Adding a pad -new question

[Bob T]

Been thinking about it for a while ,reading all the great posts and almost have worked up the nerve.One thing I've wondered about-when prepping the hull for bonding,do I need to grind off all the gelcoat (commitment) or can I bond to the gel?I plan to use spruce cut to angle as well as Bondo 2Part Marine Epoxy,through bolted through the stringers I recently installed while replacing the floor and transom.Any suggestions?Thanks BT

[Gerben]

First decrease everything.
I'd sand through the gelcoat till you hit the mat/fibers. Sand with very course grit.+- 24.

Do you plan to fill in the area between the spruce with epoxy?
Please remember that epoxy on it's own has virtually no strength. Add a lot of fibers to it.

My 0.02
Gerben

[Bob T]

Gerben,Thanks for the reply.I plan to place fiberglass mat in between the hull and the pad ,soak it in epoxy,then more epoxy with some milled 'glass as filler.BT

[sho305]

I know bondo/filler/epoxy is heavy, so I am at odds what to use for filler there when I do mine. I am thinking wood or foam. Kind of leaning to foam and matting sections like little stringers. Just use 1" insulation foam for a shape/filler more or less, not really structural. Then good mat over all of it for durability. Thought about that after seeing empty stringers in a Hydrostream on here.

It would be real easy to cut wood for a smaller thing like a strake though. Not sure how hard the foam would be to work with.:confused:

[Bob T]

Sho.Thanks for your input.Not sure I like your idea about using foam though.I think over the long haul it will break apart and leave you with a boat you just want to 'pull the plug' on and deep six . Also my plan is to experiment with various parameters such as width, setback from transom etc to see whats gonna work b4 I make it permanent.A skilled carpenter friend says it,s no problem to cut /shape the wood as I want.SAys he'll use a power planer and wedges.BT

[sho305]

I am sure wood is the easy way. I think one could rip/fit the shape into stringers and mount them, then bend ply over them. I was thinking foam mostly for a rot-proof thing. I am sure if I used the foam this way, I would have to do some heavy mat like the hull skin is maybe 3/8" thick. It would have to hold the boat up just like the bottom does now, but then it would be all glass and a done deal. This hull has no core and the stringers are about 24" each side of the pad, so the skin must have some strength.

I was thinking I might be able to contour a good 2x12 even, but it could warp. Still may do that; as I think the temp/testing is a good idea with a pad on a non-pad hull. I will try it first, but was thinking about the foam for the permanent one. I don't know what relief I will need. See my other foam pad thread for pics of mine. It has a pad but it is flat and too small at 7". I am going to see what a jack does first, but I know it will not cure it. Whatever I end up with will go on my Checkmate with some adjustment hopefully.

Maybe something like this with foam-

[Bob T]

Sho.Your initial post was the motivator for my post.thanks!I reread some of it tonight .Look at' Racemore's 'initial post where he worries about the foam breaking up at an inopportune moment.I guess I like the idea of a SOLID one piece core.Also I felt that by using good epoxy to seal it ,I would limit the chance of rot/warpage.Let me know how yours works out.Hope it SCREAMSandFLIES!!
BT

[sho305]

I think I have 3 or 4 pad threads now:confused: Still trying to find out if a slight rise helps stability or just water quality. Need to order some reading material from Aeromarine:eek: They say under about 8 degrees will not loose much lift, but anyway...I just worry about hitting big wakes and flying too much. That is fun until you miss seeing one...

I was thinking the cheap house pink foam here, and not as structural like the real hull foam. This stuff is real light and not very dense. It would have to be made such that if the foam were not there it would work. Just using it for a spacer/form really. I was thinking since the pad is maybe 2-3" high and 6' long it is not very large....so it would not be bad to make thick skinned/matted like a non-cored hull is. Maybe I'm wrong? Might be a little heavier than wood in the end, but never would rot.:cool:

Then again, this boat is not going to last forever anyway. Might even be able to do it all in vertical pieces so you had mat mini-stringers every inch for example. You could lay one up and do another later until it was done; then mat the whole thing good. I guess I would rather experiment on this so I can use it on something better later and know it works. The foam is so easy to shape, I was hoping it would not be much more time or work to do it that way, just more resin/mat and I'll buy a gallon anyway. Has to be lighter than bondo.

The other idea I had was to mix resin and huge light filler, like styrofoam from a beanbag with a little glass fiber in there too. Get it level so you can pour it all, then pour a layer and lay a piece of mat, repeat. Mat the outside some to finish. Maybe put a stringer/support every 6" of width or something. Seems like it would work for a little pad and that would be fast. I just can't see using solid filler like a cement block. A gallon of duroglass is real heavy, I have a few here.:)

Also thought of gluing the foam into a pad on the hull and shaping it, then making a mold to it....but getting it to fit the hull could be a pain.

Lots of ideas but I will have it here soon so I gotta pick one!

[woody2race]

IMHO you should minimize the material you add to the bottom & avoid cores. Boats flex a lot & a thick core won't flex. You can widen your pad with narrow wedges on each side of the pad. I would make them from laminated matt & poly resin. Avoid commercial fillers. Use a little mineral wool ( intended for this use - I got mine from Midwest FiberGlass in Chicago) mixed FG grinding dust & resin if necessary on top of the matt. Top with microspheres, FG dust & resin - not more than 1/16".

Wide pads that extend to the transom will cause a harsher ride at speed & require more set-back. It will probably degrade high speed turning also.

[sho305]

Thanks Woody2race, that is a valid point about flex. Was thinking the pad area would not flex much, but likely it does some.

Problem I have with this odd project, is the 90hp transom is not that great even though I made it better than new. I also do not want the hassle of rigging lots of setback on it. But, being the bowrider and so-so hull it is I am sure it needs more than the 5-6" plate I am putting on it. With the flat flush pad on it I am hoping to raise it up about 2" so I can relieve it about 8-10" and the transom will clear the water. I hope this raising does not hose up the turning/handling of it, but most pads are raised.

