Project: Liberator Gets A New Transom

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Originally Posted by GRH

You have done a beautiful job on this boat.... thank you for sharing your experience with Liberator Boats build quality.... clearly from this thread & the other on the 24 Liberator these are boats to steer clear of.... your boat will end up being spectacular and all the credit belongs to you!

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Thank you for the kind words. I'm a firm believer in calling it like it is with no fluff, don't like to bad mouth but I do like to share and keep everybody informed before someone else may unknowingly run into the same thing....:eek: The boat now is truly a labor of love and should now last me a life time. Knowledge is always the key to getting it right the first time.

Update:

Bilge area and all electricals finally finished, carpets vacuumed and ready for power washing to get the fiberglass grinding powder residue out.

Here's pics of what the finished back end looks like. Installed some polished diamond tread plate on the back of the seat and the bottom of the hatch, this really makes the storage compartment pop when the LED's get turned on. I put 2 sets of LED's into the backseat for a clean install.

All new LED's inside the cockpit as well and as a killer 300W Eye Blinding Externally mounted under the J/Plate LED Transom Light Array, 3 x 100W LED's, switchable to either 1 or 2 or all 3 when running........ Damm those things are bright, single LED will be used for underwater lighting all 3 for lighting up the rooster at speed. More details on those later.

Should be on the water next weekend.......Yipppppppy !!!!!!!!!!!!

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Looks awsome Gary, bet you can't wait to get her wet. :thumbsup::D

Dave :cheers:

Hell it's getting me wet just looking at it :cheers::thumbsup:

I hope everyone with one of Daves boats is checking it over after all of the discovery in the last two years of how poorly he built these hulls. My old 21 with twins (now in the for sale section) just had a bunch of extensive work done to it as well. I have seen Randy make several changes to the hulls that he sells after they get shipped to him. Don't want to see anyone get hurt-

Gary,

I love seeing people with pride in their efforts, you did it right.

Joe

After reading these Liberator threads with rotted wood I was dismayed.
I just purchased my Liberator 2 months ago.
i removed the back seat and inspected the boat, I noticed the transom was gel coated and blue spackling.
Ill show some of the guys going to the Glen look and give me their opinions.

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Originally Posted by Dave Strong

Looks awsome Gary, bet you can't wait to get her wet. :thumbsup::D

Dave :cheers:

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Thanks Dave, labor of love for sure....http://www.screamandfly.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

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Originally Posted by JPEROG

I hope everyone with one of Daves boats is checking it over after all of the discovery in the last two years of how poorly he built these hulls. My old 21 with twins (now in the for sale section) just had a bunch of extensive work done to it as well. I have seen Randy make several changes to the hulls that he sells after they get shipped to him. Don't want to see anyone get hurt-

Gary,

I love seeing people with pride in their efforts, you did it right.


Joe

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Thanks Joe for those comments, this just goes to show you can hide a poor build for only so long before it eventually it shows itself and if your still in business..........well lets just say it's not gonna help with your sales numbers.:cool:

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Originally Posted by Pmj341

After reading these Liberator threads with rotted wood I was dismayed.
I just purchased my Liberator 2 months ago.
i removed the back seat and inspected the boat, I noticed the transom was gel coated and blue spackling.
Ill show some of the guys going to the Glen look and give me their opinions.

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PJ,
My situation was that I drilled a couple of holes in the transom for some external rigging and the kiss of death showed itself by dripping brown goo out of those holes, a sure sign of a rotted transom. You can also use a plastic hammer and tap around on your transom outside listening for a change in sound as you move around tapping. Obviously the sound around the motor or J/Plate will change because it's under compression, and the extreme outside edges, but all the other areas should all sound similar in pitch. You can always drill a couple of holes in the transom (inside the boat) about 4" up from the bottom of the sponsen and check for wetness, plug them back up with some Marine Tex or 3M 4200 when your done.


Boat will finally get a good bath tomorrow, power washing out the carpet, hull soap & water bath, then a real good wax job. It's been neglected way to long and deserves lots of "TLC". I'll finalize all the other changes/improvements made during this project in a closing post to wrap this thread up.

Thanks all for tagging along on this as it's been a true lifetime experience, hated the work it took, but loved what I've learned along the way and the ability to share it with you all. If your going to the Mich. Hot Boat/Marble Lake/Corn Island get together July 11th, look me up, I'll be there.

