CLE LU Problem....

[dashrockwell]

I just found that the propshaft bearing carrier on my CLE LU has spun in the housing....about an 1/4 of a turn.
Is this a common problem?
Is there anyway to ensure that it doesnt happen again? Some way to secure it better?

I haven't pulled the carrier yet but it doesn't seem to have hurt anything.

Thanks for any advice...
Mac.

[email protected]

PS. Anyone willing to rent a carrier nut removal/install tool....

[rmh77]

looks more like 3/4 of a turn:D

[dashrockwell]

Then it's 1/4 turn..ha..ha

[ShorePounder]

ewww. Not good, but not scrap aluminum yet either.

The locator pin on the carrier is a tiny little bugger and does the job for the most part. You'll probably see a nice groove in the housing starting at the locator pin keyway and ending about 8:30, judging from the pic. ;). Once the carrier is out, you'll also need to check the inside of the housing to see if the carrier bit into the side of the housing. Surfacing props load the carrier to one side causing wear on the side of the gearcase. It can be repaired with a good epoxy, and some time. It's a long-term temporary fix. To prevent the carrier from ever spinning again, Ive seen carriers pinned from the ouside with 1/4-20 countersunk bolts.

[Balzy]

key in the keyway at the bottom has torn into your case for sure. No dought about it. To me that means the case is junk, but that's just me. I never considered epoxy, Shorepounder, have you done this, and how well did it work? I know there are guys out there that can weld them up and retap the bearing carrier nut threads. Like Shorepounder said, I have seen and have had a few that were pinned through the case and carrier nut with 1/4"-20 flatheads.

[dashrockwell]

Correct me if I'm wrong..(I've rebuilt plenty of Mercruiser drives but not outboards) But the keyway is at the rear of the carrier and out of any sealing area that would compromise sealing the LU.

So even if it did groove the unit it wouldn't effect the ability to seal it. Soooo...As long as the unit is not cracked, I could pull the carrier, inspect the area, clean the keyway groove..maybe deepen it and put in a new key, and perhaps drill and pin the carrier with a hex head set screw through the housing and then fill the hole.
Pressure test the unit and wala!! Good as new...maybe?

Anyone see any flaws in my thinking?

Now I just have to get my hands on a tool to get the nut out.
Thanks!!
Mac.

[Balzy]

if you trust the pinning of the carrier without the key. The housing will have a grooove in it for sure right now. You will loose the threads also where the key tore up the case. You may be able to machine the keyway deeper and use a taller key. There is a little meat right there in the housing. You are correct, it will not affect the sealing area. If it was mine I would have it welded and rethreaded or replace the case though. I have been todl I was picky though !!!!!!!!! :eek: :eek:

[dashrockwell]

I agree...It would be nice to replace the housing but that's not in the budget right now. I'm gonna see how much damage it did and try and deepen the keyway groove and also drill a set screw into the carrier.
Any suggestion on the best location to put a set screw?

PS. (Someone has been in this LU) I got to looking at it and the fold over locking washer has never been folded into the nut. I wonder if the moron left the key out? No metal in the oil..

Does anyone rent tools around here?
I'll pay a security deposit, just need it for a week or so.
Thanks,
Mac.

[Skittles]

Well seeing how the LTB guys just love spit carriers..... :rolleyes: :D I have tried making new keys, making new keyways, roll pins, screws, bolts, etc etc...........It seems to me that once they spin, you basically spend the rest of your time putting band aids on the problem. I managed to get a year out of my CLE by putting a new carrier in and putting 4 pins in it. The bigger problem seems to be that they usually screw the threads up on the case when they spin. You can have new threads welded in but from what I gather they will never last in a hi po application. If it is not to bad and you still have decent threads, I would try to file out the keyway, run a new carrier and do the machine screw through the case deal. Just my .02:cool:

[ShorePounder]

Balzy,

I have not personally performed this repair on a gearcase although it was seriously considered when I thought I had a problem earlier this year (luckily the ridge I felt was carbon build up and not a carrier scar). A very reputable shop in this area does this and like I said in my previous post, it's done as a "long-term temporary repair". Skip's got a gearcase at home that did the same thing and that's what they did to it. Good as new for now. Just as rmh77 said, it's a band-aid on the problem, but it does buy the budget boater some time to find another gear case. Even if the repair is done a couple of times over the course of a few seasons, its still cheaper than a new case. Even if I did the epoxy job, I'd still pin the case for insurance. Its just about standard procedure for the OMC boys.