I wish I could just add to the sides, but I know it will not work. Now I run about all the trim it will go. I am thinking of doing some larger negative strakes aside and above the pad also, and all the way back to the transom/or enlarging the current ones. I'm not a marine engineer though, so no conclusion about that yet. I would guess the current full strakes would be high and dry after adding the pad.

I think I will put a wood temp pad on there and see what happens. I'll start with a 2x12 size and cut it down if I can.

I did look at a bass boat that had a slight vee'd pad, then some steep rise, then a good sized negative strake above the pad that went all the way back. Maybe this would be a good way to make it turn/ride better, but would be harder to make here and a little slower.

[Bob T]

Sho..In your last post you talk about negative strakes.What do you mean by that?I hate to be the dummy

[sho305]

Traditional strakes would be flat if you looked at the transom on a trailer level. The deadrise goes up from the pad to the chine, and the strakes would have a 0 angle being flat. Most hulls now are going a little negative angle to them, so the surface of the strake is angled toward the pad a little. To keep a bit more water from escaping past them toward the chine, as well as directing the water off the center/pad down for lift instead of just out.

Now some boats are going for more and the strakes angle down a lot. Most use a vee'd pad that handles easier, then some rise and this negative strake to direct all that water back down. This might help to make some lift at the strake instead of all at the pad for more stability, I don't know. On one of these pad threads there is a link to a patent site for a bass boat with lots of it in pics there. A flat pad will be faster, but a bassboat for example needs to handle reasonably well. I think that is why they are trying these type of strakes. When it is in the water each strake is a sort of pad surface of its own, and they affect holeshot and turning too. I'm just trying to get an idea of how they are working without being a hull engineer:D :eek:

[Bob T]

Thanks ,I get it now.A thought I've been pondering for a while....As I said previously about testing with a removable pad ,I was going to try some strakes as well.I was going to try them as conventional strakes as well as reversing them to form a shallow tunnel with the pad.I think it may work as my boat has a very shallow'V'.i.e 12degrees.Any thoughts?BT

[sho305]

Everyone here said no to the tunnel thing. I have seen lots of them with the relief area behind the pad tunneled in with strakes however. Could have something to do with turning, but it seems that a flat pad is best and anything else in the water like a fin or vee slows you down. I try to take heed of what I see, because lots of people have made boats and tried stuff. If you don't see it...likely it don't work. That can also trap too much air in there, and cause you to have to run the motor lower (and slower) if you are able to run it high. One of the Hydrostreams has shoulders on the edges of the pad. It is still only about 8" wide, but they are so light. You could try it temp anyway.

I think it might not help because the water will go away from the heavy hull nomatter, and you can't trap it really. The surface of the water is hardest, so that is what you want to use most. If for example you cut a pipe in half and used that as a round channel, I don't think it would get anymore lift because the water below the trapped water would go away just as fast as a flat pad. And, you would have more surface area against the water to slow you. Just me thinking. Kinda like a plane, the best wing is straight and flat and horizontal, not angled much if any. I think when the wing is on the bottom of a plane they angle it enough to make it stable, just like a vee in a boat. Except they don't have waves to deal with.

I am guessing the reversed/negative chines have more effect on holeshot and handling, as well as a little extra lift. I bet they ride harder too.

My jackplate has been sent! Can't wait. Also, checkout www.ocke.se , they have turned down strakes. Note how they place them just ahead and out of the water, but not in the water(while wot on plane). Seem to use them to force water down and maybe to create air bubbles to go under the hull.

[sho305]

Here is the latest pad and strake mods I have been playing with for mine. Black is the hull, green and tan the modifications. I'm thinking 12" wide pad due to the very slight vee I want, and the low 50mph speeds it will be at for now. Hoping the vee will be a bit more stable. I figure it is pointless/impossible to try to balance this BR hull to the pad. Not completely sure about extending the strakes like that for size, but want something back there for turning and lifting at holeshot. I worry about a big negative chine near the pad acting strange on a high speed turn, as this hull is not designed for it. As it is now, it slides around corners with the flush pad.

[Racemore]

Foam.I'm not sure which thread or at what point I made reservations about foam but it's hard to recommend foam in general becuase of the different types.I've seen bottoms with foam core delaminate that were laid up in the mold.If I wanted to use foam for this appication it would be Last-o-Foam made by General Plastics.It is closed cell and comes in weights by cubic ft.The 20# foam would be the choice for a pad.It is strong enough to replace wood in a transom and has superior bonding and a very high compression aspect.It can be shaped and done properly would be exellent.When I padded my boat was 84 and I didn't know about this product or if it was even available.I used Marine-Tex and chopped fiberglass.As far as a tunnel leading to the pad that is what I did and it worked great.There is a discription of the pad on one of the threads.STV uses a concave v pad and it works well.So did mine.I might have just got lucky or maybe just good depending on who's talking but at WFO in a light ripple I could feel the boat tap the top of the water slightly due to the compression on water and air.I did it on a round bottom also.It didn't change the turning hardly at all but that style boat had to be driven though a turn anyway.I gained maybe 5-8 mph by lifting the boat higher in the water and easier to drive through Chine walk to a steady easier controlled ride.If I can help with any info feel free to call.good luck Lonnie.904-813-8201:cool: On the pad.:)

[Bob T]

Sho,great pic! gotta get my kids to show me how to do that.Thanks for the description of how it works.I love learn'n stuff especially if it lets me go faster w/o a lotta $$$My thought is very similar to what you've drawn.The very out side strakes where the ones I planned to invert ie. the tall side facing the pad in order to trap some air.I may just try it for giggles.I'll keep you posted.

[Bob T]

Racemore.Thanks for the reply!!Your picture shows a hull VERY similar to my J Craft.Now you've really whet my appetite.Maybe it'll work.!!!Couldn''t find the thread you refered to .What forum was it on?Thanks again BT

[Racemore]

The thread is on this forum just below,"Glassing a pad on a V,foam?" and the basic discription of my pad is on the first page.It'is fairly understandable but if you want to call I can clarify a few points about the lift and double concave entery. the difference is pretty dramatic over the round bottom.Any questions feel free to call.Lonnie :cool: 904-813-8201 Sea ya.

