Gearcase lube

[signpro]

Whats the best for a CLE?? Been using green merc lube, what about the fully synthetic lubes??

Thanks

CHRIS

[Talon2.5]

i stick with the merc high perf lube on the lower unit

[Markus]

A transmission is one of the places where a synthetic lube really makes a difference since it is not burned as in a two-stroke engine or polluted as in a four-stroke engine, and the lifetime is therefore only limited by the properties of the lubricant itself.

There are plenty of non-marine synthetic gear lubes out there. However, they typically do not have the same ability to disperse water as marine OEM oils do.

[TD]

I like the synthetic from Wal-Mart.

[heath brinkley]

I use Mobil1 synthetic gear lube.

[Markus]

I use Quaker State Synchron 75W90 100% synthetic gear lube. The same product used to be sold as Quaker State Itasca 75W90 100% synthetic marine gear lube.

[Jay Smith]

I like the Pennzoil 100 % syn gear lube I have a co- worker that is a salt water fisherman and as we work only 4 days a week he fished last year 143 times out, ( No BS he has the records ) He has a 90 HP Yammy and since I have been at his unit ( 7 years ) he has used the Pennzoil products ( 100 % syn gear lubes and 2 cycle oil ) and he has been totally satisified. Most of the guys on these boards give testimony to a product that they use at most 3-4 times a month this guys uses a product 143 times a year to me THATS a testimony !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Winger Ed.]

After seeing a 5 gallon can of generic 'High pressure gear lubricant 80-90' with a pump in it sitting on the floor of the local boat dealer's service area, and asking others to look for a similar item in other local shops, I quit buying the tubes of lower unit oil years ago.

I don't use my boats like a Game Warden or CG type does, or race, but I get out a fair amount.

And, I change the unit's oil twice a year, at the start of the season, then check for water the first & about the 4th time out. If it's OK, I run it till Fall and change it then.

After seeing the generic stuff at the boat shop, and having a couple of other guys see one in their mechanic's place, I just get a premium rear end lube, about the 3-4 dollar a quart variety, like Castrol or Valvoline in the plastic quart bottles at the auto parts store.

After about 20 years, no ill effects.

I figure,

'the gears, case, bearings, and seals in a lower unit are made basically the same as the rear end or manuel tranmission in a car. In the hours ya run a boat, what is going on in there(check for water) that a lube which will last years - and tens of thousands of miles in a car, won't do OK for the relatively few hours we get to use a boat' between changing intervals'?


I can see it now....... *chuckle*
I get the same teeth grinding reaction from purists on the hunting/shooting boards.

We'll have a discussion going about the best gun oils. and it'll have posts from guys that only use some exoctic extraction from the rump of an ardvark, or something you can only get in small 3cc viles stollen from NASA.

Then I'll chime in with, "I use a lot of Castrol 10-40. What is a firearm going ot ask of that oil in between cleanings, that is beyond what a car engine needs it do do for a few thousand miles"?


Ed.


(Don't worry yourself to death over crazy people,
After you're dead, they'll still be crazy)

[Ron V]

I just use 85W-140 hypoid oil that I buy in gallon jugs from Walmart for something like $7. The 85W-140 is a little thicker so if you have a slightly weak seal it won't leak out as easy and has a little bit more meat to it if some water gets in. The oil that comes out after an entire season always looks as good as the day it went in.

[Markus]

The oil I am referring to may well be the same oil that Jay's fisherman friend is using given Pennzoil's acquisition of Quaker State.

[Ziemer]

Isn't part of the question for a good lower unit lube is how well it absorbs water or mixes with the actual lube???

I know, a gearcase shouldn't leak, but... anything submerged in water turning 1000's of RPM's is bound to get a little bit of water inside of it once in awhile, and I know the high performance Mercury lube does a real good job at this.

Just a thought.

[Markus]

Ziemer, you are right, see my post above.

However, I would take superior lubrication over superior water dispersion.

[Jeff_G]

In an outboard lower unit the forces it is under are not the same as a car or truck. First of all any time the engine is running the drivershft, pinion gear, forward, reverse gears, and all bearings are turning, unlike a auto rear end. In addition we regularly turn out motors 5,000 to 6,000+ rpm. That means the drive shaft is turning the same! Never in a car or truck.
On the top of the lower unit is a water pump that is always trying to pump water into the lower unit, sometimes at 20+ PSI!
We also run our gearcases in the water. Duh... But what this does is create heat in the gearcase with cool or cold water outside the case. although this helps with overheating the case it also creates condensation problems.
In short an outboard gearcase is not even remotely comparable to a car or truck and as such those products should not be used. Period.
Many marine dealers use the cheapest gear oil they can buy. Then charge the same price as for premium gear oil. In addition the bulk gear oil can become contaminated from condensation and dirt while sitting on the shop floor.
Gear oil should be stored in a plastic container that is sealed. Or in a pressurized container like a gearcase filler.
I see the effects of cheap gear oil every day. Just 2 days ago I spent over an hour cleaning out a gearcase, upper drive and oil resivoir from the use of the wrong gear oil. What a mess! Totally clogging the res. hose to the drive!
For Mercruisers I use only Mercury High Performance. For outboards I use either the Mercury High Performance or a 100% synthetic like the Pennzoil, LubriMatic etc. For OMC, either the High Performance or Hi-Vis from Lubrimatic or OMC. And Electric shift Type C only.
So it depends on the application. I never use generic auto type gear oils.
I make my living working on outboards and IO's. My reputation depends on the materials I use.
Why scrimp to save $2 by using inferior gear lube. You would not believe the damage I have seen to gears and particularly bearings by cheap oils (burning) and not changing the oil frequently enough.
Ron V. The thicker gear oil won't help if the seals are compromised. The two biggest problems are, fishing line tearing the rear seals and the seals under the water pump going bad. If the water pump seals go bad the higher pressure from the water pump will literally push out the gear oil through another seal, until the gearcase is filled with water.
A higher viscosity oil really has no added benifit in an outboard. In fact in a high performance application will slow the boat.
Sorry for the long soapbox.

