New BRP/Rotax OB?

[Instigator]

Always thought they were too smart to just walk away from this business segment.

https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/brp-transforms-the-boating-experience-with-all-new-manitou-alumacraft-and-quintrex-models-and-the-groundbreaking-rotax-outboard-engine-with-stealth-technology-301601181.html

[Turtleherder]

Talk about a super short shaft. Hope those engine cover gaskets last a reeeaaally long time for your average boater.

[David - WI]

508594

[DangerNewb]

Wow, hope that thing is sealed up well. At least half the motor would be underwater at rest? Seems like a problem waiting to happen.

[TooStroked]

Having the engine set that low is great for the center of gravity. For everything else - especially water intrusion - it's a bad thing. But that's just this man's opinion.

[John S]

Always admired BRP. Their snow machines changed the industry. Leaders, not followers.

[David - WI]

Seems like it would limit your repower options and the market for used engine... unless it really takes over the market.

[noli]

.


will we see this at the Ft Lauderdale / Miami boat shows?


lovin' the design!


makes it look like an I/O but it's not


woooohoooo!!!







.

[FUJIMO]

Seems like it would limit your repower options and the market for used engine... unless it really takes over the market.
...not sold separately...

[InjectorService]

Same junk, just now half under water. These guys really like an ass kicking dont they?

EDIT: I'm just completely baffled by this actually. They leave the outboard market completley after refusing to produce a 4-stroke even though all of the other manufactures have switched, and the market demands it (like it or not)..... leave their customers and dealers high and dry with warranty, parts etc.

THEN come back with this "new - old" design, 4-stroke, PWC / outboard apparatus and want to bring it to market?

WHO IS RUNNING THIS COMPANY?!?!?!

[James45157]

Lools like the 3 cylinder 150 hp motor they came out with before they stopped making motors would be a 2 cycle

[RiverRat71]

Lools like the 3 cylinder 150 hp motor they came out with before they stopped making motors would be a 2 cycle
If you're referring to the 951 DI motor & that's what it is then personally I would'nt even consider one. Can't imagine BRP/Rotax would bring that back to marine. RR

[engineermike]

Same junk, just now half under water. These guys really like an ass kicking dont they?

EDIT: I'm just completely baffled by this actually. They leave the outboard market completley after refusing to produce a 4-stroke even though all of the other manufactures have switched, and the market demands it (like it or not)..... leave their customers and dealers high and dry with warranty, parts etc.

THEN come back with this "new - old" design, 4-stroke, PWC / outboard apparatus and want to bring it to market?

WHO IS RUNNING THIS COMPANY?!?!?!

This is the evinrude “ghost” project that was announced in 2020, killed as part of evinrude, but then dusted off and rebadged BRP. Oh, and it’s 2-stroke. My money says it’s still-born/doa.

[RiverRat71]

Same junk, just now half under water. These guys really like an ass kicking dont they?

EDIT: I'm just completely baffled by this actually. They leave the outboard market completley after refusing to produce a 4-stroke even though all of the other manufactures have switched, and the market demands it (like it or not)..... leave their customers and dealers high and dry with warranty, parts etc.

THEN come back with this "new - old" design, 4-stroke, PWC / outboard apparatus and want to bring it to market?

WHO IS RUNNING THIS COMPANY?!?!?!
If it was a 1501 4Tec engine it would be a possibility. Good proven engines. RR

[DangerNewb]

I tend to agree with the above assessment. A lower unit under water is one thing. A breathing engine under water is a different kettle of fish.

[RiverRat71]

I tend to agree with the above assessment. A lower unit under water is one thing. A breathing engine under water is a different kettle of fish.
I agree as well. First we have to get past the engine being a piece of sh!t. RR

[FUJIMO]

...hey, you said someone needed to make a short shaft 2 stroke for the smaller v-bottoms again. here it is...;)...

[RiverRat71]

...hey, you said someone needed to make a short shaft 2 stroke for the smaller v-bottoms again. here it is...;)...
Not quite, lol. RR

[Instigator]

It’s almost a Sea Drive!

[half fast]

Competitive manufacturers often purchase the competition’s new offerings to evaluate and study it . I bet Mercury just said , nah we’re good .

[LakeFever]

You have to hand it to BRP, the company does not rest on the laurels, they innovate! Good things come from those who take this approach. As a sled guy ive heard all the knocks at them when they innovated to an entirely new platform twenty years ago. Even i was skeptical but the winning of most championships and literally every other sled manufacturer attempting to copy them still to this day and are still playing catch up. The market might be now finally equalizing but it took twenty years. This new outboard deal is the second big innovation from BRP this year to launch and thats super cool

whether any of us buy these products or not, this innovative approach will promote the same from Merc and Yami which is good for all camps. Look at the performance car market for instance, the LS whipped em all so bad it relit the entire performance genre back to life and now you can buy a turn key 720hp Ram TRX because of it.

i always salut the innovators even if they are not my preferred brand. If we didnt? Well what was that thing they built over yonder called? A Laga? Oh wait it was a Yuga, no wait i think it might have been Laduh and yougobarf ;)

[pcrussell50]

Innovation … Innovative solutions to problems. I’m all for it. So what problem is this new design solving? Center of gravity? I can see that in a racing engine. Is higher CG really a problem that needs solving among the other 99% of users?