Regards,

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Originally Posted by Liberator*21

Thanks Dave, labor of love for sure....;)



Thanks Joe for those comments, this just goes to show you can hide a poor build for only so long before it eventually it shows itself and if your still in business..........well lets just say it's not gonna help with your sales numbers.:cool:



PJ,
My situation was that I drilled a couple of holes in the transom for some external rigging and the kiss of death showed itself by dripping brown goo out of those holes, a sure sign of a rotted transom. You can also use a plastic hammer and tap around on your transom outside listening for a change in sound as you move around tapping. Obviously the sound around the motor or J/Plate will change because it's under compression, and the extreme outside edges, but all the other areas should all sound similar in pitch. You can always drill a couple of holes in the transom (inside the boat) about 4" up from the bottom of the sponsen and check for wetness, plug them back up with some Marine Tex or 3M 4200 when your done.
Gary will do that!!


Boat will finally get a good bath tomorrow, power washing out the carpet, hull soap & water bath, then a real good wax job. It's been neglected way to long and deserves lots of "TLC". I'll finalize all the other changes/improvements made during this project in a closing post to wrap this thread up.

Thanks all for tagging along on this as it's been a true lifetime experience, hated the work it took, but loved what I've learned along the way and the ability to share it with you all. If your going to the Mich. Hot Boat/Marble Lake/Corn Island get together July 11th, look me up, I'll be there.

Regards,

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Gary I will do that!!

Gary!!
you are one bad a** retired guy!
Wow what a transformation!!
The rigging is so fresh and so clean!
This liberator is now one kick ass ride, the LED's are on point, that bilge is gleaming, your custom made swim platforms look better than store bought, and every detail has been thought out and executed to perfection.

I can also confirm Liberators crappy build quality and lack of attention to detail, and poor workmanship.
I will be posting my re-build thread soon. When I tore into my 21 liberator It had everything wrong but the transom. My gunnel braces were rotted and made from interior grade cdx plywood and had inferior glass work holding them in place a few swift kicks and out they came.
My entire bulkhead under the dash wash rotted along the bottom edge thanks to the interior grade ply and complete lack of any fiberglass tabbing on the inside closest to the bow area letting water sit behind it and soak in, as well as the loosest air bubble filled lack of care or concern fiberglass work holding in that bulkhead as well as the braces running for and aft between the dash bulkhead and the forward bulkhead. The glasswork was so poor I layed on my back and literally kicked out 100% of the bulkheads in the front of the boat only to discover the insanely crappy fiberglass work joining the cap to the hull.
The cap to hull joint was split from the port nav light to the starboard nav light and the fiberglass tabbing was able to pulled of in 2 foot sections by hand across the entire area, as well as the air entrapped silicone filled (whole nother story) rats nest of garbage stuffed into the tips of the sponsons that was supposed to hold the cap to the hull that was clearly the start of failure.....This was not repair stuff it was clearly original work. Upon removal and inspection of the dash bulkhead the person who cut out the plywood must have got a new chainsaw for christmas and used it to cut out my bulkhead at the factory, it had 3-4" gaps around the perimeter where 1-2 layers of dry 8oz. glass was bridging the gaps to the cap and hull.
Now just in case that was'nt enough I dicovered rot in the sponson core near the drain holes and discovered when the drain holes were drilled out they lightly grazed the glass on the floor and exposed a small area of core letting water soak in for years to come. Then the small bulkhead under the rear seat was completely hollow the wood inside turned to mush!! Again the guy drilling holes holes that day drilled a drain hole from the center sponson floor through the rear seat small bulkhead and didn't seal it with anything so the cdx ply just melted with rot.

So after laying in the nose of the boat for 20+ hours grinding and cleaning and chiseling all that stuff out and assisting Gary with his transom nightmare, I believe Gary and I are in a place where we can speak with intimate knowledge of the situation. In addition I have a pretty extensive background in the composite and "plastic" or fiberglass industry, my comments are from a point of view with experience hands on, not just internet knowledge. I am not saying don't buy a liberator, Just be aware of these issues if you own one or are buying one. Pull carpet back, climb in the front of the boat under the dash use a flash light look hard and long, tap the transom, look at core, check everything before you plunk down your hard earned cash to buy a "project" thinking your gonna hit the water soon.