[sho305]

I just use the paint program that comes with windows in accesories. If you make it open a .jpg file it learns to save in .jpg, what you need for the board. Play with it for a few minutes, it is real simple and easy-though limited.

I guess that pads flow water like this at the transom except for a fast boat like Racemores there, that is completely on the pad. I think the heavier hulls use the neg strakes to get a hair more lift as they never get totally on the pad, or they work at medium speeds(also might grab more at the stern in turns). Except for the pad lift area needed to float your weight, the less wetted the better. I can see on my bayliner how the water will go up the hull until the first strake, quite a ways since the first strake ends 18" from the transom. So I have wet hull half way to the chine coming off the back:rolleyes: A shouldered pad would help until it was too deep in the water.(I think no shoulder helps it slide in turns too) I'm told the 'A' pad would be slower due to the strakes/sides deep in the water all the time making friction.

If nobody says the slight 5 degree vee in a pad will help stability, then I will not bother. Not running a LWP; then I would not have it jacked high enough to have air problems anyway.

I am guessing the entry to get air would be something like this at the start of the pad, gradually turning to flat at last 16" or so for my 16'.

[Racemore]

Don't know if this will work,The bottom drawing is the bottom (kinda) with the red showing the original rounded running surface.The top is the added pad.The red lines are the original bottom,the blue is the built up,the light blue is the concave area merging to the center and becoming flat with the last color the hook added to lift the boat higher and is rises to about 3/8" at the end of the pad.The concept was to trap the water and air packing to the center then flattening promoting pressure to lift at the hook area.In slick water at max speed the boat would slightly tap the water from the pressure created.The leading edge of the pad on each side radiused from 0 to the original bottom height in about 3"s which creates the tunnels on each side.Turning was never very good anyway but cruising I could turn thre wheel and the nose would turn but the boat went straight then more throttle would make it turn.It did it worse before the pad and would start spanking the water like an SK boat.Overall handling was much better,especaily above 70.:cool:

can't figure out the jpg thing yet.:(

[Reese]

you're obsessed with this pad thing...:D

The 5 degree angle will not help stability, but it does help to keep the aerated water from hitting the prop...not much difference either way.

All the little tricks like neg strakes, concave pads, A-pads are aids to a pad that is already too narrow. They work by creating additional pressure (and drag) on a pad that does not generate enough lift on its own.

For top speed a flat pad needs to be wide enough to require only 3-4 degree angle of attack, if you need to trim higher than that your pad is either too narrow or you need more HP.

[sho305]

That is cool I don't think it would work on my tub due to its greater weight, but I might be able to get some help using something similiar. Mine will have a couple foot in the water even on N2O...lol

Paint program is funny. If you can get it(force it) to open a .jpg file, then it will save and convert .bmp files to .jpg. Then you will see .jpg added to the list of file types you can pick when you save it(and can open them too). Before that it is not there & don't work for jpg. You may have to upgrade it if old. More unexplainable microsoft doings. I converted this one to .jpg in paint, so try to open it in paint and see if you have jpg then.

Once it works, it is very handy for simple stuff like this. You can zoom in too, to get a line perfect by pixel. You can even draw half a hull, and copy and flip it for the other half; so it is nice and even

Ya convinced me on the vee, I'll go flat. However, I might mess with some aireation since my drive will be plenty low. I think mine will be a matter of getting bubbles in there and not lifting this tub up with air, so no point in trying for air lift. I thought about glassing 1" pvc pipe inside there to carry air from the bow to the pad at wot. May be more of a pain than it is worth. First a plain old board for tuning. Going to happen soon, got my plate now :D

Racemore pad:

[Reese]

waisting your time trying to aerate that bottom.

Here's my thinking...take a made up boat that's running a 10 wide pad at top speed...now aerate the pad. You've now decreased the drag (maybe) of the running pad itself, but aerated water creates less lift for the same pad area so the entire boat must sit lower in the water, which creates more drag.

If you still want to play with an aerated pad, here is an idea I came up with that does away will all the hoses and holes...:D

[sho305]

I was thinking something like this, but hey, I'm not going to go to all the hassle if it don't work on this not-so-light-flyer.

I could do something like that since I will be adding this pad, air passage is no problem from transom. Just drill some holes in there @ an angle? It would be my suspension pad:D I put a shock absorber on there...:D Just kidding. lol:cool: Good idea.

I'm going 10"w x2" high resined wood for a tester then. I'll be able to adjust for the final one after I get setback figured for balance and clearance. 2" high will give 11" back of clearance at 10 degrees attack to transom, maybe enough. In fact, if I mounted it like that (your idea)I could keep chopping it off until it was right for relief...Under 10" I hope.

So how is that boating work of art you have going?

[Reese]

needs wide and deep.

If ya gonna do all that work go for a 12" wide pad...if you're not running any static setback I'd go for at least a 12" notch at the transom.

You'll need to be doing at least 55-60 mph before a 10" pad does anything...a 12" would work better, not to mention it should also help your holeshot.

[sho305]

I have a 5.5" CMC manual in my dirty little hands for it:D 275lb motor, hull is not that heavy, but no viper either. I lifted the bow by hand with the motor off, barely, maybe 200lbs+. 15' 10" overall, and I have some more weight to remove yet. Yeah, there is no way it can get up on the 7" pad it has now. It is a BR but the bow is tiny. Bow seats are nothing but the normal seats are heavy kinda, and the base is glassed in. Want to make sure it will get up with two people though, so maybe I do need more than 10". Just don't want it to turn into a ballistic rocket on a foot high wake...:eek:

[Reese]

I just realized this wasn't your thread...sorry BobT for rambling on.

Good idea on planning you setup to real world conditions...my own boat never has less than 3 people on it and about 300 lbs of ****.

