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Thread: What's wrong

  1. #31
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    there was a great statistic from OZ the other day, although low unemployment and a very high percentage of taxpayers, 50% of them net zero with the gov due to subsidies, like child care etc etc.

  2. #32
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    All I can say is, Around here in MIchigan everyone who wants to work has a job. Been a long time since I could say that.

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  4. #33
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    TLDR......nice cut and paste.....and it's "allowed".

  5. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by CUDA View Post
    Some form of welfair Huh
    you see this is how you twist the Truth...

    I have paid into SS my whole life, the max many years as well as my Wife now since I'm turning 65 I'm going on Welfair?
    Well let me tell you I could have invested that SS money alot better since I'm going to be on welfair.
    Social Security is a form of welfare, plenty of people are collecting SS without ever putting a dime into the system; kids and agults with disabilities, older migrants, older illegal migrants etc..... if you want to think of welfare as sucking off the governments' teat, your'e wrong. Where do you think that money comes from? The money earners. It comes from our taxes. Everyone who works has a right to be pissed how the government is handling our money.

    Oh and all those charts you posted on how well the economy did with the dems in charge, well, remember, Obimbo started with the economy still falling then finally hit rock bottom, it had nowhere else to go but up. But he held it back with all his restrictive policies. Trump took over and the economy took off. The day he was elected, the stocks volume skyrocketed..... The libs love to tax the hell out of us, they want to take your money and give it to people who refuse to work (just ask AOC)
    "One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors". Plato .

  6. #35
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    [QUOTE=flabum1017;3118085]Social Security is a form of welfare, plenty of people are collecting SS without ever putting a dime into the system; kids and agults with disabilities, older migrants, older illegal migrants etc..... if you want to think of welfare as sucking off the governments' teat, your'e wrong. Where do you think that money comes from? The money earners. It comes from our taxes. Everyone who works has a right to be pissed how the government is handling our money.

    SOME may consider what you say to be correct, however as being one who paid in my whole working life for my SS Retirement.
    I and Others Like me ARE different than those who are receiving a "hand out" coming from (MY/OUR) money out of SS without paying in.

    It's NOT an entitlement either....hear that some too, and I wish we had a say in who gets what as far as hand outs. Some of those folks May need a hand UP and NOT a hand out.....Bet there are many more getting the hand out than the hand up.

    I'm guessing your not of retirement age yet....jmo
    James H. W2F a V-King... Want 2 Fly a V-King

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  7. #36
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    [QUOTE=W2F a V-King;3118090]
    Quote Originally Posted by flabum1017 View Post
    Social Security is a form of welfare, plenty of people are collecting SS without ever putting a dime into the system; kids and agults with disabilities, older migrants, older illegal migrants etc..... if you want to think of welfare as sucking off the governments' teat, your'e wrong. Where do you think that money comes from? The money earners. It comes from our taxes. Everyone who works has a right to be pissed how the government is handling our money.

    SOME may consider what you say to be correct, however as being one who paid in my whole working life for my SS Retirement.
    I and Others Like me ARE different than those who are receiving a "hand out" coming from (MY/OUR) money out of SS without paying in.

    It's NOT an entitlement either....hear that some too, and I wish we had a say in who gets what as far as hand outs. Some of those folks May need a hand UP and NOT a hand out.....Bet there are many more getting the hand out than the hand up.

    I'm guessing your not of retirement age yet....jmo
    I agree with you in that for retirees who have worked their whole life, SS is not an entitlement, but for many others who receive it but never put in a dime, it is an entitlement. I personally know several people getting SS without ever having worked, one is a 24 year old girl with mental diabilities, been lie that from birth. She gets housing allowance, SNAP (food stamps) free medical and dental and $600 a month from SS, plus her mom gets $400 a month as primary care taker. The system is broken to the point SS is being doled out as an entitlement. And it's at the point where you and I cannot depend on it for retirement, we have to have other means of income to retire.
    "One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors". Plato .

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  9. #37
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    Yes, those are entitlement's, and Should be funded another way!
    Pulled from something other than SS.

    How were these circumstances handled before SS? Charities...Churches, etc....
    Once the thieving swamp politicians ( Dems AND Rep )cracked the SS funds, it was like a keg party....wasn't long till all the other rats helped to float the keg.

