new toy has 707hp

[FORBESAUTO]

That stinks Dave! But you’ll get it back together and be even better! You’ll just have to put extra time in flippin them burgers. Might just get ya another good block, and with the help from one of the most talented in the business (Uncle Chaz) doing tha machining and good parts build exactly what ya want the way ya want it.

[davemvegas]

Davie , you know darn good and well you don't want no "stock replacement"

Get one of these and hide it under your desk

http://www.shophemi.com/p-1840-late-model-hemi-big-bore-aluminum-block.aspx

After a few more of them Burger King dividend checks

http://www.molnartechnologies.com/cranks-dom-chrysler.htmlhttp://www.molnartechnologies.com/rods-dom-chrysler.html

Diamond pistons products page 117

http://www.diamondracing.net/

Let me know when you get the heads off ..
My favorite trick was the broken valve that beat around a while before turning sideways and finally coming to rest halfway up the intake port ...

Charlie i thought you were the guy to do better background checks on dealing with a vendor.

First thing i did last week after stumbling on that inviting website. Was to use our latest tool to check on that shops reputation. The tool of choice is facebook for me. No new post since late 2017. More checking revealed some talk of company being sold. That does not make sense considering why would someone buy a company then go into hiding. I did get a return call from what i think is either the guy that owned Arrington or worked there. I have the impression that now it a one man operation in a bay somewhere. So the feeling is i wont be forwarding one of my not quite maxed out credit card numbers to him.

Aluminum block (Again i expect more research from you) Is a earlier 6.1 block that does not have the oiling for the magic variable cam timing. I think that is a big part of modern horsepower. The PCM having the ability to advance cam up to 12 degrees to get 4800lbs moving. Then roll cam to 10 degrees retard to raise power 1000 rpm past cam specs in fixed cam timing application. So as of now the only solid plan i have after 40 hours of interwebbing. Is i want crank with 3.900 stroke, 6.150 +\- rod length. I dont want wrist pin so high that rings are pushed up to hot zone. Molnar sounds kind of eagle or scat quality. I have not researched that brand yet. I have the tried and true Callies crank and Oliver rods on my mind. Application and price might lead me to Scat and eagle as the winner. The aftermarket cranks may still be a deal considering the ones i have looked at at the 2.100 smallblock chev rod size. sbc rods open up to many options for off the shelf lengths and brands. Money saved on rods spent on quality crank is a direction i will look into.

[2jz]

From the many shops that have shortblocks listed online. I really had not considered needing a $4,500 shortblock that much of a issue. That changed fast when i actually tried to click the buy button. All not exactly same, but all have similar fine print. 4500...click..popup option box. Upgrade rods? click..new total 5400. ok...click..another popup option...upgrade pistons?..click...new total..6000..click..Can i interest you in a crankshat upgrade?...No..I will go with the 6k total...Core option..Will you be sending your core in for inspection? Or do want to pay 2800 core now? Pay core now...new total is 8800. Pay 8800 your motor will ship in 7 to 10 days. Send you core in for inspection. If all parts are in new condition and better quality then the one you bought from us. We will credit you back half of the 2800 core charge. Is there anything else we can ram up your ass today? ....No i am good..I will have to make this decision at a later date. Thank you for the dose of reality on my situation.

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?m...2F392172055152

[Chaz]

Well Davie it's like this ...

****book, yes I have an account. It's a great place to read out in left field, one-liners. I'll let you dig thru the mire for useful information.

Chrysler Corp, you got a funny little star or a capital M. And of course FuPM
Not much else to pick from ..

Aluminum block, my first thought was as LS from Second Chance
Dart, Brodix, CN, Donovan, NOoooPpppeeee
I seen that capital M, figured you was stuck there ..
Good dealer from bad ... I don't know, thought you was lucky to find a block with an M

Scat, I built a 406 plopped it in my vette. Drove it for a year. My kid turned 16, threw him the keys .. if he didn't grenade it I'd have to say their stuff is pretty good.

Molnar, If you call Oliver and ask them who was the owner / engineer who developed their line of rods, wrote the CNC programs and set up the machines before being bought out , they will say Tom Molnar.
If you call the Wiseco conglomerate and ask them where their K-1 line of cranks and rods came from, they will tell you they bought out Tom Molnar.
When Oliver had a recall on a series of rod bolts, even though I wasn't the original customer, and he no longer owned/ worked there, he got me a new set.
When I wanted 3.0L rods built, we spoke in great detail on something that he does not build, nor have the proper machinery to build. But spent his time and knowledge of the subject on a project that he knew he would never see a dime of.
Next car type motor I build, will have his crank and rods inside.

I have to warn you ... he's a torque to angle kind of guy ..

[davemvegas]

That lead me to a 2 hour online ride. That shortblock is built with a 6.4 ABG truck block. All stroke small bore. Opposite of what a boosted motor needs. Long stroke small bore is high torque low HP plan. 15lbs makes torque, Do not need added stroke and sacrifice rod angle, rod length, and wrist pin up into ring lands. Hellcat 6.2 is 3.590 stroke (approx) 4.090 bore 376 CI. 6.4 is 4.050 stroke x 3.790 bore 392 CI (approx) I may be off a little on specs. I have read to many combinations to keep a clear head. And there is still reference to possible core requirement before checkout is complete.

