Question about reed seating?

[dashrockwell]

What exactly should I look for when inspecting a set of assembled 4 pedal reed blocks and reeds to install in my motor?


How should the reed seat on the block?
Should they be in contact with the reed block or can there be a gap at the ends.

I've read here that you shouldn't be able to see through the reed blocks. If that is the case than I just got screwed by this seller!

I just purchased a set and every reed has different seating clearance.

Any help on the subject would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks,
Mac.

[beko21]

Dash, I just went through the same thing with my 300x, Mercury told me as much as 20,000th was acceptable, my new reed blocks out of the box from Merc had about 10,000th.

[MTCM]

On some reed cages, if the reed retaining screws have been over-torqued, the end(s) of the reeds will stand away from the cages. If possible, remove the reeds and re-install, torquing to proper specs.

[ProComp]

And open to much, what occures? Just poor idle quality?

ProComp

[Raceman]

"And open to much, what occures? Just poor idle quality?"

At the worse, maybe nothing. Crankcase pressure will have a tendency to close small reed openings.

[steve]

Is that the set you got from me ? If so then you might recall that I suggested right off that you could run them "as is" with the used steel reeds and some have found success doing that . But I have told everyone that fiberglass or carbon fiber reeds will be better for many reasons . None of the sets I have sold have had a gap that I would consider too large to run , but I have yet to see a set of steel reeds not have some gap even after just short run time. Flat is best.
As Raceman mentioned, they tend to close under the slightest reverse pressure and seal well but the flatter the better. The steel reeds tend to take a set right away & generally will show a larger gap then the plastic ones after just a little running. I would not worry about them . However , performance and safety are improved with plastic reeds. Also you may want to disassemble them & be sure there is nothing underneath. Do not use strong solvents to clean them. The 4 petal are an excellent running reed cage & at $110 shipped w? steel reeds , they are a bargin. However if you feel in any way that you are not pleased, feel free to return them for a full refund. :cool:

[jim brinkley]

This is why I deal with Steve. He backs up what he says and he doesn't cheat anyone. You made him a good deal on replacing the product that a lot of people would not do. Thanks for my Reeds and Reed Blocks. GREAT SET OF CAGES and REEDS

Jim Brinkley

[dashrockwell]

Thanks for the information.
Sorry to take so long to reply but I've been on the road this week.

Yes Steve,
these are the ones from you. When they arrived two of the reeds were bent open far enough to stick a wooden pencil in. I know because I did it, a good 1/4 inch, and the rest had different gaps. That's the reason for this post! I assume you can't bend these back to get acceptable clearance so I'll be getting a set of Boysens before I can put it together.

I know everyone should have Fiber reeds but it's an added expense I wasn't looking for at this moment.

They Blocks were a good deal so thanks.

Happy Holidays!!

ps. Jim, I'm glad your happy with your reeds.

[steve]

Must have happened in the shipping as I inspected each one before they were sent. When they left I am certain the gap was very usable on them. My apologies for the packing job if it was my fault and not the shipper. Holler at me if you decide on the fiber reeds and I'll give you a discount for the trouble. Or if you prefer, I have at least 3 complete sets of steel reeds here and you are welcome to as many replacment pcs as you need and shipped at no charge. They are flat and came off of cages that we replaced with fiber reeds. Again my apologies. Let me know if we can help. :cool:

[dashrockwell]

You're a good man....

I'm not bitchin but I'd just like something to go right with this conversion without new expenses poping up.

Have a great holiday season....
Mac.

[steve]

Just send me an email and your address again and let me know how many of the steel reeds you want to replace. Like I mentioned, I have a stack of them. I'll send you a few extras as well. This way you won't have any extra expenses. Just keep me in mind when you go to the glass or carbon reeds. Take care. :cool:

[Liberator25]

You said you just put on a set of reeds on your 300x - curious as to why? I've got a pair of 'em and my right motor "sneezes" every once in a while - not consistent or predictable (no pattern), just every now and then. The motor runs and starts fine, just has this little "sneeze" (I don't know how else to describe it). Sound like reeds to you?:confused:

[beko21]

Liberator, I got this motor from Jaco's with 50 hrs. on it, It ran great for the first 10 minutes and then fell on it's face, I had 2 Hi-Perf dealers put the DDT on it and could not find the problem, so I took it back home and pulled the Plenum off to look at the reeds, almost all of them have black flash burns on them and the rubber on the cages had burns in the front corners also, Jerry at Jaco's warrantied the reeds and blocks and I replaced them, same problem, even though the DDT didn't show a problem with the map sensor, I had it ohmed, it was way off, I replaced it and vaaaroom, I have spoke to several builders and the R&D guys at Boyeseen and they say Mercury knows theres a problem with these reeds, I will be testing some reeds for a reed builder next spring (dual stage) so there is a fix in the making but to answer your question a lean sneeze on a 300 can be adjusted at the TPI, a 300x does not have that luxury as It can't be moved, I don't think a reed will cause your motor to sneeze, If you find your TPI is the problem, I have one, I replaced mine in the mad-dash to get this thing running back in the summer only to find the map was the culprit. I know this was long winded but I hope I answered your question, Kevin

