Chopper or 5 blade ET copy ... which would be better on a V-king?

[King-V]

Does anyone have an opinion on which would be a better wheel on a Hydrostream V-King - 28" Chopper or a Hill 28" 5-blade Lightning ET copy? I've read a number of good comments about the Hill 5-blade ET copy in terms of acceleration and efficiency and the 28" 3-blade ET copy I have doesn't seem to have enough lift for my rig. I should be able to go more than 71 MPH with two 175 lb passengers, right? I have a stock 2.5L Merc 200 and Gorilla jack.

Many thanks!

[pyro]

I should be able to go more than 71 MPH with two 175 lb passengers, right? I have a stock 2.5L Merc 200 and Gorilla jack.

Many thanks!

YES, to answer your question. What RPM's are you turning? You need to try some different props.

-chad

[King-V]

Seems like a lot of slip, no? Prop shaft about 1" below pad. The ET was made by AQUAholic, so no reason to suspect it is bad.

[King-V]

4-hole CLE lower unit with 1.87 RH gears.

I thought I might need another prop, so that's why I thought I'd make a post on S&F!

[Liqui-Fly]

You have to work on your set up by the sounds of it. Be very weary of most "copies" because there are only a few that run well. In my experince the ones you have mentioned have been below parr...I sold them for a fraction of what I paid for them. A stock 28 chopper should make that boat do more than you ever imagined.

[King-V]

I wasn't sure whether I should spend more time on my setup with my current prop or if the prop was limiting my ability to get my setup sorted out. I'll look for a good used chopper over the winter and get back to work on my setup in the spring. Thanks!

[WATERWINGS]

I may catch hell for this.........but.............

I have used choppers and cleavers on my Stream, and even though its not the fastest prop, I LOVE my four blade Trophy.......

.....on my 'Stream, AND on the tunnel.....

I have a buddy that has a V-King, and he prefers the Trophy also, even on his Allison..........

OK, so let the flamming begin.

The 26 Trophy has pushed my 'Stream 88.3, and the tunnel to 90.1 with an almost stock 200 -2.4

[King-V]

Maybe I should go 26 pitch too.

Is the Trophy thru-hub or over hub?

[Alan Power]

I have been advised by a few people to try a small ear 28 chopper, I have the prop but havent tested it yet.
I had a big ear 28 and it didn't leave to good and slipped a bit too!

[150aintenuff]

would you all get your prop selection sorted out I got a Valero V i need to setup and all this squaking about props is drivin me nuts.... i was gunns start with a TRO4 in 26P but if someone has good luck with a hill 5 blade maybe Ill change my mind.

[King-V]

From searching past posts, it looks like people have good luck with the chopper, but the Hill 5-blade ET/YamaCopy seems to be relatively new and I was wondering if anyone tried it with any success on a smaller rig.

There's a 28 pitch Hill 5-blade for sale in Buy & Sell and a number of people who already have that prop have posted replies indicating how great it is. Seems all those people have rigs bigger than 20' and big power so maybe it's not so great on something lite & small. You'd think it was really something else otherwise why would someone who already has one post a reply!

Seems to me that:
- the ET blades are smaller and less drag, but small blades = less lift
- the small ear chopper had bigger blades and bigger blades = more lift
- the big ear copper had bigger blades still and maybe that's too much lift

So maybe this question is easier to answer ... does 5 ET style blades provide the same lift as 3 small ear chopper blades? The 5-blade would have more blade surface in the water at any given time, so while each blade has less lift than a blade on a chopper, there's almost twice as many blades doing the lifting.

I think I've had too much coffee today.

[Alan Power]

I was looking at that prop also, I would be very interested in trying one on my Vking but have a lot more to do before I build up a prop collection :D
If you do buy one, please let us know how you get on.

Alan

[David]

200 or 150? Your signature says 150 XR6. 71 w/two people with 150 might be alright.

You might want to hook up with people from the PBCC and borrow some props. I think this is good advice, but I have never done that myself.

My theory is that with less power and a light load (solo) you need less blade area, ie fewer and smaller blades.

To carry two, perphaps a big ear chopper or a Trophy. Either might be cheaper than the 5 blade ET copy. But if you buy it, I'd like to try it.

I have a 28 small ear chopper, a 26 Hoss Hyperdrive Hilift, and a 30 Spinelli DR4.

