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Thread: 300R vs 300X

  1. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chaz View Post
    How bout something personal and exciting like ... How many more payments vs month's of wty you have left .. Ppffftttt
    0 payments and about 19 months of warranty left on my 400R, thought I'm not sure why my personal finances are relevant to the discussion.

    The fact is that the future of performance outboards is 4-stroke. Eventually, this forum will either accept that or die a long and slow death. Personally, I've almost given up on S&F for relevant/modern performance outboard technical discussion because the 4-strokes are constantly getting poo-poo'd by the old guard. I hate to admit it, but I am forced to frequent veradoclub, bbc, and oso, as they are at least as useful for me...though each have their own issues. I wonder how many potential forum members are out there like me. Based on the rate that the 300R and 400R are selling, I'd venture to guess that there are thousands of folks who are in my situation as well. This can either be a growth opportunity for the site...or nails in the coffin...

    I personally want to see this site successful in the future and I would love to read about projects pushing the new Merc Racing outboards to their potential and even modifying them....imagine the traffic the site would get if that happened en masse! There are a handful of people trying it and I thank them because that's what will keep this site going for years to come.

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  3. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by engineermike View Post
    0 payments and about 19 months of warranty left on my 400R, thought I'm not sure why my personal finances are relevant to the discussion.

    The fact is that the future of performance outboards is 4-stroke. Eventually, this forum will either accept that or die a long and slow death. Personally, I've almost given up on S&F for relevant/modern performance outboard technical discussion because the 4-strokes are constantly getting poo-poo'd by the old guard. I hate to admit it, but I am forced to frequent veradoclub, bbc, and oso, as they are at least as useful for me...though each have their own issues. I wonder how many potential forum members are out there like me. Based on the rate that the 300R and 400R are selling, I'd venture to guess that there are thousands of folks who are in my situation as well. This can either be a growth opportunity for the site...or nails in the coffin...

    I personally want to see this site successful in the future and I would love to read about projects pushing the new Merc Racing outboards to their potential and even modifying them....imagine the traffic the site would get if that happened en masse! There are a handful of people trying it and I thank them because that's what will keep this site going for years to come.
    +1

    Personally I'm hoping the old guard lives on long enough for me to get top dollar for my 300XS when I repower with a 300R. Of course, at the rate Mercury is delivering them that won't happen until 2020........
    Mark

  4. #123
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    Get your order in now Mark. I just ordered another set and was told Dec.

    Joe

  5. #124
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    I love how the discussions on here always turn into car motor bull**** or finances or political nonsense

  6. #125
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    This ain’t a car site, liberals are the scum of the earth and if you can’t pay to play find a new hobby

  7. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by aggiestckl View Post
    This ain’t a car site, liberals are the scum of the earth and if you can’t pay to play find a new hobby
    Damn Glenn. Did somebody piss in your Cheerio's this morning. You almost made me hang my head in shame and walk away. My Burger King asst managers pay does not stretch into the afford to play category. But i can fake it well with some used hand me down parts.

  8. #127
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    Didn’t a guy come over from Porsche to help develop the 400R? And I thought Mercury Racing used an automotive block for their SB4? It makes ~1.75hp/ci @8k rpm from it’s 11.7:1 DOHC V8 with pump gas, so using some ricer math the 4.6L could become a production 500R or there’s always the aftermarket. Has anyone heard of a ROS version of the V8 coming?

    Most all of us are on this website are here because we’re performance enthusiasts in one regard or another, lost a buddy Friday who swerved to avoid hitting a car that pulled out in front of him while tuning 2k hp customer’s car for upcoming event to try and best it’s 186mph 1/4 and 237mph 1/2 mile speeds.
    https://www.dallasnews.com/news/traf...ini-police-say

  9. #128
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    The problem with using hp/cid as a metric for boat motors is that with only 1 gear the engine has to have a very broad usable power range and WOT-for-hours-on-end reliability. The SB4 is only making ~65% of peak torque at 2500 rpm and I don't think designed for constant WOT use for 2000 hours. We all know that production cars are making 100+/- hp/liter NA, the SB4 as well. But without the advantage of supercharging, 4-stroke boat motors are making 50-70 hp/liter due to the criticality of low-end torque and reliability reasons. VVT and multiple forward gears can help the situation. Note that cars seem to be around 100 hp/liter now in high performance production applications, but street bikes (where low-end torque and longevity are ess critical than a sports car, even) are making double that. I'll be surprised if we see NA 4-stroke boat motors making more than 75 hp/liter without a significant change in technology.

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  11. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by engineermike View Post
    The problem with using hp/cid as a metric for boat motors is that with only 1 gear the engine has to have a very broad usable power range and WOT-for-hours-on-end reliability. The SB4 is only making ~65% of peak torque at 2500 rpm and I don't think designed for constant WOT use for 2000 hours. We all know that production cars are making 100+/- hp/liter NA, the SB4 as well. But without the advantage of supercharging, 4-stroke boat motors are making 50-70 hp/liter due to the criticality of low-end torque and reliability reasons. VVT and multiple forward gears can help the situation. Note that cars seem to be around 100 hp/liter now in high performance production applications, but street bikes (where low-end torque and longevity are ess critical than a sports car, even) are making double that. I'll be surprised if we see NA 4-stroke boat motors making more than 75 hp/liter without a significant change in technology.
    Yes a way to go before they get to 150hp/ltr ish and get a boat on the plane with one gear like an old school Merc Drag 300/champ/f1 engine
    or e-tec sled engine 200hp/ltr
    that was in the light and small days now it seems heavy and big is the trend or should I say the only choice?
    Or is smart marketing, sell an engine that everyone thinks is programmed wrong so your mate can double the hp with a flash??
    Last edited by powerabout; 06-11-2019 at 09:53 PM.

