60+ this way.

On my new bayliner transom, I hung the 85hp an inch above the transom on a spacer and drilled it. Then pulled the motor away and drilled it bigger, filled/painted the holes with glass fibers/epoxy mix, the west epoxy I did the transom with. Drilled it back to the right size and mounted the motor with lots of 5200. Did the first coats in there plain epoxy to soak the wood w/q-tips.

Here is a pic of my transom now and the ugly black metal plate on it. There is a 2" piece of wood under the plate for a 22" transom height. Pretty good I think for a transom mount and to still get lots of bow lift. Can't lift the bow if an adult sits in the BR area though. Don't know if you could anyway, but nice to fish and dock from there.

[sho305]

As far as the motor, I did the whole fuel system and it runs fine now. Flushed the tank, new line/bulb & pumps, took all carbs off and apart and cleaned well, new filters & flushed carb lines. New plugs, gooped up wires that were good, cleaned cap & rotor, new rectifier, etc. Set timing on starter, but raised it up for more go later on 40:1 premium. I will set it @5000 like your supposed to when I rig it again. Transom is weak and I don't want to crack the glass getting air anymore...just too tempting when that wake is in front of me I'll have to run the bayliner until something gets going. Got 40+ out of the poor 85hp 16' BR now, but better than driving the dock anyway. The Checkmate sure is a lot more boat under you.

That inline sure is hard on the battery though with no voltage regulator. Had to put water in it all the time, and then when I got lots of air once it flew out and blew a cell I think Only a year old delco marine. I have to find something to take power and keep it in control. I checked it running at speed and it was at over 16 volts.

If I were you, I'd put some setback on it just to get you less trim angle. That slows you down and is free speed. Even if you go small it will help. Get a good sharp Laser or similiar prop and you will be running well. I like the Laser exhaust ports, it gives you some extra rpm on holeshot and would rarely break loose again unless you turned sharp going slower with the trim up. Then you could hammer it and hook up anyway.

I would also think about solid mounts, and plugging the top two water holes. That was my plan, or will be when I mount it to something.

[mikevr007]

Ok! Thanks for the info!!
Well, maybe I can squeeze some more info out...
The prop that was on the motor when I bought the b,m,&t, is a Rapture by Michigan Wheel. It is a cupped SS and is a 13.25x19. I went to the Michigan site and ran through their "prop lookup" for my motor and for a 16'-17' ski boat and they recommended a 13.25x17, and for a 15'-18' ski boat they recommended a 13.25x19...any guesses on how my 13.25x19 is going to perform? Also, my transom is 22". I'm pretty sure that my motor has a 20" LU???(how do I measure that?) if so, does that mean I should put the motor down on the top of the transom so as not to raise it? One more thing...I'm not sure what you mean by set back or how to achieve it. I will research that further on this site so only comment with your opinions on whether or not I should and by how much.
Hey Walter651, I'd like to know how your set up is doing and what size prop you're running.
Thanks again!!

[sho305]

Setback is how far your motor is behind the transom, or how thick your jack plate is. Though you can get setback brackets if you do not need the adjustability of a jack for height. If you ski and want speed too, you will want to change height and prop for each for the best performance, or dial in the best height compromise anyway. The idea is to put the weight of the motor back more so you need less trim to hold up the bow, and then you are not dragging the LU sideways through the water and forcing the transom down into the water to get bow lift-all slowing you down some. For $50-100 you could snag a common 6" jack for example, that would help you out somewhat. Might have to do some re-rigging on the motor is all. It is up to you though.

I'm guessing your boat is a bit lighter, and your motor maybe a hair less power as I think it has lower compression...though I don't know how many hours are on mine either You should be the same or better than mine I think as less weight matters more anyhow. So I guess a 20-21 pitch should get you close to 6k rpm where you want to be, maybe possibly a 22 or 23 if it will pull it. Then a 17-19 for skiing would be good. My 21 aluminum runs the same rpm/speed #s as my 20 laser, I think the laser has better cup. However, try the 19 on it first and see. I would be running 6k+ on mine @19, and over 6k you loose power. Better holeshot for skiing that way though. Michigan Wheels are debatable here, many don't care for them in performance circles. My Laser was highly recommended and a local dealer happened to have one in great shape for $150...so I have it and it was better than the other 6 props I tried. There are other good recommended bow lifters that will work, just never heard Rapture mentioned but I don't know. Make sure you only try good high rake and cupped low lifters, don't think any others will work unless you use massive setback and other mods. These tend to be bassboat props as they need bow lift too usualy. I had to pick through the larger hub I/O and larger hub OB props to find a smaller inline prop. Lots of prop info here, just make sure they are talking about a hull like this, not a lighter hull. You will have to see what rpms you have and go from there.