[150aintenuff]

according to the previous owner the ValeroV i hav ran 74 with a 150XR2 wiith 2 people bolted low on the transom.... so if he has an XR6 on a Jackplate rigged right I would hope to see more than 71 MPH.....

[WATERWINGS]

As far a total lift with the Trophy, I felt like I was two or three inches higher out of the water when I first put it on, and even thought I have tried all the other props,(my chopper is a 28 small blade) (inline) I still run the Trophy 99% of the time.


PLUS.........you can't ride 1/4 mile long speed wheelies at 75 + MPH like the pic below with the other props. :D

[daytrader]

Can u surface these trophy props? or in other words run your motor hi on the transom? I have a vector with a slightly modded 175 merc. What would be a good pitch for my rig? also these are 4 blades, rite? Thankx, Gary

[jphii]

As far a total lift with the Trophy, I felt like I was two or three inches higher out of the water when I first put it on, and even thought I have tried all the other props,(my chopper is a 28 small blade) (inline) I still run the Trophy 99% of the time.


PLUS.........you can't ride 1/4 mile long speed wheelies at 75 + MPH like the pic below with the other props. :D

He ain't kiddin, and he is speaking from experience. I run with John and another S&Fer, and they both run Trophys. I've tried a 27 Shooter, a 28 Raker, and a 32 Ron Hill et style. On my boat none of those props weem to work correctly. One of these days John is going to let me try that Trophy to see what it will do on my boat. Hopefully tomorrow (you listening John?).

And yes, you can surface it.

[jtb]

He ain't kiddin, and he is speaking from experience. I run with John and another S&Fer, and they both run Trophys. I've tried a 27 Shooter, a 28 Raker, and a 32 Ron Hill et style. On my boat none of those props weem to work correctly. One of these days John is going to let me try that Trophy to see what it will do on my boat. Hopefully tomorrow (you listening John?).

And yes, you can surface it.
not to make this about me......how did the boat do @ cruise? I have a 3 blade yam and it bounces like a bastard at cruise but kicks a$$ flat out.
I have a chance to run a 4 blad and want to try it when the weather breaks.

[dashrockwell]

Waterwings...
I tried a small hub 4 blade trophy (24" pitch I believe) on my YT V-King this summer and it drove like a snow plow. No bow lift at all... You say yours has plenty of bow lift? Just courious?

I run a 28 Yammy Drag copy from Ron Hill, specially made with extra rake and I love it. Plenty of lift and smooth ride.

Good luck all!

[King-V]

Yeah, my motor is a 2.5L 150 XR-6, but Ted Gryguc did a few things to get me what he called "an honest 200 HP". It seems to run well and has more get up & go than before, but that's probably Ted's gut feel on HP, not dyno fact.

Another thing ... I have a 23" Laser II for skiing and with that I can go 65 MPH with anywhere from 1 to 4 people in the boat, but with the 28" ET I can get to 71 with 2 people, 64 with 3 people, and barely 60 with 4 people (average weights 150 lbs - 2 fellas, 2 ladies). This makes me think lift is what I need.

For the rigging, I'm not sure what else I can do to improve my speed. I have tried all kinds of trim angles and jack heights but 71 MPH seems to be as good as it gets with that 28" ET and two passengers.

I should probably set work aside for a change and make it to one of the PBCC events ... buying, testing, and selling props seems a long and tedious way to go about this! All these repies sure help a lot though ... thanks!!

[David]

I don't think bow lift is your problem with the ET. Not compared to the Laser. I have never tried an ET. But my Laser has less bow lift than my sold Trophy, my Hoss Hyperdrive, or my Spinelli DR4.

How high is the rooster tail two up with the ET? If it is higher than the motor you need more bow lift from the prop or from setback.

Maybe the 28 pitch is just too much.

[King-V]

... maybe engine height or so with two on board. Trim is pretty much level with prop shaft about an inch below the pad. If I go higher on the jack I start to get some steering pull, so I think I am in the right spot. The 23p Laser II does have more rooster tail than the 28p ET, so what you say about the relationship between rooster tail and lift would make sense.

I can get the revs to 6,000 RPM with the 28p ET though ... doesn't that mean the 28p isn't too much? Since I'm only going 71 MPH it seems like something is holding the boat back. One way or another it seems clear to me I should be using 26p of whatever I end up getting, and it also seems that nobody has any experience with these 5-blade ET style props on a smaller v-pad hull. Lots of good suggestions otherwise, so I'll post my ET for sale and go from there!

