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  1. #1
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    Should I give my buyer a full refund on a prop?

    Hello, I would like to hear the opinion from a more unbiased point of view on an issue I have with an eBay sale.

    This is the prop I sold. https://www.ebay.com/itm/374000174059 or it is a Mercury Performance Cleaver Prop 14 X 22P 48-75770-22

    The buyer feels that I should refund him 100% and that he shares no blame in the transaction. I would enjoy hearing your perspective on this issue, I would like to be fair to my buyer, so if this is 100% my fault as he claims, I think I owe him all of his money back. I got this particular prop from R&R prop in las vegas after it closed down.

    Situation:
    Buyers message paraphrased.
    Someone thinned the blades on the prop I sold him and I didn't disclose this. He claims the blades are about 1mm, or 0.040" just back of the leading edge. (see attached picture provided by buyer) He said when he tried to set the leading edges equal, one of the blades cracked. He says he has a garage operated prop shop where he designs racing props. He claims I advertised the prop in good condition, but an excessively thinned prop is not in good condition because it will not last long.


    I'm going to leave out my point of view on this to keep this fair.

    So far, I accepted his return and offered him 2/3s of his money back.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails caliper.jpg  

  2. #2
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    I disagree with giving anything back. 1. the prop was in good used condition with no damage to the blades as you stated. 2. he damaged/cracked the blade, should I say, modifying the good condition prop you sold him to make it "better" or "great" condition. 3. Him stating "an excessively thinned prop is not in good condition because it will not last long" sounds like an opinion and a loaded statement. I say that because what is excessively thinned? what is that exact number? also I can take a caliper and make it say what ever I want depending how I zero it out and take a photo of it to try to scam the seller out of getting my money back after I fudged up and broke something.

    I also just noticed that you posted this at 4:20PM on 4/20/22. You smoking today? LOL
    Last edited by fatlenny; 04-20-2022 at 03:59 PM.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by fatlenny View Post
    I disagree with giving anything back. 1. the prop was in good used condition with no damage to the blades as you stated. 2. he damaged/cracked the blade, should I say, modifying the good condition prop you sold him to make it "better" or "great" condition. 3. Him stating "an excessively thinned prop is not in good condition because it will not last long" sounds like an opinion and a loaded statement. I say that because what is excessively thinned? what is that exact number? also I can take a caliper and make it say what ever I want depending how I zero it out and take a photo of it to try to scam the seller out of getting my money back after I fudged up and broke something.

    I also just noticed that you posted this at 4:20PM on 4/20/22. You smoking today? LOL
    Thanks for your response, wow that is a crazy coincidence! Now I'm wondering if I posted it 22 seconds into the minute.

    Alright, I more or less agree with what your saying, yet at the same time I'm not out to be another eBay scam story. If I can confirm the 1mm caliper measurement on the prop when he returns it do you think that would mean I should be more willing to refund him 100%. I already told him I would give him two thirds of his money back, so I don't mind sticking with what I told him.

    I guess this is the question that I am stuck on, how would a normal prop shop handle this issue?
    1. Would the average prop shop inspect the prop and say "I can try, however if it breaks it is not my fault as the blades are very thin"? (repair at your own risk)

    2. Would the average prop shop have worked on it without inspecting the condition, broke the prop, and not reimbursed the buyer?

    3. Would the prop shop have attempted to repair it thinking it was possible, broke it and then provide a replacement prop because they attempted to repair a prop that could no longer be worked on, or potentially even user error?
    Last edited by ToadServant; 04-20-2022 at 05:10 PM.

  4. #4
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    The prop was in good working order when you sold it to him. He modified it and broke it. This is not really your liability it’s on him. That said the story is somewhat compelling I’d say a fifty fifty split is more than fair so in at 2/3? I’d say your good, S&F good imo.

    heck if it were me I’d be too ashamed to even mention breaking it if I was in his shoes I wouldn’t ask for a thing.
    Hydrostream dreamin

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  6. #5
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    Agreed... if it wasn't what he wanted or thought he was buying, he should have contacted you for a refund before he started beating on it.

    He chose to take a chance on it...that's his money on the line not yours.

    I would have told him to go pound sand.

    Let's just go ahead and make America great again!