-Peter

[John S]

If you look at the boats in the link, it looks like the reasoning is to get the motor in a spot that maximizes transom space/ limits noise. Everyone is a critic. Have any of you detractors done any type of research other than looking at the above link? I'd like to see some crazy sumbich bolt one on to a viper or the like. Maybe a CF Nass (or whoever is making them now) cowl....

[scott reierson]

Wow Amazing...We saw that Ghost idea 4+ Years ago at a BRP press release.

To the best of my knowledge BRP still owns Manitou & Alumacraft. Also Telwater in Australia with Quintex, Stacer, Savage & Yellowfin Plate

If they package that drive in a well marketed Feature, Benefit, Advantage campaign with competitive price and attractive monthly payment in addition to the long BRP 7-10 yr promo warranty it will sell.

It will be interesting to see if it gets off the runway and gets traction. Spare Aluminum prop sales should be good.

If it does gain traction after its still birth, I would imagine they already have the electric motor spec to fit in the housing, with a marine style battery pack similar to what we've in the electric boat prototypes. Lots of stuff goin on with electric OB motor deveopement right now in the PE segment

[LakeFever]

Innovation … Innovative solutions to problems. I’m all for it. So what problem is this new design solving? Center of gravity? I can see that in a racing engine. Is higher CG really a problem that needs solving among the other 99% of users?

-Peter

i really dont know but i doubt its just sales gimmickery from BRO because if it is? That will be a first that ive seen. They must have some reason for it. Could be as simple as putting easy to spot distance from the competition? They sure tried to do this with the etec ob’s then merc quickly revamped their look to similar only better imo. This move will be very hard to emulate quickly for the other camps. If this system proves popular with customers? Well, then it would be a smart move. If it doesn’t catch on that will be that i suppose. Price point will make a big impact on sales vs competition so we will have to see how that plays out

the market demand has shifted to quiet, unseen etc so this plays into that. Also might be a preface to some electric ob all in one? Ya never know but im sure it will be innovative

[David]

It has an extra 90 degree turn for the power. How much loss would that be?

[FUJIMO]

If you look at the boats in the link, it looks like the reasoning is to get the motor in a spot that maximizes transom space/ limits noise. Everyone is a critic. Have any of you detractors done any type of research other than looking at the above link? I'd like to see some crazy sumbich bolt one on to a viper or the like. Maybe a CF Nass (or whoever is making them now) cowl....
...on an aired out viper would be good...and at the same time...help you from blow'n over...

[LakeFever]

I wonder how much the displacement of the engine cradle/pan adds buoyancy? With the ultra low cg if one of these in the 250hp range will hang off the back of a stream without sinking it? That could change things a LOT and not just for stream owners. There are millions of good 18’ish boats still out there that cant float those merc motors

[RiverRat71]

I wonder how much the displacement of the engine cradle/pan adds buoyancy? With the ultra low cg if one of these in the 250hp range will hang off the back of a stream without sinking it? That could change things a LOT and not just for stream owners. There are millions of good 18’ish boats still out there that cant float those merc motors
Agree a 1000%. Still got to get past the motor longevity, water intrusion aspect & the gay factor, lol. RR

[FUJIMO]

...i could be mistaken, but i think BRP only makes, and has made for many years, just a 4 stroke, and a 2 stroke version of this little inline rotax engine. they were carb motors forever & nowadays they are efi. it didnt cost them a fortune to put this marketing experiment together. others will definately know more than i do regarding this one(really two) engine(s), that they produce...

[RiverRat71]

...i could be mistaken, but i think BRP only makes, and has made for many years, just a 4 stroke, and a 2 stroke version of this little inline rotax engine. they were carb motors forever & nowadays they are efi. it didnt cost them a fortune to put this marketing experiment together. others will definately know more than i do regarding this one(really two) engine(s), that they produce...

The 951 DI was the last 2 cycle engine in the PWC's & it was very problematic with the air fuel. The carbed engines were less problematic, ran great & made good power for the displacement as did the DI when it ran. The 951 didn't like water ingestion/intrusion at all which is why I say it would be a bad idea for this design. All 951's to some degree needed a lot of petting. Not even sure this is the same engine. RR

[perfmarine1]

Looks to me like they're dumbest idea yet.:confused:

[JFL]

Will insurance cover it if you hit an obstacle underwater and the whole thing comes off the transom?
Technology Under Rear Deck, T.U.R.D

[kellytheaker]

Personally - I would prefer to know exactly the tech on this piece when available - meaning #1 -just how submerged
2 stroke - 4 stroke -
Cost and such before the accolades and the bashing .
It does seem very similar to the Ghost system that had been next up before the exit

[FUJIMO]

...does insurance cover this issue for a regular outboard?...

[FUJIMO]

...who are the dealers to buy them & service them? have no idea...

[engineermike]

Kelly it’s 2-stroke. The piston ports are evident in the picture. And I’d bet a steak dinner that it IS the ghost that they simply delayed a couple years and renamed.