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  13. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by engineermike View Post
    0 payments and about 19 months of warranty left on my 400R,
    thought I'm not sure why my personal finances are relevant to the discussion.

    It appears to have added three words of personal experience to your 400R story .. before you went back to your we're not good enough for you rant.

    The fact is that the future of performance outboards is 4-stroke. Eventually, this forum will either accept that or die a long and slow death. Personally, I've almost given up on S&F for relevant/modern performance outboard technical discussion because the 4-strokes are constantly getting poo-poo'd by the old guard. I hate to admit it, but I am forced to frequent veradoclub, bbc, and oso, as they are at least as useful for me...though each have their own issues. I wonder how many potential forum members are out there like me. Based on the rate that the 300R and 400R are selling, I'd venture to guess that there are thousands of folks who are in my situation as well. This can either be a growth opportunity for the site...or nails in the coffin...
    I have to hand it to you. You have come to the conclusion the future of performance is 4 strokes. Did you use charts, graphs, market trends .. or did someone just say , hey numb-nutz , BRP is the only one sellin a big 2 stroke , and they might not can hold out much longer .. either way, a brilliant deduction ..
    Sooo Mr. pocket protector, you have a motor that your afraid to touch for the next 19 months, yet somehow you want the writer and readership of this site as well as the aftermarket to cater to you, the guy who is not going to buy more than a prop or two .. before you trade your motor in on another one your afraid to touch.

    I personally want to see this site successful in the future and I would love to read about projects pushing the new Merc Racing outboards to their potential and even modifying them....imagine the traffic the site would get if that happened en masse! There are a handful of people trying it and I thank them because that's what will keep this site going for years to come.
    Becoming a supporting member is a good way to start. Of course, that would require one to put his money where his mouth is . The next logical step would be to further lead by example with all the wonderful parts you have built for the 400 verado. Personally, I built a stainless header and parts towards a 15" mid-section for one . Rick George was funding the project, when he passed away I turned my work order, time card, materials receipts, jigs, fixtures and parts. I was cut a check and that was the end of that .. It could be in some corner of a shop , it could be getting worked on as we speak. If it's being worked on, do you think the investor would say .. gee , I really think we should post what we learned the hard way .. so Mikey will be amused for many evenings to come. In the real world, if someones going to bring something to market, they will throw a few hints, go fishing a few times. if there is interest in the bait. they will make a run of parts , do some testing .. and offer them for sale when they are ready to throw in the Fed-Up truck ..

    Chaz = thinkin , is that crickets .. in the supporting member and tech from Gone-zo-La. I'm ~a~hearin ..
    ________________________________________________________________

    J.P.

    Chaz = wunderin , is there any interest in a 15" bucket~n~ can fer ah 300R .. ???

    Chaz = beginin to like the looks of them ugly ******** ..






    From the inside - out, of course ..

  14. #131
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    Thanks for even further proving my point by turning it into a personal attack.

    Don’t worry....I won’t retaliate....I said my part. I think on some level you know I’m right.

  15. #132
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    No sir , no attack . Just pointing out the obvious .

    Like I said we're all friends here , and if you see something I said that isn't true , then I will take it back or apologize .. But just because it might be a bitter pill to swallow don't make it not true ...

  16. #133
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    It’s against my better judgement, but I’ll bite on that. You said I’m afraid to touch my motor for another 19 months because it’s under warranty. Why would you assume that about me? Maybe it’s true; maybe not. After all, I do daily drive a 2018 mustang 5.0 with a supercharger that I installed years before the warranty was out. What’s the difference? Well there’s a great mustang forum where the new technology is embraced and people start tinkering with them and sharing results literally the day they hit the showrooms. I don’t want to be THE pioneer, but I will be an early adopter when I can read about what the pioneers did and learn from them.

  17. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by engineermike View Post
    It’s against my better judgement, but I’ll bite on that. You said I’m afraid to touch my motor for another 19 months because it’s under warranty. Why would you assume that about me? Maybe it’s true; maybe not. After all, I do daily drive a 2018 mustang 5.0 with a supercharger that I installed years before the warranty was out. What’s the difference? Well there’s a great mustang forum where the new technology is embraced and people start tinkering with them and sharing results literally the day they hit the showrooms. I don’t want to be THE pioneer, but I will be an early adopter when I can read about what the pioneers did and learn from them.
    Sure, people being doing that forever, sometimes it even helps the factorys r&d

  18. #135
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    A 2018 Mustang years before the wty expired ... Psstt , it's mid 2019 by my calendar. It's ok , I'm not good with dates and times either ...

    Jim Jordan has long since passed away . But his daughter still runs QA-1 shocks / Rod end's / Suspension components. You would have to ask her how many Mustang parts I developed and that I built for them in
    lots of 100 at a time
    during and after the AVO/HAL shock, QA-1 merger. K members, motor mounts, caster/ camber plates, adjustable upper housing bars, and others that escape me now.

    Two things I can assure you of :
    Not a word of it was "leaked to "Super Ford Magazine" until it was ready to be stocked on Jegs and Summits shelves.
    Every bit of it is made in China now.

    BTW ...
    Have ya noticed, buiz is "BOOMIN" in the 400R -300R HP thread ...

    On a personal note ...
    My apologies, for some reason I thought you might be a leader .. not a follower of the "me too" movement ...

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