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  8. #6
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    If the prop was dimensionally checked which it appears it was and the buyer started to make adjustments knowing the blades according to him were thin, then IMO he just bought it 100%. Had the discussion pertaining to thin blades been had between parties prior to adjustments being attempted, there probably would be a different income.
    I have purchased a few used props and not being a prop guru, I always ask: is it stock, modified, any history, if modified do you know who by etc, etc. I was going to buy a Mercury cleaver sometime ago and it had been modified (thinned) by BBlades so I zoomed in on a photo so as to pull the BBlades number. After calling BBlades Bret said it had been thinned to the owners request which is more that he would have done normally and advised it my not have a long life on my STV... I didn't buy it.

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  10. #7
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    It's a 30+ year old small ear Chopper. He owns it. What did he think he was buying. a brand new prop from Mercury with a guarantee? Ya start bending blades and break it, YOU OWN IT.

    I'd have a LOT more problem with the item description which is totally inaccurate.
    Living in the Freedom provided by Bud Conner and his fellow warriors.
    R.I.P. my Heathen Brother






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  12. #8
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    He worked on a thinned blade and it cracked, then he owns this prop. Had he discussed the thin blades and his not liking it before modifying it then maybe you could return his money but not after. You are being more than fair given the fact that now you have a prop back that has very little value because he tried to modify it.

  13. #9
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    he broke it ..... he owns it... Where's the clever? link is to a Chopper?
    Last edited by GRH; 04-21-2022 at 09:58 AM.

  14. #10
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    he worked on the prop its his

  15. #11
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    It’s his baby now . I would not refund anything . Hf…

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  17. #12
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    Thanks again for all the replies, I feel a bit more confident in my decision. He is very angry at the decision to not give him 100% of his money back which was not my intention. Not sure why he feels insulting my intelligence and ignorance over and over again will help us reach an agreement, it's just making me want to help him less with each message. I can't help but think he is just trying to bully me into giving him what he wants.

    I'm any case, since I have quite a bit of experience selling on eBay, I don't mind sharing some information that will help other sellers from getting scammed by the eBay system. In my opinion, your best bet is getting 50% of your money back with a return to sell for parts.(you also have to be top rated to be able to deduct up to 50%, if your not top rated, your basically screwed.) If you gamble on the case going to eBay and they decide it in the buyers favor, they will not refund you the final value fees, will force you to pay for the return shipping and give the buyer 100% of their money back. When I see an issue on eBay, I just accept the return (even if I don't offer returns and sold it "as is, I know nothing about this item, buy at your own risk) because your not likely to win even that claim. I've lost some of the most sure to win claims on eBay and regretted it while winning only a couple.

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  19. #13
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    Looks to me like he tried to pound on a section of the leading edge to try and roll the edge it a bit without heating the prop first- or adding the roll slowly in several steps. I've got several stainless props- Trophy Plus- that I've worked the leading edge area down to the same 1 mm and rolled the edge with no issues- and a few bronze props from my old Mk55H D-Class merc that are even thinner with the added roll. The way he beat on it looks a bit odd too- because of the way it has cracked. If the blade is too thin I would expect a crack to form 90 degrees away from where the photo shows it's cracked. It looks like he tried to roll a section of the blade and went to far on the first pass, rather than doing it carefully in stages. I would tell the guy that he broke it- so its his problem.

    Oddly, the best running Trophy Plus I have cracked from what looked like an internal casting void when I rolled the leading edge. So....I just cut the blade back 3/8 inch following the original contour, did the same cut to the other 3 blades, and sent it out to a prop shop to re-contour the blades and rebalance it. Prop runs great! Your buyer can do the same thing- but not in his garage seeing the lack of quality and thinking in his work.
    Doug

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  21. #14
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    Ok, i've worked TONS of props and i've apprenticed under one of the best in the business. SMALL EAR CHOPPER, has it been worked before or previous??? Maybe, If i received your prop and it was way thinner than i thought when i got it i would just send it back BEFORE beating on it. Is this a well known prop shop or does he just do **** out of his garage?? does he think he's going to beat a ton of cup in a small ear CHOPPER????? Anyway my answer would be no refund.

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  23. #15
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    Just look at it this way, if you bought a brand new prop from Mercury and measured the blades and thought hmmm they are too thin then started modifying it and cracked a blade what do you think Mercury would say.

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