    Needs to go back to BYOB....nobody would go without beer either.
    James H. W2F a V-King... Want 2 Fly a V-King

    Dedicated Site for Hydrostreams >> http://hydrostreamforums.com/
    My Project 1979 V-King restore >> http://hydrostreamforums.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=2761

  10. #38
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    Yeah, no such thing as family taking care of their own.... throw it on the government (everyone who works for a living) to support their family members who cannot work........
    "One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors". Plato .

  11. #39
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    The bond King had some interesting comments the other day for anyone paying attention. I still stand by my opinion that the only REAL problem is the debt and deficit crisis to which I suggested numerous times the only REAL solution is simple; we draft laws to wrangle it into control and eventually to submission but alas this simple policy seems lost on those chasing a daily headline or is it hair line?

    Regardless the Bond Kings position is the only possible alternative to submitting the debt into complete retirement. What the Bond King failed to say ( at least what I read ) is the money NEEDS to get into the consumers hands. This is the single most important criteria to supporting domestic manufacturing; the people working within a given nation and economy NEED TO BE ABLE TO PURCHASE THE GOODS BEING PRODUCED or there literally is NO economy. Zip, nada, zero.

    Like manure, cash in piles is rotten, stinky, and totally useless but spread out on fields will yield impressive crops. The goal is REAL cash flow that is not based on credit which is REAL consumer power which is a REAL powerful economy. Credit fuel is always going downwards, or should I say time vs growth in a backwards relationship so there is no growth only pending crisis.

    Otherwise that third option? Is likely to make the last recession look like a tremor to an earthquake
    Last edited by LakeFever; 03-10-2019 at 02:27 PM.
    Hydrostream dreamin

  12. #40
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    one wonders since we all got off the gold standard that Capitalism hasnt become a ponzi scheme

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    Not at all. Gold is also basically FIAT it was merely the first mainstream accepted trade object vs tangibles like products, food, labor. The core trouble we all ran into with Gold is a single dollar today based on the Gold standard would value out at such tiny amounts of gold it would be ridiculous and put golds price out of reach for the so many other practical uses that gold is required for. Cel phones, computers, nav systems super high end transmission conduits etc. All would be adversely affected by gold standard, not to mention we would have sooooooo much more Earth excavation going on to try and fill the void of gold with more more more so these sensibilities brought an end to the Gold standard.

    The only issue is actually quite simple. It all boils down to percentages. When you examine the amount of currency currently required simply to service the current debt, and the deficit increases annually the piece of each dollar that is actually USABLE in the real economy is so small and declining rapidly. I wont bore you with the endless math but the multiplier effect which turns one dollar into 20 or 30 quite easily is working backwards against us at the moment where one dollar is turning into 50 cents, then a quarter and quite quickly because of debt leverage and deficit inflation. I use the term deficit inflation because its not like typical inflation where the money is flowing so well that it reduces value through supply and demand instead its reducing value against the percentage of each dollar that represents usable currency against its debt position.

    It's and interesting result of Keynes that i dont believe was anticipated and the CB's of the world continue to wish to increase rates to curb the effect but are stuck against gov't policy that needs to borrow more and more to make ends meet. In the middle between these two is where the percentages need to sum out to a solid footing and to that you can either flood more debt fuel ( quantative easement LOL what a term ) into the economy ( this needs to go in as personal income growth or it wont work btw ) to increase the usable cash flow positions against the debt or you can bind debt increases as I mentioned earlier to curb the effect and slowly work out of it. Option 1 is filled with risk and uncertainty which presents great opportunity for those who can get in front of it, yet filled with great losses for those who get under it. Option 2 while boring is certainly controllable and stable and wont put anyone under and thats why its my preference.


    Its all about percetanges and they only go from 0-100 so it is fairly easy no matter who says different or brags up complexity thats hogwash. Every economic model operates on the fundamentals of percentages.
    Last edited by LakeFever; 03-11-2019 at 09:07 AM.
    Hydrostream dreamin

  14. #42
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    You see the problem with the Federal Reserve Right?
    NO reason for us to "borrow" money from an outside source (global banks), NOT part of the Government. When all they are doing is printing the $$ and loaning that to us With interest.
    This is what dilutes the value of the dollar for us. There are provisions in the constitution for Congress to create and move currency into OUR country, and backed by gold and silver.

    The Gold we Used to have to back our "notes" have been sold to these banks over time to these banks. Like the controlled sheep we are, we sold gold to them for paper "notes".

