electric catamaran boat to set world record

[Noah Burns]

I worked on locomotives for a while, they made all kinds of a big deal about how they're "electric" since the trucks are indeed electric motors... they never liked to mention the absolutely massive diesel that it took to provide that electricity on each locomotive. Same for most if not all ships out there today other than those test beds.

Noah what IC motor makes 49,000 HP and is that small, will turn a BIG prop on a BIG ship, not there yet ???

https://indico.cern.ch/event/760666/...s-20190715.pdf

[XstreamVking]

Lot of the greenie sailboats are using electric motors. They found that on the open ocean when there’s no wind that they are stuck. In theory it’s viable. In reality it can be downright dangerous when there’s a reef and no wind. But the batteries are too flat to beat the current.

[PanRonnie]

Link to website about the grid


Can the U.S. infrastructure grid handle electric cars? | Jerry (getjerry.com)

I think Jerry needs a better calculator
i don,t know about america but in the netherlands a house uses about 6 to 8 Kw per day
now the owner buys a tesla S 100 ( 100Kw ) and needs to recharge every 2 days at night when solar is down or a good chance there is less or no wind
god forbid if they have 2 cars per house
now the grid is build for that 6 to 8 Kw per day with some margin but not 10 times as much so not a 10 to 15% increase
still no problem if you are the only one on your block with 2 electric cars but now the everybody needs or wants one or 2
do you see where i am getting at?
ok you go to work hopefully to a warehouse type building with lots of solar panels but if not chances are you will not be able to recharge during the day
i don,t say it can,t be done but everybody will need to get a serious move on and work those african childeren a bit harder to get the Kobalt out

[Noah Burns]

I live in Texas, where mild snow storms or normal heat waves create havoc on the power grid... there is ZERO % chance that our grid currently or any time soon would be able to handle high volumes of ev use. I don't care what any link says, real life experience says otherwise.

Link to website about the grid


Can the U.S. infrastructure grid handle electric cars? | Jerry (getjerry.com)

[PanRonnie]

I wonder how much the batteries weigh. Never saw that anywhere unless I missed it.

A tesla S 100Kw battery Weighs 600 kilogram
Don't think hé has that on board more likley 200 to 300 kilogram

[CUDA]

But you said electric motors have 25 years more development time and they aren't there yet, so I show you a little motor that's to be used by our Navy and you talk about diesel? what about nuclear as in subs, aircraft carriers ?

Our first nuclear sub came out in 1955, 67 years ago,

49,000 HP not bad for a motor the size of a van, show me one IC motor 1/2 that power... Please.

1/4 that power a 10th ?

and no mantaince

• The US Navy’s first full-electric power and propulsion surface combatant, the USS Zumwalt, has been delivered to the US Navy.
• The electric propulsion solution delivers efficiency, survivability, cost-of-ownership reductions, and system redundancy for enhanced vessel safety. In addition, machinery layout is more flexible and configurable.
• As the top integrated electric power and propulsion provider to navies around the world, GE leveraged proven technologies for its innovative full-electric propulsion system and will continue to build on those innovations going forward.