Forgot it was only 16' long...how about we compromise and make the pad 11" wide with an 8" notch (5.5+8=13.5)

13.5" setback on a 16' boat sounds plenty to me...:D

[Bob T]

Reese.I'm learning lots,don't stop if ya got something even remotely relevant/vaguely irrelvant to add .I don't feel like it's 'my' thread.Keep it coming !Thanks BT

[Bob T]

Racemore,Sho305(what the heck does that mean anyhow) great art and info ,my juices are really flowing now.Thank you both.Racemore, I've seen wedges at the rear of a barefoot out board b4 .I assumed it was there to keep the bow planted and more hull in the water in order to track straight and true.My boat needs all the help it can get in terms of bow lift,so I'm not sure I want to go there.Am I missing something?BT

[sho305]

Darn S&F...see what happens? Posting all kinds of stuff...addictive as boats.;)

I would hope to have it run ok with four people, but two is good. I think I will mock up one like you suggested with the overhang. I can use a 1/2" ply, and maybe a good straight 2x12 hanging if I find one and set it at 6" relief...then I can chop it off to 8" or what ever:D That would be 2" plus a little in height. That will clear water on the transom 10 degrees at 10" of relief, so I should be dry.

It has 4 boxes under the seats, I bet wet foam is in there. Some are cracked open some, but they are not very big, maybe two 12 packs size each. Will be easy to rip into them. I want to put a plastic bag in there, a few 20oz coke bottles, some spray foam to keep them quiet, and repeat until full, seal plastic, close back up.

The hook on the end of the pad is only for very light boats, with enough pad and full on it, to keep the bow down. The bow is very light, and the taper/hook/wedge holds it down and trades that for a little more lift. A heavier hull will plow the bow into the water that way. Usually the case when you really got a lot of power for the size of light hull you have. That little hook on the edge has a lot of leverage on the whole hull, so you need lots of power to make that work. I believe they put the wedge in the Vector for the then new V6 outboards....on a little 17' Vector.:cool:

I got a taurus SHO with a 3.0 and a 5 speed:D What a motor. Was thinking slow when I signed to S&F...:confused: its my email handle I've had for some time.

[Racemore]

Sho and Bob,my pad wasnt intended to airate.The original motor was a 2.5 235 rude.I ran a V4 case witha marinetex dixiecup nosecone that was shaped to lift the water and direct it to the factory inlet which I plugged the top 2 holes and drilled one below the original bottom hole.I shaped a edge behind the inlet to help scavenge the water.The pad was the same idea scavaging the water and directing it to the center of the pad,the middle of pad flatened out and the hook lifted the boat evenly.I didn't need max trim.I could blow it over easily if i wanted to.The rider in the pic is my cuz that wanted to buy it.he's 6'4 260,iwas 180.The boat was no lightweight either,it took 5 of us stretching our nads to flip it.It did run a little faster with the 235 at 398#s that the looper at 465.it had a 4 inch fixed plate and I ran the motor with the propshaft 1 1/2" below the bottom.You don't want to step or airate the pad under 5to6 ft from the transom because of possible heat problems.The water pressure started working all the way to 70-75 though the chine walk which was easy to drive though to 80+ were it would smoothout and get light on the water.it would run 90 which was respectable in mid 1980's.it did have a terminal speed though, it left the water running against a 20kt wind at about 85.it only got 5' of the water for 100'or so then set back down.I didn't try to find anymore speed after that.:D If you pad your boat with your weight think more about a good running surface creating less wetted area.also I think I could have improved it by stopping the pad several "s in front of the transom or known as a notched pad.It would have been like adding a little more setback.We did a 17"Formula Jr with a 350/Alpha and had to sand the hook out because of the forward weight of the motor but the pad works great.It's is a HEAVY boat also.Fuel for thought or confusion.:D :cool: :cool:

[sho305]

I've been told air lift starts working at about 80, as it does on the STV. Sounds like you were there Racemore:) Bet you would pay anything for a video of that hairy ride!

This badword-bayliner has little for stringers and a hull, but I might beef it up more while doing the pad. If the 85 works good on the jack, I might put my inline on there later since it is only 50lbs more. I hope the jack, diet, and pad will get it from 40 to 50+, but either way just like the transom I will learn the pad so I can do a better hull right. Hull repair & mod school I guess. Even with about 125hp of the inline it would still only be at maybe 60mph+, likely not enough for air lift to work. Some air might help but I don't have a LWP yet either. Maybe better to leave it flat for this one? Want to do it right, not what sounds cool.

The Checkmate 17' I can put a V6 on and this is a tester for that pad, but I don't have any intention of trying that HP on this flimsey bayliner. I'll sell it or have it for a spare when done. Kinda wanted to get a viper some day for the inline, that would give it some respect.

I'll get the 5.5" jack on there soon, and baseline it. Then I'll put a temp 2"x10" pad on with 8" relief for 13.5" total setback like Reese suggested, or make it adjust to that. If it gets all the way high on the pad I'll consider some air mods, but I bet too slow for that by the sounds of it. Maybe I can figure out how to make a removable part on the temp pad:D I'll get to thinking on that. I could make some pieces, then swap them out to see the effects they had. A flat one, a channel, a dish like Racemore's, etc.:cool: :cool: I got some cheap ply here...

[Alan Power]

I think this is a wetted surface thing, your bayliner bottom rails don't run all the way aft as the boat was never intended to go that fast to clear water that low far aft. By running the rails all the way back without the speed to clear the water you will just add to wetted surface.

If you do want to get that boat up then the 12" pad would be a good thought, any pad that is sufficient to give a boat lift is sufficient to launch the boat off a wave as well.

My opinion would be a 11"(compromise) flat pad run forward 41/2' and start to V to 'smooth' re-entry. You can play around with the relief length.

Call Jim at Aeromarine and get his book, it explains a lot about lift.

Don't get carried away, you might end up with something like this......

[sho305]

Hey, nice to see you around Alan. With the 7" pad that gets smaller forward(6"@30" up) and no shoulder or height to the pad, I figure my wider raised pad will help a lot for wetted surface. Plus the relief for more balance. So you must agree too that it is too slow for air tricks in the pad. Ok with me, that is just more work. As far as getting air, it is not a HD hull. I'll have to take it easy if it comes out of the water and I hate slowing down. 11" seems to be consensus.