[Liberator25]

Not long winded - you should see some of my rambling:D :D . Is a lean condition at idle a common cause for the sneeze? This sneezeing deal only happens at idle. Interestingly the right motor (my sneezer) uses A LOT more fuel than the left motor. I have two 50 gal tanks (one feeding each motor) and the right motor will use 40 gallons to the left motors 30. RPM's at top speed are the same, but the right motor will run at higher RPM's than the left with equal throttle settings. I have an in control split throttle (pic attached) so I can compensate, but this tendency is probably at the root of the difference in fuel consumption. Come to think of it, maybe this is another indication that the TPI is off on that motor. Is the "lean at idle, too rich at midrange" a further indicator of a bad TPI? See I told you some of my ramblings get wordy.:D Thanks for the help.

[beko21]

I'm not sure, I wouldn't want to give you bad info by telling what my guess would be, I would ohm the tpi, there is a thread on how to do that and see if it's in spec and go from there, again I have one if that turns out to be your problem, but to answer the first part of your question, everything I heard about sneezing (your motor that is:D ) has to do with a lean condition, maybe someone else could add something to this.

[ShorePounder]

I don't know if this is relevant or not, but I'll post it in case it may help someone.

The Merc Hi-perf book I have does not outline a torque sequence for the screws that hold the reeds on the blocks. They give a spec (25 in-lbs) but no sequence. Yesterday while putting my new Boysens on my blocks, I was starting from the middle and working my way to the outside tightening the screws. This created a huge (by reed standards) gap between the primary and secondary reeds. I double checked to make sure i'd put the reeds together right and found that I had. I took the assmbly apart, checked everything again and this time I snugged and torqued the screws down starting from the outside and working my way alternately towards the center screw. The reeds laid down perfectly. Kinda odd since my logic dictated that it should work better the other way. Is this something that's common knowledge, and dumbass me is just finding out?

[Jay Smith]

We strive for "O" % leaks on any reed as the leaking reed looses the oncoming vapor charge that is the lubricating and antidetonation media in the motor as it is spued out the crack ( Holes )this cause lean conditions and dry bores to promotes gaulding, also it will cause the neighbor reeds beside the suspect leaker to suffer ! As the plenium should be at a negative pressure and forming a draft that is hindered as the positive pressure ( vapor) is introudced into the oncoming draft!

Also if one lines up against a leaker motor , all things the same and one that is the leaker will feel as if stepping on a "grape" verses stepping on a firecracker with the sealing reed motor !

from my experences,

[dashrockwell]

Thanks for all the great info guys, but what is the final word on acceptable gap when installing new reeds?

Shoud we strive for no gap?

Or should we try and keep it less than 20,000/inch as "Becko21" stated by Merc?

Jay: when you say 0% leak, are you referring to zero gap or is there a test you perform to see if they're sealing fully?

Thanks again S&F!!

[Jay Smith]

Dash ,
We are opting for the newer vulcanised reed blocks that seal GREAT, I would not spend a nickle on a reed set that is sealing against metal cages. They are JUNK compared to the newer products that SEAL against an "O" ring and that bis what softens the shock of the fiber reed banging against the metal cage killing the life. In our race motors ( All of them even lake race motors ) )that turn 10,850 + we were destroying a set of reeds each session and with the conversion to the vulcanised reed cage we go 1/2 the season without seeing a leak of a failure and even a increases in performance to boot ! As they are as large as the 14 pedal , a direct replacement and they are 10 petal they flow better. The leaking of a reed is the same as a leaking intake valve on a 4 stroke motor . If one insists on running the antique , short lived pieces I hold them up to the light and if you see light your leaking and HP and idle quality is down the drain!

from my experience,

[steve]

I believe he IS talking about the rubber coated cages, not the uncoated cages. Only he's got the 4 petal rubber coated not the 5 petal and he wants to run the factory steel reeds on them.

[Jay Smith]

With the rubber coated cages anything should seal !

CALL me Steve ASAP......

1 281 576 5088 cst !

[dashrockwell]

Thanks Steve for clearifing the rubber cages and thanks Jay for the information..

Always a pleasure here on S&F!