The US Navy has taken delivery of the USS Zumwalt, its first full-electric power and propulsion ship. GE’s Power Conversion business (NYSE:GE) was the designer and provider for the high-voltage system (HV), propulsion drive trains consisting of multiphase converters and Advanced Induction Motors (AIM) for the DDG 1000 class of futuristic destroyers.
“Delivery is an important milestone for the Navy, as the DDG 1000 continues more advanced at-sea testing of the Zumwalt Combat System,” Capt. Kevin Smith, DDG 1000 program manager, said in a Navy statement -”The combat test team, consisting of the DDG 1000 sailors, Raytheon engineers, and Navy field activity teams, have worked diligently to get USS Zumwalt ready for more complex, multi-mission at-sea testing.”
With delivery, the USS Zumwalt continues to execute missions for the US Navy.[/COLOR]
]Power where it’s needed
For navies around the globe, power and energy are mission enablers, according to Kevin Byrne, who leads the North American marine segment for GE’s Power Conversion business. “Because electric power is needed for various operations and mission systems in parallel, this full-electric power and propulsion ship has the flexibility to direct energy where it is needed on the platform,” he said.
]The electric propulsion solution delivers efficiency, cost-of-ownership reductions, and system redundancy for enhanced vessel safety. In addition, machinery layout is more flexible and configurable for containment and isolation.
]Employing GE’s innovative and Integrated Power System (IPS), the DDG 1000 has the capacity to distribute electricity across the entire ship, allowing for enhanced power flexibility for various operational requirements.
Both of GE’s drive trains have two electric motors in tandem. VDM25000 power converters with three independent channels accompany the 15-phase AIM. Each motor drive train can operate on 5, 10, or 15 phases. This provides high redundancy and is more economical when running at lower power. GE’s AIM drive train was selected to meet the requirements of the ZUMWALT Class Destroyer.
]Compact enough for combatant ships and powerful enough for an aircraft carrier, AIM technology has demonstrated its performance over more than two decades on land and at sea for mechanical strength, robustness, very low maintenance, and naval performance requirements. For the full-electric propulsion system, GE leveraged its proven technologies, building from the Naval Surface Warfare Center (NSWC) land-based test site and its own Marine Power Test Facility in the UK, alongside the UK Royal Navy Type 45 program, Byrne explained. “The US Navy gets benefits from our other platforms that we then could apply to the DDG 1000 and future platforms.”
With 72 MW of propulsion power, GE’s Integrated Full Electric Propulsion (IFEP) system comprises all shipboard electrical power generation and propulsion including the propulsion motor, VDM25000 variable speed drives, switchboards, and HV equipment. Offering improved efficiency, the electric drive eliminates the need for the drive shaft and reduction gears and brings benefits in acoustic signature reduction, an increase in available power for operational requirements and improvements in the quality of life for crew. The all-electric propulsion of Zumwalt also generates additional reserved power, allowing the integration of future high-energy defense systems and sensors.
]Recognizing that navies were demanding more energy amidst space constraints, GE has been developing its full-electric propulsion system for decades, Byrne said. With more than 100 electric and hybrid references with 15 navies globally, GE is the top electric propulsion provider to navies around the world.
]Since 2007, GE has been the Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM) for HV system, installation, commissioning and servicing for the US Navy’s three DDG 1000 class vessels. In addition to the USS Zumwalt, the USS Michael Monsoor (DDG 1001) is also home-ported in San Diego and is undergoing combat systems activation. The third and final ship of the class, the future USS Lyndon B. Johnson (DDG 1002), is under construction at Bath Iron Works in Maine.

https://www.gepowerconversion.com/ne...ropulsion-ship

[David - WI]

A lot of misinformation about EV's in this thread. I have driven my Tesla on some 900 mile trips. The most I paid for a Supercharge was about $25. Charging at home is much cheaper. The charging takes about 25-30 min at a supercharger. It does add some time to the trip but it is not the worst. 99% of the use of the car is local. It is cheap to drive, it is really fast and the maintenance is low. No oil changes, brakes last well over 100,000 miles as the car generator charges the car as it slows it down. The grid can handle as much as 80% of the cars on the road being EV. It is the future of the auto market. Look at what direction the auto manufactures are going.

California is warning of blackouts this week... charging electric vehicles is one of the things they are asking people NOT to do, along with setting their AC to 78* and avoiding dishwasher use, etc.

It does not appear that the electrical grid in the state with the highest EV usage is anywhere near capable of supporting more EV's.