The real cluster f*c* on the Ebay shortblock is a long read. Ebay seller is Steve White Motors, Steve White is a Dodge Dealer. Click on Steve White Dodge parts link to shortblock. Detail page states built by outside vendor with quality parts and precision machine work. A2 Speed is the Vendor. Now i think why buy motor from Dodge dealer, if i can buy direct from A2 Speed. Now i click on A2 Speed website. And they are proud to post that all short blocks and long blocks are built by outside vendor with quality parts and precision machine work. The vendor used is Ray Barton Racing. Now why buy from A2 Speed instead of going to the source, Ray Barton Racing? Trail goes dead other then Ray Barton Racing is active on facebook winning the factory drag class with LS power in a Camaro. A lot of talk about his motor building skills on LS and also Hemi gen III motors. But all web links are to a let us build you a great web page for your business link. Takes a lot of time to get info on best option with limited cash for a motor that i have no experience with. Actually i never seen a 6.2 hellcat motor until i bought my car a year ago. I do feel i will have a good grip on the subject of Hemi 6.2 soon. I could not hardly turn a computer on a few years ago. In the last 6 months i have gone so deep in the settings that Microsoft shot a couple of intimidating popups about my licences to use windows 10. I have no authorization to write or alter the software itself. If you want to get to the tuning area of windows 10. Just enter cmd run as administrator in bottom left of screen. In search box. When a neat black screen appears. type ipconfig/all and the fun begins.

[davemvegas]

I am now more educated on Molnar brand. I agree it seems like Molnar crank and rods are quality parts at reasonable price. MX has a video on Mahle pistons being the best for Hellcat build. The video states that Mahle is OEM piston supplier for the 6.2. Claims many hours of engineering to develop the best piston available. After another all nighter on the web. I am leaning toward Molnar 3.790 stroke crank, Molnar 6.200 rods, and pistons are still unknown. CP/Carrillo have great pics and tech info. Also CP seem to have identical advertising pics of Diamond pistons. So i want to find out if CP/Carrillo and Diamond are as close as Chevrolet/GMC type relations. 6.2 block part number is still active number. I called and 6.2 is on backorder but not discontinued. Approx 4 weeks to get one.

[engineermike]

Is the truck 6.4 not the same bore as the hellcat 6.2, just a longer stroke?

http://www.cumminshub.com/gas/6.4-hemi.html

[Chaz]

Most of the piston designers left JE and went to CP when they merged with Carrillo.
Mike Panetta from Diamond was already hanging out on the Bullet providing typical shelf orders to the obscure customs at a decent price and reasonable time frame, so I went with them.
That was a while ago, best thing to do is ask Tom what he suggests. Especially since your thinking of using his crank and rods. He's the kind of guy that will use some of his connections to get you some deals on the rest of it if you catch him at the right time. I'm tellin ya .. great guy !

[davemvegas]

[QUOTE=engineermike;3114784]Is the truck 6.4 not the same bore as the hellcat 6.2, just a longer stroke?

6.4 is 3.720 stroke 4.090 bore. 6.2 is 3.578 stroke 4.090 bore. I did have the numbers all fogged up from reading. 5.7 has 3.578 stroke 3.917 bore. So 5.7 and 6.2 have same 3.578 stroke. 6.2 and 6.4 have same 4.090 bore. 6.2 376 CI. 6.4 is 392 CI. .142 increase in stroke gains 16 CI. My 1st idea was 3.900 stroke with 4.090 bore would be a 411 CI motor. Now i am thinking 3.780 to 3.820 stroke. off the shelf parts will steer me to my choice. Rod length 6.125 to 6.200 and bore 4.090 to 4.125.

[Hayabusajm]

Dave, now that you may be getting parts, crank, rods, pistons, block, etc. if you’re interested in getting anything cryoed let me know, I have a full cryogenics setup and I can fit an engine block, cranks and anything of similar size, smaller stuff to. I cryo all my cutting tools and man what a difference cutting hard steel it makes like cutting through butter, they cut a lot longer before needing resharpening or tossed. I cryoed my supercharger that resulted in data logged lower IAT’s, also showed cooler color with a SnapOn infrared imager, it works, amazing results. I cryoed all my props and props for others that have broken blades and have since not broken any blades, I can Cryo your tranny and diff if you’d like also, give it that extra bullet proof edge.

[davemvegas]

Dave, now that you may be getting parts, crank, rods, pistons, block, etc. if you’re interested in getting anything cryoed let me know, I have a full cryogenics setup and I can fit an engine block, cranks and anything of similar size, smaller stuff to. I cryo all my cutting tools and man what a difference cutting hard steel it makes like cutting through butter, they cut a lot longer before needing resharpening or tossed. I cryoed my supercharger that resulted in data logged lower IAT’s, also showed cooler color with a SnapOn infrared imager, it works, amazing results. I cryoed all my props and props for others that have broken blades and have since not broken any blades, I can Cryo your tranny and diff if you’d like also, give it that extra bullet proof edge.

I will read up on the Cryo. I do not have any idea what that process is. But it sounds "cold".

[AZMIDLYF]

What about this young ladies bottom end?

[oldstv]

Hayabusajm, have you done any cryo work for Tim at MPR?

[Hayabusajm]

No I can’t say that I have, my friend Todd who runs the Cryo side of the business has spoken to a Tim MPR hear in the Boynton are, does Mustangs. I got my supercharger spacer plates and heat shield blanket in today going to get my IAT’s even lower.

[davemvegas]

No I can’t say that I have, my friend Todd who runs the Cryo side of the business has spoken to a Tim MPR hear in the Boynton are, does Mustangs. I got my supercharger spacer plates and heat shield blanket in today going to get my IAT’s even lower.

How did you get them so quick? I am guessing you are not part of the 20 orders that jeff put together on one of forums last week. Thinking it will be 3 to 5 weeks before mine get here. If i knew you had a set. The machine shop down the road could have spit out a matching pair for me i think. Then again i do not have a motor to bolt them to yet.