Regarding the engine relative to the water level, most pwc’s are like that already. There are strainers in the bilge hooked to a Venturi in the jet pump such that they are always evacuating whatever leaks in as long as the engine is running. I would imagine the engine has something like a crank driven bilge pump. As misguided as the concept is (to me, at least), the engineers at rotax have experience with this stuff and aren’t dummies.

[FUJIMO]

...as long as the engine is running...

[LakeFever]

Low cg, less weight, BRP knows how to make wickedly powerful, clean burning and reliable two strokes. Plenty to be excited about in my eyes. Id buy a new merc 250 if the damn thing wouldnt sink my boat. Am i alone here? I dont mind the looks of it i think it would look awesome hanging off a stream

of course maybe they come in heavy and unsuitable so we shall see

[baja200merk]

The way they sealed the g2 cowls is as pathetic as this entire design. :rolleyes:

[Chaz]

Chaz = thinkin, Welp ... if Kevin don't like it ... they're fugizzled ... :o

[InjectorService]

Yes, they do have experience with Seadoos (obviously), the only difference there is that the hull is one piece and sealed from water intrusion. These would need a removable cowl of some sort for service, maning plenty of areas for water coming in. As mentioned above, the G2s were prone to water coming in.

I mean come on guys this is only Evinrude's 1000th chance at making a decent product, this will be the time, THEY PROMISE!

And as mentioned above, they just destroyed their delaer network, customer relations etc.

[Sutphil]

What's a dealer network? Order on-line and it's delivered to your dock.

[FUJIMO]

https://th.bing.com/th/id/R.c495846a4ab7723fcbc5fe176ace0000?rik=bQ2Qhp5wuv8F5g&riu=http%3a%2f%2fwww.quickmeme.com%2fimg%2f85%2f8563b1b90da4c64b280d9383b9f3f6d3741bf6e2f8169d305c1c 56ff33311c55.jpg&ehk=Wr0CjE30dyHg04L7SUuR1J7G5NoLXOOcaXcY1EBHb1k%3d&risl=&pid=ImgRaw&r=0

[baja200merk]

Yes, they do have experience with Seadoos (obviously), the only difference there is that the hull is one piece and sealed from water intrusion. These would need a removable cowl of some sort for service, maning plenty of areas for water coming in. As mentioned above, the G2s were prone to water coming in.

I mean come on guys this is only Evinrude's 1000th chance at making a decent product, this will be the time, THEY PROMISE!

And as mentioned above, they just destroyed their delaer network, customer relations etc.
1000% agreed but it is not an Evinrude. The only thing you can see when the boat is sitting at idle is

ROTAX

[InjectorService]

OMC/Johnson/Evinrude = just names that are scrapped for the next "big" thing..... Call it what you want..... its an EVINRUDE

[H2OPERF]

It could be made to work i'm sure but if they have the same team of engineers on it as the G2 project then i would not expect much from it... G1 Etecs will be running long after the G2s are all in the scrap yards.

[David]

Other then weight and cowl sealing, what was worse with the G2s? I like our G1. It’s easier to maintain then an opti

[H2OPERF]

The list would be long but the sad part is the few things that failed on the g1s they put right on the g2 which shows the ignorance along with a dash of arrogance.

[FUJIMO]

...brp recently bought this manatou pontoon boat company, so they could introduce this engine & design the type of transom it needed. it uses the etec fuel injection that was on the evinrudes, weighs 500 pounds, and is a 25'' shaft outboard. guess they will have to tool up some of their own, new line of low pitch stainless propellers to go with them, or private label somebody elses...https://www.manitoupontoonboats.com/content/manitou/en_us/discover-manitou/advantages/rotax/_jcr_content/root/helperblock.coreimg.jpeg/1659453687956/manitou-my23-alpha-rec-expl-22-swibktb-s150-shp-carbon-shark-grey-34bk-na-rotax-34-feature-raw-rgb.jpeg?imwidth=1024

[H2OPERF]

Hope those back cover housings are pretty tough, we all know no body in a pontoon ever backs into a dock... one little crack and uh-oh. I would think it has a water sensor and a bilge pump but knowing that crew i doubt it..

[RSWORDS]

...brp recently bought this manatou pontoon boat company, so they could introduce this engine & design the type of transom it needed. it uses the etec fuel injection that was on the evinrudes, weighs 500 pounds, and is a 25'' shaft outboard. guess they will have to tool up some of their own, new line of low pitch stainless propellers to go with them, or private label somebody elses...https://www.manitoupontoonboats.com/content/manitou/en_us/discover-manitou/advantages/rotax/_jcr_content/root/helperblock.coreimg.jpeg/1659453687956/manitou-my23-alpha-rec-expl-22-swibktb-s150-shp-carbon-shark-grey-34bk-na-rotax-34-feature-raw-rgb.jpeg?imwidth=1024

A 500lb 150? Good job BRP LMAO

[DangerNewb]

Not sure where all the weight is coming from. 3 cylinder 2 stroke?? Guess all the cowling and extra driveshaft joint and hardware?

Anyhow, the whole thing looks like a lot of problems waiting to happen.