I sold a 21' daytona that needed some work to buy this as advertised on scream and fly "pristine quality great condition" used unrigged Liberator, I drove from cinci to houston 32hrs round trip in with a 4 hr nap in houston looked over it and didn't see any real problems (carpet and interior still in) then I got it apart at home......the rebuild begins!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by vw-nut

I can also confirm Liberators crappy build quality and lack of attention to detail, and poor workmanship.
I will be posting my re-build thread soon. When I tore into my 21 liberator It had everything wrong but the transom. My gunnel braces were rotted and made from interior grade cdx plywood and had inferior glass work holding them in place a few swift kicks and out they came.
My entire bulkhead under the dash wash rotted along the bottom edge thanks to the interior grade ply and complete lack of any fiberglass tabbing on the inside closest to the bow area letting water sit behind it and soak in, as well as the loosest air bubble filled lack of care or concern fiberglass work holding in that bulkhead as well as the braces running for and aft between the dash bulkhead and the forward bulkhead. The glasswork was so poor I layed on my back and literally kicked out 100% of the bulkheads in the front of the boat only to discover the insanely crappy fiberglass work joining the cap to the hull.
The cap to hull joint was split from the port nav light to the starboard nav light and the fiberglass tabbing was able to pulled of in 2 foot sections by hand across the entire area, as well as the air entrapped silicone filled (whole nother story) rats nest of garbage stuffed into the tips of the sponsons that was supposed to hold the cap to the hull that was clearly the start of failure.....This was not repair stuff it was clearly original work. Upon removal and inspection of the dash bulkhead the person who cut out the plywood must have got a new chainsaw for christmas and used it to cut out my bulkhead at the factory, it had 3-4" gaps around the perimeter where 1-2 layers of dry 8oz. glass was bridging the gaps to the cap and hull.
Now just in case that was'nt enough I dicovered rot in the sponson core near the drain holes and discovered when the drain holes were drilled out they lightly grazed the glass on the floor and exposed a small area of core letting water soak in for years to come. Then the small bulkhead under the rear seat was completely hollow the wood inside turned to mush!! Again the guy drilling holes holes that day drilled a drain hole from the center sponson floor through the rear seat small bulkhead and didn't seal it with anything so the cdx ply just melted with rot.

So after laying in the nose of the boat for 20+ hours grinding and cleaning and chiseling all that stuff out and assisting Gary with his transom nightmare, I believe Gary and I are in a place where we can speak with intimate knowledge of the situation. In addition I have a pretty extensive background in the composite and "plastic" or fiberglass industry, my comments are from a point of view with experience hands on, not just internet knowledge. I am not saying don't buy a liberator, Just be aware of these issues if you own one or are buying one. Pull carpet back, climb in the front of the boat under the dash use a flash light look hard and long, tap the transom, look at core, check everything before you plunk down your hard earned cash to buy a "project" thinking your gonna hit the water soon.

I sold a 21' daytona that needed some work to buy this as advertised on scream and fly "pristine quality great condition" used unrigged Liberator, I drove from cinci to houston 32hrs round trip in with a 4 hr nap in houston looked over it and didn't see any real problems (carpet and interior still in) then I got it apart at home......the rebuild begins!!!!!!

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What year is your Liberator?

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Originally Posted by Pmj341

Gary I will do that!!

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If its real bad, you will see your clamp assy. caving the outside skin.

The good news is that you are close to Randy and it can be corrected. The boats handle well, take a lot of water for their size and are a blast to drive. I had the one with twin 280s that is in the 20 and up section for sale now. I will see you at Crystal Cove.

Joe

If memory serves me right VW-NUT's Liberator is a 1998. You've not seen a custom boat till you see this one (when it's done). It's gonna be a one of a kind all out custom from bow to stern.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by vw-nut

Gary!!
you are one bad a** retired guy!
Wow what a transformation!!
The rigging is so fresh and so clean!
This liberator is now one kick ass ride, the LED's are on point, that bilge is gleaming, your custom made swim platforms look better than store bought, and every detail has been thought out and executed to perfection.

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Thanks Glenn for all your support, knowledge and helping hand in getting mine done, its greatly appreciated. Now we just need to get yours done.......:D

years ago we laughed at Sea Rays and Bayliners as they used pieces of wood from old VW packing cases
I can buy a 3/4 sheet of basic ply in Singapore for USD25 marine ply cost 50% more, but I cant find any plywood that looks like what comes out of those boats