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View Full Version : Yamaha HPDI tops JD Power



David
02-18-2005, 07:01 PM
Yamaha's HPDI came out on top in JD Power's assessment of new outboards.

Carb motors came last. So much for the advantages of simplicity.

http://www.jdpower.com/news/releases/pressrelease.asp?ID=2005019

sosmerc
02-18-2005, 07:10 PM
Hard to judge how all these new products stack up until we see some more real world testing. I really don't want to see the 2 strokes go away, so whenever I see a favorable report on HPDI, E-Tech or Optimax, I'm encouraged.
The kind of people that are buying 4 strokes are looking for reliability and smooth quiet running quality....on that, the engines really deliver, and the J.D. Powers satisfaction numbers confirm that.
If we were only looking at performance, then I think the 2 strokes still have the edge, but clearly the new 4 strokes from Merc are narrowing the gap.

150aintenuff
02-25-2005, 11:41 PM
if you consider that weight doesnt count for anything the gap is only as wide as the grand Canyon.... let me see a 2005 VERADO in the year 2050 and see if it still has as much compression as new and runs like it is new with out a rebuild in 35 years and 3000+ hours.... new 4 strokes have aways to go before beating the good old carburated 2 stroke...

stan merck
02-28-2005, 09:34 AM
When I was at a Merc training school one time they told us how the 4 stroke Yamaha powerheads at Disney had 2700 hrs logged and still ran like new. The 2 stokes of the past were pretty much done by that time. Adding a super charger may change that for 4 strokes though. I am interested to see how the Verados hold up.

Markus
02-28-2005, 10:27 AM
When I was at a Merc training school one time they told us how the 4 stroke Yamaha powerheads at Disney had 2700 hrs logged and still ran like new. The 2 stokes of the past were pretty much done by that time. Adding a super charger may change that for 4 strokes though. I am interested to see how the Verados hold up.

Actually, I think the rebuild interval on Yamaha's carburated 2-strokes was 2000-3000 hours, versus high hundreds for Mercs.

David
02-28-2005, 07:54 PM
I took a bit of a cheap shot at carbed motors in my original post. The JD Power survey evaluates new motors. A new cold DFI motor is going to start easier than a cold carbed motor ever can so it should be no surprise that a DFI motor got the highest rating.

A second survey at 2000 hours might tell a different story. The carbed motor has a lot less to go wrong. Or maybe not. I've put a lot of kilometers (miles for the US crowd) on some fuel injected cars with no injection issues.

For me and my Allison it will come to weight and money. I'd like a green 200XS but I'm too cheap for now.

150aintenuff
02-28-2005, 11:16 PM
When I was at a Merc training school one time they told us how the 4 stroke Yamaha powerheads at Disney had 2700 hrs logged and still ran like new. The 2 stokes of the past were pretty much done by that time. Adding a super charger may change that for 4 strokes though. I am interested to see how the Verados hold up.


any engine can make the 2700 hour mark if it idles all day long like they do at disney.... you never see any of those engines working as hard as a boat that ACTUALLY gets ran their RPM range...

CUSTOM PERFORMANCE 1
03-01-2005, 03:18 PM
What the F*&%$ does JD Powers know about outboards? They rate telecom companies services for god sake. Seems to be just another sales ploy. Any moron that would buy an outboard on the rating of JD Powers obviously does not know dick about outboards either. There are way to many factors to rate which outboard is best 2 or 4 stroke. Hell, a friend of mine had both his "NEW" HPDI Yams fail after 50 hours on the meters. Scored all 6 cylinders in both engines. Look at outboard racing, APBA and Offshore. See any Yamahas running, much less finishing in the money. The only Yam I saw running in the Champ boat series ran strong, for about 3 laps and DNF every race I saw. All outboards will break sooner or later. Mercs just seem to take the severe abuse much longer than any other motor. Now Mercury put the punch back into the 4 strokes with the Verado, because 4 strokes are pigs compared to equal horsepower of 2 strokes, much more complex and much more to fail. Just price the cost of a rebuild on a 4 stroke after the warranty runs out. Yamaha's parts should be gold plated for what they get.
Just an old man's 2 cents.

Reese
03-02-2005, 03:40 PM
telling the buying public what engines or boats to buy who should be. The boat magazines...the manufacturers...the internet???

The boating industry would love to have a prestigious survey from JD Powers lending some badly needed credibilty to a basically overly bankrupt, company selling, poor service, horrible dealership, POS industry.

None of that really matters to me...but it does to first time buyers.

David
03-02-2005, 07:25 PM
I guess that JD Power rates outboards and boats the same way they rate cars. With cars they send surveys to random new car buyers. A portion of these fill in the surveys and return them to JD Power. The most quoted JD Power survey only covers new car quality, ie initial impressions. There is another survey of 3 year old cars but I've never seen this used in advertising.

I lifted the following from the website:

The study finds customer satisfaction is highest with electronic fuel injected (EFI) inboards, followed by EFI four-stroke outboards, direct injected (DI) two-stroke outboards and EFI sterndrives. Overall customer satisfaction is based on six factors: starting ease, quietness at cruise, reliability, fuel economy, shifting smoothness and lack of engine fumes

...

In the area of product quality, engine problems constitute one-third of total reported boat problems—more than any other category—leading to lower customer satisfaction and owner loyalty. Across all technologies, inboard owners report the fewest problems, followed by owners of outboards and sterndrives. Taking technology into account, two-stroke carbureted outboards have the most reported problems.

...

The 2005 Marine Engine Competitive Information Study is based on responses from 12,530 owners who registered a new boat between March 2003 and May 2004. Ten marine engine brands, including outboards, sterndrives and gas inboards, are included in the study.

Scott Gilmore
03-13-2005, 07:49 PM
Yamaha's HPDI came out on top in JD Power's assessment of new outboards.

Carb motors came last. So much for the advantages of simplicity.

http://www.jdpower.com/news/releases/pressrelease.asp?ID=2005019

Maybe JD power & Yamaha could make a combined effort & trim about 125lbs off that PIG & maybe I could hang one off the back of an Allison !! Scott :(