[Winger Ed.]

Jeff,

Good shot.

I never thought of it that way.

I always figured:

'Spinning Gears & roller bearings is spinning gears & roller bearings'.

And, In a good year, I'll change the rear end ,,,,ahhh,,,, lower unit lube once, maybe twice in the 'ole 1968--- but overhauled Mercuriser, or the 50hp stack 4 Merc. outboard.

I asked myself,

"What will one lube do that the other can't in one application where I run it for a year or so, in all climates, at all speeds, under load, towing overloaded trailers uphill, etc. etc. that
it can't handle for a few hours under EXTREME conditions between changing."

Thanks.

I shall rethink this.


Hey,
Have ya had any experiance or been privy to horror stories with guys using that $15 a quart Valvoline racing rear end lube in OBs?

.........................No matter how bad it gets,,,,,,,,,,,


,,,,,,,,,,,,,, never forget,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, There are worse ways to make a living...................

[Markus]

Jeff, I fully agree with the conclusions of your post. However, marine and automotive lubes may actually be exactly the same product in different bottles as this story shows:

I once ordered Quaker State Itasca 100% 75W90 Synthetic Marine gear lube, but got Quaker State Synchron 100% Synthetic 75W90 (automotive) gear lube from the distributor. Noting that I the product numbers were almost the same, I contacted Quaker State in the U.S. before complaining to the distributor.

I got hold of a lubrication engineer at Quaker State and he told me that the marine lube and the automotive lube was exactly the same product.

That is why I expect the Merc OEM lube to be better at dispersing water and why I no longer care about whether it says marine or not on the bottle as long as it says 100% synthetic on the packaging and the viscosity is right.

[Jeff_G]

I can not speak to what Quaker State may have done. I do know there are differences in Mercury's gear lube from a normal automotive gear lube. One advantage is the ability to absorb very small amounts of water.
One must also be very careful in which lubes they use and the possible mixtures. I had a Mercruiser that started out life with Merc. lube. Down the line the owner added a little Hi-Vis from Wally World to the res. to top it off. Within 6 months the resultant mixture was like a thin clay. Took over an hour to clean the bottle and lines. Never mix lubes.
If it doesn't say marine I won't use it. I can't take the chance that it may be compatable. (I don't like to eat work).

[Ron V]

Jeff, you only missed one thing in your long explanation: a boat has the world's biggest automatic transmission (the lake) to absorb the shock to the drivetrain. Like I said, I've never had a problem with the regular hypoid oil. The thicker stuff may cause a little extra drag, but I'm also tired of hearing guys (especially the bass fishermen) spouting off about 200-400 rpm gains with synthetic oil. They make these blanket statements that they think apply to every rig. That would be a 2-4 mph gain for me. No way. No way in hell. $1000 worth of dicking around with setback, engine height, and props didn't produce that. I had full synthetic lube in my lower unit once and it didn't make ANY difference, but it was indeed good lube. As far as the thicker oil helping when water gets in, all I know is that I started using it after my uncle (who is a factory trained mechanic) mentioned a few years back that the insurance companies were requesting the use of thicker oil because of so many fraudulent underwater collision insurance claims due to gearcase failures (people lunch the gears and then smash the housing with a sledge hammer and get it fixed for free less the deductible). That's not to say that insurance companies really researched it very well, but I've never had a problem with it.

Ron

[Stoker100]

An additive called Energy Release (ER), combined with Royal purple full synthetic gear oil has done me well. I have been spinning a bravo 1 up to 6,000 rpm and running 95 mph. change oil every fall, never smells burned. I don't use a shower. Most stock Bravo 1s would fry in this condition, that's why showers are so popular. I also pick-up proshaft HP due to the less friction.

[Hooty]

I stuff my gear case with banana peels.

c/6

Hooty

[optimax135]

I would stick with the Merc lube because it is designed to absorb 30 percent water and still lubricate to it's full capacity. If you do change lube make sure you allow your gearcase to drain for a couple of days before refilling with the new gear lube, some don't work well together when mixed and getting most of the old lube out before refilling is best. I'm a firm believer in sticking with the original oil since birth of the product and not changing oil unless tore down and cleaned or rebuilt. Hope this helps!

[Markus]

Your right, Jeff. Merc's gear lube does absorb water better. That is what I mean by water dispersion in one of my posts above. On automotive gear lubes, you actually want the water to fall out as quickly as possible from what I understand, so it is a major difference.

For people who turn their engines to 8000 rpms, the increased longevity and lubrication ability of a full synthetic would out-weigh the water dispersion ability of Merc's lube, in my opinion, though.

[Liberator25]

Lubricantion Engineers makes the best Gear Lube you can buy. The product for outboard lower ends is Almaosl #607. It will NOT mix with water and will lube even if water is present. Water is not a good lube and if it mixes with the oil (like merc says) it makes the gear lube not work as well. This stuff sticks to the gears and shafts for months and won't run off. If you have water entry, it will ALWAYS be at the bottom and can actually be drained off!! Expensive but worth it.

http://www.le-inc.com