22" transom, maybe ok on it. My cav plate above the prop is 1-2" above the bottom vee when level, I would guess that is pretty good but you may go a little higher if you have relief in the transom or use setback. Relief being a cutout in the lower transom to make the pad/center hull area farther from the motor at high speed. You can't go too high or the bow lift will go away and standard inlines have no low water pickup anyway. The farther the LU from the pad, the higher it can be. Checkmates are kind of heavy though, so lots of setback and/or bow lift are needed to get them going right typically. Lots of talk here may be about a hydrostream or such, that are lighter and handle differently.

Of course, take out any weight in the boat you don't need, any wet foam if there, move weight to the rear if you can, etc.

Oh, and I also sharpen the leading (cutting) edge of my props a little with a file, maybe 15 minutes and SS cuts hard so not enough material to screw up balance. Not blade sharp, just not blunt. Then I round the leading edges of the LU/skeg that are in the water(not sharpen, round). As all my used boats have had nicks/blunt edges and such here, this has helped performance. Your prop needs to be nearly perfect to perform at speed. I get 1-2 mph from this mod most times, maybe more if it gets the motor at a better rpm.

[mikevr007]

Thanks sho305!
I had done some reading on here last night about setbacks.
My thoughts last night were that the Enticer isn't really that heavy (only about 750#'s) and alot of the loaded weight (not including people) is in or near the back of the boat (battery, fuel tank, tilt pump). I'll try it without a jack plate first unless someone comments on an Enticer that they are successfully running a jack plate on.
I took measurements this morning and the distance from the motor mount clamp where it rests on the transom to the anti-cavitation plate is 20", which will put the plate 2" above the bottom of the boat (pad?), which will put the center of the prop shaft (since I've read people commenting on this measurement) about 5-1/2" below the bottom. Based on what I've read in the Mercury Shop Manual for my motor, and in these forums, I think this set up alone will give me a good all around performance for skiing and speed. Agree?/disagree?.... The only other thing that concerns me about mounting height is what Walter651 said about his setup where he raised his 150 1.5" and his Enticer holds on to corners better. I suspect from what I've read too that that would also help with chine walking at higher speeds
Also, I've read that a cupped prop will act like a higher pitched prop because it slips less? So am I right in thinking that my 19" cupped SS will perform more like a 20"? Anyway, I'm starting to sort all this out!

[mikevr007]

I just thought of something too....
Walter651 said that his 150 is about 85 lbs. heavier than mine. That would affect mounting height too, right?
If that's the case, I'm getting a pretty good feeling that just setting my 150 down on the top of the transom will work well.

[sho305]

Well, putting a heavier motor on will be like more setback in the sense it will raise the bow by weighting the transom, just like when you trim up to weight the transom. So you really need more setback with a lighter motor generaly, to get the same effect by leveraging less motor weight farther back. Every boat is different, just like every prop. The cup will add pitch yes, but regardless the pitch is an estimate and not real. Other brands of the same pitch may or may not run the same rpm. Hopefully the number is good enough for comparison though.

There is a notable difference in a stock type SS and say a Laser prop. The bow lifters will have more rake, and when you see them from the side the blades lean back more. Blades also are not as wide front to rear of each blade. You will see more space between the blades from the rear view. With these props at a stock depth, you can get the bow up quite high with trim from my experience compared to a stock type. I get 4-7mph just there in the trim with the Laser depending on the water/weather. It gets the hull looser, but I am dragging the LU at such angle I am loosing. The setback idea is to make your LU run more level and therefor with less drag. The 3' rooster is cool though.

I would guess the height you are saying would be pretty good if you go transom mount. Mine has holes to raise it some also. I would conceed to an Enticer owner, but all the stuff I seen about Checkmates says setback is good unless you put a V6 on a 15' or less maybe. I am sure it will run good on the transom if you want, just guessing it would run a bit better on a jack and then you could dial the height too. If you can't now, then don't worry about it. I'm just the kind of guy who would rather do it all at once and be done with it/enjoy it....otherwise I just get it the way I want it just before getting the next one; and the new owner gets to enjoy it more than me!

You might just be getting to chine walk speeds at over 50mph. It depends on the pad, or very bottom. It needs to have a flat pad at the point to be more stable. Most Checkmates do not and at higher than 50, mostly 60 I heard, they start getting squirrely and hard to drive. Solid mounts and dual steer a must then. Mine is a full vee, and has one cable though it should not. It drives great but will torque kinda hard at real high trim. The problem is if my fairly new cable was to let go then without the second cable... I'd be in for a ride at 50+. Fact is this heavy hull will not get high enough with this power to get any walk...until I fix that.