    When the SHTF, the one with the gold runs the world....And these bankers have banks in most all the world, Not in Venezuela yet.. they have been trying to....Wonder why there is turmoil in Venezuela for the past years???
    James H. W2F a V-King... Want 2 Fly a V-King

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    I cannot argue the problems with central bank policy but its not something now that would be of any benefit to simply shut down so while the accounting principals are currently a very challenging problem to work through the overall benefit to our world from using credit fuel has certainly been realized. So much real world production has happened because of easy access to credit backed by gov't positions its really difficult to simply look at the one problem this has caused and say "theres this debt issue so the whole thing is garbage and we should stop it now"

    The shift happened in the 70's when the big tranche games started and we saw paper shuffling DOMINATE the global wealth growth. The appetite for MORE was certainly present and no one put a gun to peoples heads and said take on this debt, or else. People welcomed it and now we here in this time are holding the results of these "get now pay later" policies and desires. So how to repair and improve this issue is todays BIG issue.

    There are three options, 1 pay the debt; safe and boring, 2 pour more QE into the economy; risky and opportunistic, 3. shut down CB policy; disaster that will certainly lead to a BAD outcome.

    Choose one. If you have any other ideas I and the entire WORLD are ALLLLLLLLLLLL ears, eyeballs and brain cels. I am far from the only person thinking on solving todays big issue. Rest assured there will be an endless supply of the worlds BIG issues they never stop. The issue I see with most people is once they can grasp todays big issue they seem to think they can solve it all by ELIMINATING the problem altogether. Think AOC types, sooooooooo short sighted and filled with falacy.

    We need to respectfully educate these ones on LADDERING up disenfranchised individuals instead of HARMING THOSE WHO HAVE ALREADY LADDERED THEMSELVES UP by taking away future ladders. Soooooooooo dumb, literally insane.
    Hydrostream dreamin

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    I believe the banking ( federal reserve and the world banks involved ) is the main issue, and ending that would be a great thing. Any chaos could be over come.
    It's not just the central banks, it's the central banks controlled by these international banks. I think there is only a few of "any concern" that they don't have control of ...yet. Venezuela and Iran may be the last. Has a lot to do with the petrol dollar as well. We could go on for a long time.

    Hmmmm, is there any current issues with these two countries in the news?

    Deflect, Deny, Destroy....for them the ends justify the means.

    So I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this, I'm not a long typer.

    There are many ways to pay off the debt. Those could be implemented easily, but the ones in control would lose leverage that way. jmo...
    James H. W2F a V-King... Want 2 Fly a V-King

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    I agree that the leverage is a tool and a big enough lever can move the world. This is why the simple choice that is still up to the people to push for locking up deficit policy and pay whats owed is the easiest and safest way to gain control back over liberty. Its so easy in fact, it only requires time + commitment. Any wonder why divorce is rampant and drug abuse is out of control?

    Its the mind set of the average person we need to focus on and assist by helping them to clear minds and a future that is a net benefit instead of a net loss. While W2F you are correct we could overcome any chaos, its only the price we must pay for it that I am interested in minimizing. Leveling the CB's in entirety would cause uncontrollable chaos. The world would turn into a UFC type event that has no clear opponent. I dont see the net benefit because its a short term gain that comes with long term pain. Its this precise mind set that led us to this time and situation and its this mind set we need to remedy. There is no easy solution but to be clear on option 2 flooding more QE out? So long as this is delivered in a manner that goes directly to the consumer/tax payer and skips the banks? This also can balance out the percentage concerns we have with debt inflation. Once those percentages are lined out we MUST restructure the tax intake to both promote growth, AND reduce the debt. This serves the CB's interests quite well and will get the economy rolling like a steam engine compared to a horse.

    Its the reckless opportunists who can mess it up though. We dont need more people wired on dope and all silly things. We need people to build equity and have plenty of extra cash to buy the shiny pretty things at will to really get the economy rolling again. If all we do is provide barely enough cash flow for people to survive? There is no money to spend on economic innovation and growth. This is why the corporate welfare is so hot right now and the subsidy game is running strong. This is a stupid move because it risks the governments health into a few small baskets that we still dont know if the consumer base even wants. The gov't NEEDS to get out of the subsidy game asafnp and we need the consumers to drive the market and let the corps take all the risks, AND receive the rewards that come along with consumer support. This is such a massively better way to go and will improve moral BIG TIME.

    Goals; equity growth, AND plenty of play money too. This is the end game goal for anyone with a half ounce of brains whos interested in a good strong economic future. Stocks and commodities will love it too. Theres really no downside to a super good economy. I also think if people mostly focused on their own lives instead of everyone elses this would naturally start occurring.
    Hydrostream dreamin

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