Many thanks to everyone that replied!

[WATERWINGS]

Dash,

I had plenty of bow lift, (more than I need), when I first put the trophy on, but I took it off and rolled some more cup into the blade tips, which makes it run more like a 27 now, and gives more bowlift too.

Everybody seems to love cleavers, but I have not liked a cleaver
on anything I run, no bowlift, and hard to take off with.

Like I said before, the chopper is about 4-5 MPH faster than the Trophy, but the Trophy is the best all around prop that I run.

I spend most of my time at 50 to 80 MPH, and hardly no time at all out WFO, so top speed is not really a main concern, but the best handling prop is what I want.

[T-REX]

Try them....all ov them!!!!.....What works on your V-king, won't work on ya brutherz!!!!

My bruther haz a Laser basser, and I have a 380 ski...we both have 200's, and weigh approx the same...hiz is a 18' boat, mine is a 19"...I run a 25 4blade shooter, he likes the trophy 26...We swapped props to try, and I would have had better lift outta a aluminium prop than that trophy, and he said my shooter wouldn't hold up hiz boat??...U figger??...The shooter iz the best river prop I ever run on my Laser(an God knows it'z had plenty)...Now for a empty boat(light load) and fast cruise'in, or good top end numbers, the cleaver iz the ticket(on my hull!!)...Gary had a Vector, and he run a cleaver all the time, but he never had a load...All the vectors that reely perform down here, usually run cleavers(not all)...I'n my opinion, the ET cut iz a happy medium between a cleaver and chopper...I have run Ron Hills copy, and it ran quite well...REX

[David]

You could wait until spring and we could try borrowing each others props. For the next 6 months my boat is sleeping. Are you still boating?

I would like to try the 28 ET.

You could try any of mine (with me around)
26" Hoss Hyperdrive
30 Spinelli DR4
28" small ear chopper (I haven't run this yet)

A 5 blade is pretty much out of the mainstream for your application. But if you can sell it for close to what you pay for it, then a trial purchase is like a rental with option to keep. That's how I rationalize buying props.

[action280]

i got a q-shot with a 280 and my brother have one identical...his best a cleaver..my best an et....if we exchange none boats work good :rolleyes:

[King-V]

I figured that the hull, lower unit, HP, and weight would demand a certain prop, but after reading the latest replies it seems that each rig almost has its own DNA and will therefore have its own prop preference. I got the ET thinking that it was a good mix between the chopper and cleaver, but maybe the 28 is too much or I got too many creature comforts in my rig that weigh me down. I guess I gotta ditch the cappuccino machine ...

David ... I just put my boat away for the winter, so I will have to patiently wait until next season to take the next step. As for the props, I see a lot of value in trying a few others without having to buy them, and you can certainly try my 28 ET if there is an opportunity to have our boats in the same piece of water next year. Do you ever get out to any of the lakes north of Toronto? I don't go west of the city much, but that's only cuz I have no real reason to and don't know the area well. I'll hang on to the ET for now anyway ... I need to have something that other people might want to try ... don't wanna feel like a dead-beat mooch!

[150aintenuff]

go to lake simcoe very prety lake not to far from ya..... gives ya some long running but isnt very deep.... got the chance to boat on it when I delivered a boat there.

[David]

sure, Lake Simcoe can be 20 miles of calm running, on the rare days when it is calm

Our cottage is near Orillia on Lake Cooch.

If you bring your boat there, we can try props

I have an XR4 on an SS2000

[King-V]

My folks live just south of Barrie and I keep my boat there in the winters, so I must go right by your place on my way up to Muskoka. We'll get back in touch when the next boatin' season is upon us and see if we can set something up where you can try my 28 ET and I can try one of your props. It's gonna be a looong 6 months!!

[150aintenuff]

sure, Lake Simcoe can be 20 miles of calm running, on the rare days when it is calm




OR on the days that there isnt 5000 cruisers out churnin it up..

[David]

Cruiser wakes and wind waves are a big problem on Cooch.

I do my high speed runs early on weekends. By 10:00 AM usually the boat traffic is picking up, and by noon I'm parked.

Cooch is shallow, but Simcoe is deep, except for the north shore.

We could meet up early and take the boats to Big Chief. We can do a couple of mile run north from there, and then return to the shallow bay change props.

I have a 28 small ear chopper on the floor that I've never tried. Only 6 months to go.