Hoping to avoid blackouts, the California Independent System Operator, which manages the state’s power grid, warned Tuesday that it probably will issue a series of Flex Alerts over the next several days. Flex Alerts are voluntary calls for conservation during the afternoon and evening hours, when energy use tends to soar. Residents will be asked to turn up their thermostats to 78 degrees or higher, avoid using dishwashers or other large appliances, and hold off on charging their electric vehicles, all during the 4-9 p.m. time frame.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/weather/to...es/ar-AA11iiB4

[powerabout]

Lot of the greenie sailboats are using electric motors. They found that on the open ocean when there’s no wind that they are stuck. In theory it’s viable. In reality it can be downright dangerous when there’s a reef and no wind. But the batteries are too flat to beat the current.

many have been removed and replaced with std diesels.
The electric will get you out of the marina and thats it.
Some are doing direct coupled hybrid, allows you to tell your greenie friends you have electric drive but you cross oceans on diesel.
There are a very small market of very expensive carbon catamarans that have such a high sailing performance they can regen while sailing.
They can actually cruise all electric and if you sail everyday dont require any gen set.
To get that you are paying in excess of double for a conventional cat of the same size.

Diesel electric like a loco is on many icebreakers as you get very good control.
There are some offshore vessels, rig supply, that are DE, it allows for a boat load of gen sets to start and stop on demand.
This allows the diesel to run at optimum load hence more fuel efficient, cheaper and cleaner to run, but at much highr cost to build.
For some dynamic positioned vessels they have added huge batteries, like 3mw, to support instant load but at huge costs.
It all works in theory but battery tech needs to improve 50x to compete if we take emissions out of the equation.

[CUDA]

The answer IS

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-sta...-nuclear-power

[XstreamVking]

It’s easy to prove that ev’s are a bad idea for the general population to use for transportation. The mere fact of hydrogen being the most abundant element in our world is the obvious answer. We should focus on its production at low cost and using green technology to produce it.

[wettek]

But you said electric motors have 25 years more development time and they aren't there yet, so I show you a little motor that's to be used by our Navy and you talk about diesel? what about nuclear as in subs, aircraft carriers ?

Our first nuclear sub came out in 1955, 67 years ago,

49,000 HP not bad for a motor the size of a van, show me one IC motor 1/2 that power... Please.

1/4 that power a 10th ?

and no mantaince

• The US Navy’s first full-electric power and propulsion surface combatant, the USS Zumwalt, has been delivered to the US Navy.
• The electric propulsion solution delivers efficiency, survivability, cost-of-ownership reductions, and system redundancy for enhanced vessel safety. In addition, machinery layout is more flexible and configurable.
• As the top integrated electric power and propulsion provider to navies around the world, GE leveraged proven technologies for its innovative full-electric propulsion system and will continue to build on those innovations going forward.

