Rip , mercury killed off all 2 stroke engines 4-1-18

[powerabout]

BRP can make two strokes, Mercury chooses not to. How is that the fault of the EPA?

I have seen the air in Shanghai. Some level of air quality regulation is good.

I will miss two strokes, more in theory than reality. Not selling mine.

The air in Shanghai is clean these days, 99% of motorbikes in Shanghai are electric

[David]

I was in Shanghai 2 years ago. Sunny days were foggy. Even then most of the bikes were electric and the cars were mostly new. Actually everything I saw was new, cars, buildings, roads...

Clean already? Shows what a dictatorship can accomplish quickly.

[powerabout]

I was in Shanghai 2 years ago. Sunny days were foggy. Even then most of the bikes were electric and the cars were mostly new. Actually everything I saw was new, cars, buildings, roads...

Clean already? Shows what a dictatorship can accomplish quickly.

I heard they pushed all industry out, Bejing the same, almost..

[David - WI]

If Mercury had continued development of their two-stoke outboards we would all be sitting here laughing about these four-stroke turds right now.

A 4L Optimax V8 would make 330hp+ and with some modern (1980's) tech like variable exhaust valves and adjustable intake tract tuning could match or exceed the torque curve and fuel economy of the four-stroke for a lot less money. It could've probably used existing stock 3L pistons, rings, rods, reed blocks, injectors, coils, etc; which would have kept the upfront development cost down besides.

(And the four-stroke still uses oil, just all at once when it's time for average Joe Boater to pay $$$ someone to change it.)

The weenie-whackers at Brunswick are just 20 years out-of-step with the rest of the powersports industry! LoL

​YAMAHA UNVEILS TWO-STROKE MOTOCROSS MODELS FOR 2019


http://racerxonline.com/2018/06/06/y...odels-for-2019

[mjw930]

Y'all are really missing the point. Mercury builds what the majority of their customers say they want, it's more about that than any EPA regulations or motor technology. While there's a few dozen here who are vocal the reality is the mass market wants these modern 4 strokes for their quiet, reliable power. If the boating community wanted new 2-strokes then that's what would have been announced.

Don't blame Mercury, blame your fellow boat owners.

[powerabout]

KTM Euro 4 spec/EPA 2 stroke bikes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rcLe5mxGUOk

[David]

Mercury lost sight of who they are. I wish they were stubborn like Honda in the oval cylinder Grand Prix bike era. At 500 cc for two or 4 strokes, with a maximum of 4 cylinders, 2 strokes ruled. Honda came up with oval Pistons with 8 valve per cyl and two rods per cyl. It was not enough to run with the 4 strokes. Glorious failure, and Honda did it because they were at the core a 4 stroke engine company.

mercury's core is probably making money, but I wish they were like Honda was. Good thing for the shareholders that I have no influence.

[engineermike]

Many years ago I remember someone bragging about how the mustang cobra's 4.6 dohc made more power/cid than the 5.7 liter lt4. Meanwhile, the lt4 made more power, more torque, was smaller, lighter, and cheaper than the 4.6. My point? Who cares about power/displacement as long as the power, torque, cost and weight are good?

Of course a 4-stroke needs more displacement or boost to be competitive....it has half the power strokes per revolution. You can't even really compare the two on a like-for-like displacement basis.

[powerabout]

If the multi-engine cc fishing boats are the market it doesnt matter whats on the back
Its just power.
If its single engine then its all the factors, weight performance etc.

I still think the japs dropped 2s as they had zero modern technology to make them clean.
We are all using either german or aussie technology in clean 2s today

[DoktorC]

If the multiengine cc fishing boats are the market it doesnt matter whats on the back
Its judt power.
If its single engine then its all the factors, weight performance etc.

I still think the japs dropped 2s as they had zero modern technology to make them clean.
We are all using either german or aussie technology.

The yamaha hpdi was as clean as opti and they had cat's on 2-stroke bikes and pwc's. It's simple economics...they build what sells and in the case of yamaha they already had far more money in 4-stroke R&D due to their bikes and automotive....so why bother with a tiny market segment who buy used ultra-light 2-strokes??

[powerabout]

The yamaha hpdi was as clean as opti and they had cat's on 2-stroke bikes and pwc's. It's simple economics...they build what sells and in the case of yamaha they already had far more money in 4-stroke R&D due to their bikes and automotive....so why bother with a tiny market segment who buy used ultra-light 2-strokes??

so the new Yamaha dirt bikes are being introduced because?

[Jamie Nichols]

so the new Yamaha dirt bikes are being introduced because?

The press shows them off every year even though they are out dated vs the new 4 strokes.

[powerabout]

The press shows them off every year even though they are out dated vs the new 4 strokes.

yes not EPA compliant bikes like the KTM

[DoktorC]

so the new Yamaha dirt bikes are being introduced because?

Good point...but they aren't "new" and yamaha likes racing motorcycles so there are probably 2 guys that love smokey YZ's that keep the program alive lol. They still make carbed 2-stroke outboards too...just not for this market.

[powerabout]

yes its race only.
Yam still sell carby standup jet ski in usa but race only.
The epa has a process to allow this.