A felief will also require less setback. Mine has straight transom from vee to motor clamp like most Checkmates. I want to chop some in when I do it, though not 100% sure on that yet. It would avoid needing over 6-8" of setback like I know it will otherwise.

My hull is different some than the Enticer I think, but not much. It rails around corners though, and I don't know how it could do any better. I does tend to burn off speed quick in sharp turns. I am sure it would be different at higher than 50 speeds. You should be faster some, as mine is 930lb/17'/and a BR. It has a wet transom too.

[mikevr007]

Thanks sho305 for your comments AND your patience!
I have a lot better overall understanding now. I will repost in Tech Talk to see if I can get any Enticer owners to comment. Otherwise, I will mount directly to the transom to get some baseline figures and go from there. I can get the motor on/off pretty easily if I want to add a jack plate later. I'll post some pictures as soon as I get my dig. camera back.
Thanks again!
Mike

[walter651]

OK,I got a little seat time with a few full throttle bursts...heres what she did.60.4mph(gps) at 5800 rpm with a 21in Mirage.This engine is set up with a 1.87 torque master LU.I think the gears in your in-lines are 2.00.The Mirage is supposed to be a good stern drive prop I'm told. Im going to try different ones.I have two stainless props from the 115...but I can't use 'em because my gearcase is 4.75 in dia. and the inline was 4.25.One is a Michigan 21in stock type and it always wanted to grab air...The other is a 20in Laser 2 that I liked much better.I want to try this prop in the large tube version.Some good news ;the chine walking tendancy was definitely reduced with this set up...I wish I'd tried raising up the 115 2 bolt holes before I sold it. That would have put it 1.5in above transom.Too late.Now that I'm more familiar with this unit;my next money is going into a water pressure guage and a jack plate with hyd steering.This could happen soon I'll keep you posted.By the way...make sure you pick up a set back trim tab if you buy a high rake prop or you'll have to turn right around and go back to the dealer as soon as you put your prop on.Also,Mike,I got good info from Merc publication 90-849250.

[sho305]

The inline prop would be like a small hub if it fit

I brought the inline home yesterday! I ran it out in the yard for the first time this year to make sure the carbs don't get nasty. Started right up, ran great. Sure sounds good.... I miss those 6 holers My current 3 banger just don't do it. I had a loose trim line on the pump and it leaked out...what a mess. Check yours. Mine is on the inside of the transom.

I checked and the cav plate is about 1-1.25" above the bottom of the vee. I would guess I could go up a hair more on this hull maybe .5" but need water guage. Mine quit but I just got another. I had it trimmed to where it starts to slip and saw the water getting sporratic from the telltail. That is trimmed way out, where I used the trailer button some. A bad time to hit big wakes too...

I would guess you could go 1" higher no problem as you might need less than max bow lift that I need on this. Plug the top 2 holes. Yes, I cut a chunk out of my trim tab and then got a setback one for $6 or something.

Walter, sounds like it will go nice with a better prop. Huge difference on them with a good raked prop. 60 gps...mmmmm, thats likely 10mph over my 17'. and you have more yet. Is yours a 16 or 17'? the newer hulls are different than mine. Checkmate told me mine would be faster due to the chine"tunnels" and the fact it has no floatation weight. I don't know, but will put floatation in there someplace if I get to doing it up. Also will mod a pad to it somehow for stability with a V6 as mine is a vee. Let me see if I have a bottom pic. Took more with film and don't have yet.

Here is a pic that I changed from the current gold/brown to white like I think I want to paint it. Still working on colors for it. Anyway, you can see how the big chines hang down for a little tunnel of sorts. It is very dry with no splash. Chines are smaller, normal size at rear. The vee you see goes back only getting shallower some, but same vee shape and full strakes to transom. Thinking of some bright met blue stripes or simple designs on the white so far. I used some white only epoxy vc performance w/teflon stuff on my other transom and really like it. The water spoo wipes right off it but sticks to the gel on that boat.

[mikevr007]

Thanks Walter651.
Just so I'm understanding this right....
Your 150 is mounted on the transom, 1.5" off the top. I am assuming your LU is 20". Mine measures 20" from the clamp (where it rests on the transom) to the anti-cav plate. And, 7.625" (approx.) from the anti-cav plate to the CL of the prop shaft. If I raise my 150 up by 1.5" that would put my prop shaft CL about 4" below the bottom of the boat. Also, I can only go up about an inch before my top two holes become useless. Not real keen on that.
FYI, I already have a water pressure gauge.
I read in the Overton's catalog that my Michigan Rapture 13.25x19 prop has alot of rake. I don't know what "alot" of rake is or how to compare.
Walter651, when you get a chance to test will you let me know how that setup pulls? I will be skiing with my Enticer.
Thanks!!!