The US Navy has taken delivery of the USS Zumwalt, its first full-electric power and propulsion ship. GE’s Power Conversion business (NYSE:GE) was the designer and provider for the high-voltage system (HV), propulsion drive trains consisting of multiphase converters and Advanced Induction Motors (AIM) for the DDG 1000 class of futuristic destroyers.
“Delivery is an important milestone for the Navy, as the DDG 1000 continues more advanced at-sea testing of the Zumwalt Combat System,” Capt. Kevin Smith, DDG 1000 program manager, said in a Navy statement -”The combat test team, consisting of the DDG 1000 sailors, Raytheon engineers, and Navy field activity teams, have worked diligently to get USS Zumwalt ready for more complex, multi-mission at-sea testing.”
With delivery, the USS Zumwalt continues to execute missions for the US Navy.[/COLOR]
]Power where it’s needed
For navies around the globe, power and energy are mission enablers, according to Kevin Byrne, who leads the North American marine segment for GE’s Power Conversion business. “Because electric power is needed for various operations and mission systems in parallel, this full-electric power and propulsion ship has the flexibility to direct energy where it is needed on the platform,” he said.
]The electric propulsion solution delivers efficiency, cost-of-ownership reductions, and system redundancy for enhanced vessel safety. In addition, machinery layout is more flexible and configurable for containment and isolation.
]Employing GE’s innovative and Integrated Power System (IPS), the DDG 1000 has the capacity to distribute electricity across the entire ship, allowing for enhanced power flexibility for various operational requirements.
Both of GE’s drive trains have two electric motors in tandem. VDM25000 power converters with three independent channels accompany the 15-phase AIM. Each motor drive train can operate on 5, 10, or 15 phases. This provides high redundancy and is more economical when running at lower power. GE’s AIM drive train was selected to meet the requirements of the ZUMWALT Class Destroyer.
]Compact enough for combatant ships and powerful enough for an aircraft carrier, AIM technology has demonstrated its performance over more than two decades on land and at sea for mechanical strength, robustness, very low maintenance, and naval performance requirements. For the full-electric propulsion system, GE leveraged its proven technologies, building from the Naval Surface Warfare Center (NSWC) land-based test site and its own Marine Power Test Facility in the UK, alongside the UK Royal Navy Type 45 program, Byrne explained. “The US Navy gets benefits from our other platforms that we then could apply to the DDG 1000 and future platforms.”
With 72 MW of propulsion power, GE’s Integrated Full Electric Propulsion (IFEP) system comprises all shipboard electrical power generation and propulsion including the propulsion motor, VDM25000 variable speed drives, switchboards, and HV equipment. Offering improved efficiency, the electric drive eliminates the need for the drive shaft and reduction gears and brings benefits in acoustic signature reduction, an increase in available power for operational requirements and improvements in the quality of life for crew. The all-electric propulsion of Zumwalt also generates additional reserved power, allowing the integration of future high-energy defense systems and sensors.
]Recognizing that navies were demanding more energy amidst space constraints, GE has been developing its full-electric propulsion system for decades, Byrne said. With more than 100 electric and hybrid references with 15 navies globally, GE is the top electric propulsion provider to navies around the world.
]Since 2007, GE has been the Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM) for HV system, installation, commissioning and servicing for the US Navy’s three DDG 1000 class vessels. In addition to the USS Zumwalt, the USS Michael Monsoor (DDG 1001) is also home-ported in San Diego and is undergoing combat systems activation. The third and final ship of the class, the future USS Lyndon B. Johnson (DDG 1002), is under construction at Bath Iron Works in Maine.

https://www.gepowerconversion.com/ne...ropulsion-ship

Hate to burst your electric dream bubble, but all the electricity is being generated by 2 Rolls Royce gas turbines........

[CUDA]

Yes I read

with a electric motor turning the prop.

[XstreamVking]

What’s the “half. Life” of the spent fission materials again? A thousand years of radioactive materials containment that cannot be safely discarded or neutralized? And once again the raw materials to produce it come from where? Basically using the same destructive means as the lithium for batteries? What’s the biggest fear of nuclear? Natural disasters causing Contamination or it being sabotaged and released into the environment?

[Noah Burns]

I brought up diesels because that is what powers most of those electric motors in big ships. The military one you posted, I have no idea as I have not looked into it at all but it must at the least be self sustaining if they are trusting just electric power to run that ship.

Nuclear is a great option but not even a part of this discussion about electric.

But you said electric motors have 25 years more development time and they aren't there yet, so I show you a little motor that's to be used by our Navy and you talk about diesel? what about nuclear as in subs, aircraft carriers ?

Our first nuclear sub came out in 1955, 67 years ago,

49,000 HP not bad for a motor the size of a van, show me one IC motor 1/2 that power... Please.

1/4 that power a 10th ?

and no mantaince

• The US Navy’s first full-electric power and propulsion surface combatant, the USS Zumwalt, has been delivered to the US Navy.
• The electric propulsion solution delivers efficiency, survivability, cost-of-ownership reductions, and system redundancy for enhanced vessel safety. In addition, machinery layout is more flexible and configurable.
• As the top integrated electric power and propulsion provider to navies around the world, GE leveraged proven technologies for its innovative full-electric propulsion system and will continue to build on those innovations going forward.