:D :D I'm telling you, the laughs I get out of this bayliner are just priceless anyway. I want to leave the motor so I can measure the gains. I happen to be running it now; I gotta modify it...its my duty...pos or not...

I agree the rails would have to be out of the water flow, I think I'll see where the water is with the temp pad before I can figure them...maybe they are not even needed, maybe higher then or for turning? Yeah, the book is on my list.

Once I get some other projects cycled out I'll get into a V6. Only have 6 vehicles and 3 boats now...I'm doing good on cutting down.:)

[Alan Power]

Been around a lot lately, have a week off work to try and get stuff done.

I wouldn't wory too much about the strength of the boat, if it's all sound there shouldnt be a problem. A few big knees and stringers would definitely keep it all together. Not trying to create work for you its probably ok as is!

Bob T- sorry but I have only joined in and this has been a long week for me, what is your plan for a pad or have you one yet? What kind of boat, any pics of the underside, power, weight?

Alan...

[Bob T]

Alan ,thanks for the interest.Its a 19' JCraft short deck, 12 degree 'V' bottom.The boat looks very similar to Racemore's picture earlier on this thread.They used to make them in Ontario Canada.If I'm not mistaken(good chance I am) STV currently owns the molds.Another member on the board has one.Mine has a 175 Johnson X-flow with a few tweaks,L&S j-plate,8" set back(needs more) , torque shift prop,low H2o pickup.According to the factory brochure it weighs 850lbs.The bottom has no strakes or other means of 'lift'.I plan to add a 12" wide by 8' long pad .Also a pair of 2"-3"wide stakes ~12"on either side of the pad.I also plan to end the pad about 12" from the transom for some built in set back.Currently runs mid 60's with the TS prop and it will launch completely out of the h2o.BT Ps,"wicked picture",wish I could do that.......

[Alan Power]

Hi, been thinking of a few things and had a read back over the thread, I'm with reese on the pad airation thing- loss of water does equal loss of lift.

Have you any pis of your boat running, or can you tell me what your wetted length is at full scream.

Alan...

[Racemore]

Alan,there are alot of variables.A wetted surface is drag,the water does lift.Somewhere there has to be a point where the lift creates speed and speed creates lift.If you don't have the power to get on the pad the design of it won't mean alot except the least drag will provide the best speed.All variables relative will produce the best performance.Example;If you turn you waterhose on wide open and lay it down on the driveway it might snake back and forth from the pressure,if you put a nozzle on it to reduce the amount of flow and increase the pressure it might whipp your ass.The pressure is power but it takes power to make the pressure.You can't obtain one without the other so the efficiency which you make the power is gain.A hydrofoil is a good example of all the variables at best.There is a point with everything that performance will give way to friction.Hydrodynamics,very interesting.:D :cool: My wetted length,just enough.:D :D :D

[Reese]

Hydrodynamic engineers just don’t seem to want to share their knowledge…can’t really blame them cause that’s how they make their living.

I’m just not convinced that aeration really works by decreasing drag. The most popular boats that use this type of system are offshore racing boats…but I don’t think they are really gaining that much from the fact that the water is aerated…I think it’s mostly because the step causes the water to detach from the hull and re-attach farther aft.

It’s not really the aeration…it’s the separation that is making the hull appear shorter than it really is??? Does that make sense?

Here’s another funny factoid…salt water is more dense compared to fresh…so why would denser water, with obviously more drag, cause boats to run faster? Kinda goes against logic.

My idea (right or wrong) is that dense laminar flow is always more efficient and faster compared to less dense aerated turbulent flow.

BTW Bob, I think those dimensions sound just about perfect.

[sho305]

Well, I don't want to design a boat(not yet...:confused: ) just need the basics for some mods like most of us here. Hmmm, speed.

I could be all wrong, but it was my take that trapping bubbles under a hull, would help friction. And the air was trapped there by the water...so you did not really loose much lift since the air can't get out before you run over it.(?) I assume if you could trap all air, like a hovercraft, you could go real fast...

A scoop like Racemore's traps a pocket of air at high speed like the STV and create some air lift under there...different than the bubbles deal(yes?). Sort of a miniature tunnel effect I guess; but getting lift from trapping the air rather than a wing type of lift of a tunnel. I assume you have to be cooking to gain this effect, or it will just be a hook.

[Racemore]

Reese.There is no question that ventilated hulls are faster and have less drag.True that once on the pad it doesn't mean as much until you get off of it.You spend alot of time off of it too.If the boat has notched steps it can change the angle of the running surface like a Fountain.

[Racemore]

I think that my main lift came from the water compressing at the end of the pad.I've been told it was running on the last 2-3"s.In slick water it would tap the water a little with just me in it.I was lucky to get some knowledge from a fellow that built killer Omc's and had a critchfield V that he raced.He experimented alot to get his boat to handle at top speed.The last motor he ran was a 2.4 modvp/6-pack/nos black motor.He claimed 116.

[Alan Power]

I'm not trying to re-invent the wheel, I just think there's no point in adding to friction by putting an oversized pad on the bottom. The size of the pad can be calculated and with careful consideration step placement could reduce porpoising. I did a hydrodynamics module in university pain in the ass if you ask me- but worth it in the end! :D

Reese- yeah, that makes sense offshore boats are long because they need to be to span waves, the step would not even aerate in really rough stuff but it does redefine wetted length in the smooth. They also set up the angle of incidence for the wing on cats- like the sponsons on a seaplane. They also reduce wetted length thus reducing friction at speed. Steps have to be carefully placed though, a step in the wrong place and you may as well have no step at all!

In my opinion the best shape for a ride pad is FLAT!

Just my .02 :cool:

Alan...

[sho305]

I'd like to try a pad and let you know, but I'm having a hard time getting to the boat:( Did get the lube plug fixed but forgot my gas tank and had no 2 stroke oil...:confused: Something wrong with me? Looks like I need to locate another steering cable to fit my jackplate too, as this one has no slack:rolleyes: . I think this will be too slow for an aerated pad, but maybe I can keep the cheezy single cable steer then. I found a water pressure fitting on the head atleast. I was going to try just the jack, but maybe I'll do the temp pad at the same time.