If I'm not mistaken, the key is in past the threads so I wouldn't think it would tear up any threads, but I suppose anything's possible. :D

[Skittles]

Yep it sits behind the threads.......but the carrier can't spin without spinning the nut. The lock(or Tab) washer won't let it. Once it spins the carrier will back out and the key starts spinning around on thethreads. I just wish I could find a more permanant way to fix it.........any suggestions:cool:

[WaterBoy]

About pinning the carrier from the outside, he can't seem to keep it from breaking the pins, became an every weekend deal. He is waiting on a sportmaster now, but he might can help some on the subject.

Waterboy

[sosmerc]

I have "pinned" them before with some success. But before going to the trouble, I would check the propshaft for straightness, and also the bearing surface.
It's a "band-aid" fix that should be considered a last resort. Inspect the gears and shafts and if you think it is worth it, reseal the case. I run a chaser thru the threads to clean them and I use a new carrier nut. Once the carrier is seated and pressure checked, then I remove the carrier nut and marine-tex the key in.
Be sure to torque the carrier nut. (do this after you put the lower unit back on the motor, so you are not holding the unit with the skeg during this torque). I used allen heads for the pins and my machinist sugguested we pin both into the front part of the carrier and the back. The pins were installed deep enough so that there was a hole for me to fill in with marinetex. We gambled that this was going to work....I was not intending to take this unit apart again for along time....and so far, it has several seasons on it and is ok. I pull the prop and inspect after every run. And I generally take the time to inspect and top off my gearoil prior to every run as well. I don't get out in my boat that often, so this anal attention really isn't that big a deal for me.
One of these days I'll spend the money for either a torque-master or a sportmaster....they seem to handle the stress far better than the stock units.

[dashrockwell]

The one good thing so far it that the tab washer wasn't folded down into the nut. Someone worked on this thing sometime and didn't bent the tab down so I'm hoping the moron left the key out too. I just need to get the nut out and look at what actually happened!!

Do you think putting locktight on the carrier would help hold it from spinning along with pinning it?

I don't know if locktight holds in that type of situation?

Thanks again!!

[JustMercMe]

I have a similar problem. Mine just spins enough to break the pins. Definate problem. (Hopefully a sportmaster will solve) I was having a seal problem last year. That was why I pinned the carrier in the first place. These guys are right, pinning a lower is a temporary fix. If your lucky and the guy forgot to put the key in and did'nt push the tab down, pull it apart to check everything and pin it. I've learned that when you pin it, do 2 pins directly across from each other.(like the pic) Reason being that when running a surfacing prop situation this will keep the shaft from moving side to side as much. Thus breaking a pin if you have it pinned just once.:) Take note this is just from expierience and not by a professional. You can get by with this for a little while if your careful. I would personally find another housing and put your gears in it. That would be the better thing to do.:D


Hope this helps.

Itchy

[dashrockwell]

Got the carrier out...drilled the nut in 1/2 and poped it out and I was able to spin the carrier back strait so not to drag the keyway across the threads. Things are looking OK....I need to clean the treads but thats all!

The main problem (as I see it) is the key in the is flush with the carrier so it didn't extend into the housing at all to lock the carrier in place.

I'm gonna get a new nut, new seals, new lockwasher and new key and stick it back together and pin it! I'll just have to check it after every run.

[dashrockwell]

Need to deepen grove.....

[Dave S]

I shim the key with a part of hose clamp on the carryer part, so the key is tight up to the housing. Hose clamp is the rite thickness and stainless.;) Salt water is poormans lock-tite.:cool:

[dashrockwell]

I bought the nut installation tool after I pulled it apart and the threads were fine so I replaced the seals and cut a deeper groove in the case for the new keyway and also made my own key which is much bigger and tighter than the original. Put it all back together tonight and I'm gonna try it this weekend...hopefully!

It appears that the tab on the washer broke off and allowed the carrier to spin.. the key was also way too small and didn't engage the housing at all!

Thanks for all the advise.
Mac.