The US Navy has taken delivery of the USS Zumwalt, its first full-electric power and propulsion ship. GE’s Power Conversion business (NYSE:GE) was the designer and provider for the high-voltage system (HV), propulsion drive trains consisting of multiphase converters and Advanced Induction Motors (AIM) for the DDG 1000 class of futuristic destroyers.
“Delivery is an important milestone for the Navy, as the DDG 1000 continues more advanced at-sea testing of the Zumwalt Combat System,” Capt. Kevin Smith, DDG 1000 program manager, said in a Navy statement -”The combat test team, consisting of the DDG 1000 sailors, Raytheon engineers, and Navy field activity teams, have worked diligently to get USS Zumwalt ready for more complex, multi-mission at-sea testing.”
With delivery, the USS Zumwalt continues to execute missions for the US Navy.[/COLOR]
]Power where it’s needed
For navies around the globe, power and energy are mission enablers, according to Kevin Byrne, who leads the North American marine segment for GE’s Power Conversion business. “Because electric power is needed for various operations and mission systems in parallel, this full-electric power and propulsion ship has the flexibility to direct energy where it is needed on the platform,” he said.
]The electric propulsion solution delivers efficiency, cost-of-ownership reductions, and system redundancy for enhanced vessel safety. In addition, machinery layout is more flexible and configurable for containment and isolation.
]Employing GE’s innovative and Integrated Power System (IPS), the DDG 1000 has the capacity to distribute electricity across the entire ship, allowing for enhanced power flexibility for various operational requirements.
Both of GE’s drive trains have two electric motors in tandem. VDM25000 power converters with three independent channels accompany the 15-phase AIM. Each motor drive train can operate on 5, 10, or 15 phases. This provides high redundancy and is more economical when running at lower power. GE’s AIM drive train was selected to meet the requirements of the ZUMWALT Class Destroyer.
]Compact enough for combatant ships and powerful enough for an aircraft carrier, AIM technology has demonstrated its performance over more than two decades on land and at sea for mechanical strength, robustness, very low maintenance, and naval performance requirements. For the full-electric propulsion system, GE leveraged its proven technologies, building from the Naval Surface Warfare Center (NSWC) land-based test site and its own Marine Power Test Facility in the UK, alongside the UK Royal Navy Type 45 program, Byrne explained. “The US Navy gets benefits from our other platforms that we then could apply to the DDG 1000 and future platforms.”
With 72 MW of propulsion power, GE’s Integrated Full Electric Propulsion (IFEP) system comprises all shipboard electrical power generation and propulsion including the propulsion motor, VDM25000 variable speed drives, switchboards, and HV equipment. Offering improved efficiency, the electric drive eliminates the need for the drive shaft and reduction gears and brings benefits in acoustic signature reduction, an increase in available power for operational requirements and improvements in the quality of life for crew. The all-electric propulsion of Zumwalt also generates additional reserved power, allowing the integration of future high-energy defense systems and sensors.
]Recognizing that navies were demanding more energy amidst space constraints, GE has been developing its full-electric propulsion system for decades, Byrne said. With more than 100 electric and hybrid references with 15 navies globally, GE is the top electric propulsion provider to navies around the world.
]Since 2007, GE has been the Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM) for HV system, installation, commissioning and servicing for the US Navy’s three DDG 1000 class vessels. In addition to the USS Zumwalt, the USS Michael Monsoor (DDG 1001) is also home-ported in San Diego and is undergoing combat systems activation. The third and final ship of the class, the future USS Lyndon B. Johnson (DDG 1002), is under construction at Bath Iron Works in Maine.

https://www.gepowerconversion.com/ne...ropulsion-ship

[Noah Burns]

you do realize your "electric is better" argument is null when that electric is provided by IC engines don't you?

Yes I read

with a electric motor turning the prop.