I am interested to see the change from a 7" flush pad to a 11" raised/relieved pad plus a jack with 5.5" setback on this rag.:cool:

[175checkmate]

Keep it comming guys. With the new alltitude 3970 ft I am going to have to flip the boat this winter and do a pad just to get the speed I lost from being up so high.

Alan, glad to see you around, hows the boat comming?

Reese my old friend, how the project comming along? Ready for water yet?

[sho305]

Still open on how to pad the Checkmate vee, but I really want some relief in there so I can stay away from a foot of setback. I just question raising the pad when I see everyone doing the first strake enlargement thing instead to keep it low. I looked at it last weekend, and all the strakes are a slight negative on mine, and all full to the transom. I don't think it will affect the bayliner due to the current flush pad, as most hulls have raised pads like my new one would be. I might chop 8" out of the vee since I will be into the transom too on the 'Mate. I can lay as much glass as they did...:D and I'll add knees/stringers.

[Reese]

Gus...hope the move went well and all is good.

Not ready for the wet stuff...but it's getting there, at least I'm done building stuff (except for the pad) which will be the easiest part of this whole project.

Sho, come on, pad design by committee, we already decided on the size and shape, now just glass in the wood and be done with it.:D

[Bob T]

C'mon SHO,even I know better than that....If you're trying to go fast, spend your time and money there first...unless you want to be wet side up to show off that new pad . Alan,I am very interested in those numbers you were going to crunch for me.BT

[sho305]

I have two boats here; the bayliner 16' I'll pad soon still with the 85hp on it, and the 17' Checkmate I'll do later as it needs more than the pad:( We figured out a good 11-12" pad for the bayliner I will use, and maybe I'll put more power on it when I have time to beef up the hull. I hope I have a V6 for the Checkmate by then though.

The Checkmate--has a vee instead of the flush pad the bayliner has that I will just add on to. If I go with a pad like the bayliner one I will have huge shoulders on the sides...can't do that. Everyone leaves the vee showing and makes the first strakes huge on this configuration, so they are not making the hull taller. However, the Checkmate then needs tons of setback. I really want to relieve the pad like I will on the bayliner, but the sharp vee is the problem. Unless I leave the vee dragging behind the pad; but I fear loss of speed from that.

I figured at 85hp on the bayliner I would still be shy of 50mph from the current 40, and not need dual steer yet. Maybe I do? I'll get to looking if you think so. Never had a problem with the Checkmate vee at 50mph with the inline and single cable, though I was told it really should have dual by some. The 1500 is only maybe 125 of todays hp.

[Reese]

does your checkmate bottom look like Gus's??? If not, do you have a pic?

Glass bottom baby (http://forums.screamandfly.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=22708&perpage=15&pagenumber=1)

[sho305]

It looks the same except my strakes go all the way back. Don't have a bottom pick, but it is a straight vee to a point with full strakes. The negative chine gets bigger at the bow, but has no effect at speed other than spray reduction. Here you can see the first strake under the speedo pickup.

[Reese]

a little dilema... and wanting a notched transom makes it even more challenging.

Anything is possible...it's just a question of time and how much you're willing to modify to make it happen. My first crazy ass thought was to cut out the last 5 or 6 feet of the v-bottom and build you own pad any way you want, but that's a lot of work and probably not a realistic option.

[sho305]

I thought that too, but worried about the bottom getting deformed and having to make a big jig to hold it. Also lots of glass to repair. But, I was thinking even say 8" of notch would help me to use a normal jack plate. I could make a simple mold for an 8" hole by 14" wide or whatever. Only need about 2-2.5" high to clear water. I could run the knees over it for more strength. Then I could make the pad even with the vee, as this one will not be 12" wide...maybe 8-9" or so.

[sho305]

I was thinking about a mod like this, and I'll run the knees/stringers over it to hold up the transom.

[Racemore]

Notched with a 10-10.5"pad.Maybe a 3/8-1/2"in the last 18"s.Make the Bayliner an Airliner or aaa Bairliner.:D You'll probably gain 4mph maybe more,like a good prop.;) :cool:

[Bob T]

Sometimes my wife calls me an 'old lady' and says I worry too much.Only been tossed from a boat once .It was a LONG time ago ,before I knew about kill switches and foot throttles.It's an ugly thing sitting in the water watching your boat accelerate away from you at full throttle then circle around the lake till it wrecks.As a result I tend to be a little more cautious.What you are planning will completely change the way your boat will handle and you will need to learn to drive all over again.It may do some strange and unexpected things.I'd hate to see your rely on an 'old',probably worn out cable..If it happens to break because of the added stress you WILL be placing on it ,you'll do a big sh#%hook followed by a nice swim ,if you're real lucky.If you're not so lucky ,the boat will come back and try to leave prop marks on your butt as you deep dive to get out of the way.Don't ask me how I know,but I was' only' going 50 at the time. Of course you have a foot throttle ,wheel mounted trim,kill switch(attached), good life vest (on)etc,etc.Take care of the safety stuff first, so I can continue to enjoy reading your posts.Didn,t mean to go on but like my wife says,I,m a bit of an' .......'Take care BT

[Reese]

and also agree with Bob on the steering issue...don't skimp.

I have a very similar notch on my boat...the only thing to keep in mind is that you're drain plug will now be higher than the lowest point of the boat, not that big of a deal but something to keep in mind.

When it comes to pads, I believe it's better to err on the wide side...If the flat planing surface is not wide enough for the speed and weight of the boat it will ride wetter than a pad that might arguably be too wide.

I know a lot of guys talk about loss of rough water handling but I don't boat in the ocean or tournament bass fish...if the lake is too rough to wakeboard it's too rough for me.:)

[sho305]

Actually, both cables are pretty new. The Checkmate was stored so it was tight a little at the motor tube before I got it but he showed me the paper on the cable. A little oil and it worked but was a little stiff, and I think it made it easier to steer. I still worried though as it torques a lot at full trim, and I'm not running it now. The Bayliner steers with one finger, and has hardly any torque, but I'll measure the cables this weekend and see if I can find an old dual for the 'test boat'. Don't want to be in the drink unplanned.;) I let go of the bayliner one day while slowing and the wheel sat, then spun to full lock down at about 25mph. It turns fast then...:) With the gas on it goes straight. It has a huge LU if that matters.

I run at smaller lakes, maybe 1-6 miles long. Mostly only have to worry about wakes from the tubers/skiers, and I wait until later if there are to many. I'll take it to more places when I get a ride figured out good.

Here is a pic of the Bayliner to show the difference in the bottom from the Checkmate. The existing "pad" is 7" at the transom. The drawing part is not the exact size(2"x11"or 11+ now) the pad will be; it should be a little wider. In fact the short strakes are 12" between. I'll have to mess with strake issues later, if needed. I was thinking of enlarging the short strakes and running them back so the relief was flatter for more holeshot lift. You can see how much easier it will be to pad this one; with the pad it will be much like most raised pad hulls.

Can I put the drain in the notch on the Checkmate? I'll be cutting the old one out anyway with the notch. This bayliner pad will be solid, so no change to plug.

[Racemore]

Now this one has alot of drawings and plenty of ideas to kick around.How the hell do you guys post them?:confused: Take me to school please.:D :cool: TTT

[sho305]

C'mon Racemore, ya just open your pic in photoshop, draw what you want on it, then save as a jpg and post the pic:D :D until your PC blows up like mine did. Seems that my BIOS chip is trashed. Should have a new one in a few days, so I get extra time to work on projects until then.:) How's fishing?

[Racemore]

Whats up! I don't have photoshop.I have Imaging and paint but even though it is in bitmap I can't make it work.Took me forever to get it to browse and pick it up and it said it was to big.i don't understand why cause it's only 1/4 page in size.I'm sure it would help if I knew what i was doing.:I did take a pic of Parkers boat and made it look like it was cracking up in the paint shop but it was already in jpg when I downloaded it.Anyway,what the hell.As far as the Shrimping theres a alot of shrimp but they need to grow up so we can get mo money.The imports have destroyed the market.This country better start taking care of their own before it's too late.Our government has spent $16,000,000,000.00 helping China and several other countries start farming shrimp so they can dump them on the US market,thats right,$16 billion and It is putting our on fishermen out of business and the people that work in the industry.They have dump millions of pounds of tainted rotten shrimp that should never be excepted but the Feds look the other way.Our product is so superior that the local resturant's beg for the fresh caught product but the market price is so low we can't afford to catch them.I made a couple of drags Tuesday and ended up with 417#'s and they paid $.60 a pound,I got sick over it.By the time I cover ice and fuel I had 200 bucks.5 years ago I would have had $800.I pay my deck hand 20-25% when i can catch enough to hire one.It sucks.Reminds me of the old REO Speedwagon song "Golden Country",We are going down the drain with our Liberal Dumbass Politicans.:mad: Got to get off this subject before I break something.:D So what's up with yous guys.Lucky to have power I guess.:cool:

[Techno]

Racemore
The size is 2 things.
The pixel size and the amount of memory needed to hold it. You can see both of these if you right click on any picture and select properties You also get the address if needed for the IMG button for a picture.
Any way if the pixels are too wide it goes off the screen and if memory is too large won't be allowed. Bitmaps- BMPs are memory hungery. If you change it to a JPG it usually becomes a less memory save.

A good pixel size seems to be around 550 but under 600 because of the sidebar is hogging some screen. Memory is best below 50Kb but usually I can't get them this low. I think greg limited it to 200kb but the bigger it is on memory the slower it is for loading. Greg posted a few links awhile back for graphics programs to manipulate the pictures.

For the fishin deal. The thing I don't get is this country no longer has a merchant fleet. Too expensive to license them so all our ships are foriegn, if they are even owned by US companies. Since this country isn't getting any money in licencing fees you would think it would be better to cheapen it up to have some income this way?

[sho305]

My MS Paint will do JPGs if I open one once with it. Then I can edit a BMP with lines/etc, and save as a JPG(or edit jpg, but it only works in bmp I think). It is very handy for simple editing like simple shapes/lines/text/etc. I just make them smaller with the cropping, and save. You can see the BMP files are much larger than the JPG. Have to save as JPG for use here on S&F. It would not do JPG until I opened one, then it added it to the save types.

You guys need your own shrimp company with USA on the package. Shrimp is expensive as he** here no matter where it is from. Try $6-12 a pound, so who is making the $$$???? Prices never went down at all. Something needs to be addressed here. Lots of businesses are finding they need to tighten up their belts like the manufaturing up here, but you still ought to be able to make a living doing it. The government typically supports the food sector. Tyson pulled out of the area near here, and the people took their huge chicken barns and made their own brand now. I think they even sold some to China. The apple farmers are still having a hard time of it though, and China is hammering them. They are converting to the dwarf trees to get more per acre and are getting better now. Lots of orchard is gone here now though. Amway imports a ton of apple juice concentrate from China, and that hurts. Right up the road from here, and they had to put a real big fence around the plant...

[Bob T]

Boats off the trailer ,sitting on stacks of tires.Getting ready to test fit the pad and strakes then go for a 'ride'.Any final advice before I get out the drill and start drilling holes in the bottom of my boat?Will silicone seal the bolt holes well enough to keep the water from penetrating the core, or do I need to coat the holes with epoxy?Any driving tips?wish me luck!!! BT

[sho305]

Great! I can't get to mine no matter how much I try. I have some wood to cut and bolts even.

I would think 5200 to seal bolts, but it might not come back off? I think I would epoxy in there to be safe with a core hull. Silicone ought to work for a short time ok I would guess, or you may be able to use the old paste stuff for transoms; I bet it would come back apart easy. Also remember if you put silicone on the holes, you will have to remove every little bit or resin will not stick well later. My bayliner has no core, and I was going to use some cheap acrylic house culk and only make a couple smooth runs with it using a bare wood temp pad.

If just a quick run, you might use that plumbers putty stuff like for kitchen sink drains. That would come off easy, but not hold if the pad moves at all.

[Bob T]

Pad and strakes attached

[Bob T]

Pad /strake height

[Bob T]

Pad setback 18''

[Bob T]

Another view

[Bob T]

Any thoughts/ideas/feedback?

Thanks guys!
BT

[sho305]

I was going to use carrage bolts in my treated lumber so they did not protrude, but that may not work well with your parts. So they might drag some, but you should be able tell how it works as far as balance/etc. just fine. I would have the thing in the water about 5 seconds after I put them on:D

I was really thinking of dong something like that with the front of mine, but just did not know. Thought it might affect turning or something.:confused: I also hope a little relief like that will help the hull.

[175checkmate]

I may be wrong, but it looks to me that setting the pad back 18" will make the hull search for the running surface.
I know on my boat the last 10-12 inches of the hull is where I am running.

[Bob T]

SHO,I tried carriage bolts at first but couldn't get them tight enough.When I flip the boat to make it permanent I may epoxy the carriage bolts into the pieces before glassing ,then use them as guide pins as well as for their clamping force . Checkmate,I looked at tons of pictures of boat bottoms before deciding on the built in setback i.e. ending the pad before the transom.Allison Boats are the best example I can think of who ends the pad before the transom for more set back.My boat needs lots more setback than the jack plate and static plate give it .18''of built in set back is a guess.Thats why I made the pieces removable, so I can experiment.Unfortunately the water is getting real cold and everyone has put their boats away for the year so testing will have to wait til spring.Iwant a safety boat around just in case....

[sho305]

My Checkmate has no relief, so I want to do that too. I was going to try it on the 'liner just to see as it has none either. I measured a 18 ebbtide with 10" relief and a 150gt Johnny on the transom. With a new raker he can't get it to fly right, but I imagine a jack would help. It had a 10" wide pad with a slight vee to it and was raised. He trims it all the way and still the open bow is low. Could be full of water for all I know though. He says it does 58mph.

Looks to get warm here today, but I can't get to the lake:( :rolleyes:

Not tight? Yeah, I would not want it flopping around under there either!

[baja200merk]

i will be puttin a pad on my brothers mini hawk in the near future

what do i use to build the pad up (bob used spruce what do i use)???

how do i secure it to the bottom?

the hull will be sittin in the water for a few months and i dont want any rot or anthing going on u know!

please post your opinions and ideaS dont hold back

ps i would rather not screw into the hull but if i must... i must

thanks kevin:confused: :D

[sho305]

Most told me you can bolt on a temp to check shape and how it runs, but should glass on the real pad. They say to clean and sand the hull good, then lay a layer of mat down the whole area you are using larger than the pad. In other words where you will blend it back in too. Then set the fitted pad on and weight it down. Or the first pieces if you are building the pad on. Then glass over the top/etc. It is often called 'bonding' where you lay thick mat full of resin then press the part/piece into it. Much like if you where adding a mount for a fuel tank/battery/trim pump/etc. on the inside. The mat holds lots of resin so you get a full wet bond between the two when you press (and hold) them together.

There seems to be plenty of ways to make the pad. Some make it out of pieces on the hull, others make it all and mount the whole thing. Still others make a mold of the bottom, then make the pad on that mold so it fits perfect...maybe even make a mold of the outer pad so it is nice and smooth and then mount the two together; then put the whole thing on the hull all finished mostly. I hate to make a mold, but I also know finishing hand laid glass can take a long time to get smooth. I would resin all the wood pieces so each was water proof when I did it, that seems to help.

[Bob T]

Can't believe summers almost over .Spent some time testing the temporary pad and strakes.Adding the strakes added 3mph.The boat really didn't like the 18'' set back pad.Can you say porpoise? The pad with 8'' set back ,only 3mph more.Didn't want to spend alot of time riding on the pad held on only by bolts....After looking long and hard, it seems my temp pad had a 1/4'' hook.Also the bolt's hanging down probly didn't help ,nor did the raw fiberglass running surface.I figure 6mph will be 10mph once these problems are fixed.Sooo, flipped it over and got to work.Grinding off all the gel coat was alittle scary.Guess I'm commited now .My wife thinks I should be.Last night after grinding ,I started pouring the resin and of course the sky opened up.Torential down pour at the point when you can't stop.My tent only leaked ''alittle''.By the time I finished ,my kids looked like they were ready to phone for the guys in the white suits with the nice jacket to come and take me away.Went to bed at 1am stared at the ceiling til 5am,up and back at it by 9:30.Pad's almost ready for gel !!!Who says I'm craaazy?tb

[Racemore]

After a little over 15 months of research and work I'm glad you got to test your findings.I think you'll gain alot better attitude in respect to handling with the finished pad.1/4 " should be good but if it feels like you have to lift the boat with to high of trim you might want to massage a little out.320-400gt sanded surface should be you finish.Too slick will tend to stick.:cool:

PS If you gain 10mph thats real good.I can see all the northern boats upside down for the winter.:D :D ;)

[Bob T]

Thanks for keeping up with my project.You've been a great help!The 1/4'' hook is gone.The driver sits well forward in the boat and I have to use all my trim to fly it,so any hook, in my opinion, is gonna hurt performance.Had to go skiing with my wife today(provincial record holder and past national slalom champion, in her age group), so only got to get itchy for alittle while,filling and sanding, tonight.Summers real short up here so most of the 15 months has been spent pondering, while the snow fell outside on my boat.BT p.s.Hope all is well after your big"blow "this past couple of days.Scary stuff!

[175checkmate]

Your results are giving me hope.
I added a pad and exstended the strakes all the way back.
10mph would be nice.

[sho305]

Where you been? Is that pad wet yet?:D Still fiddling with the slow boat but getting closer to a project.:rolleyes:

Thanks for posting the results of your mods! Hope I can get into mine soon.

[Bob T]

Great pics Checkmate.Have you tested your pad?The transition at the bow of the pad seems a little radical to me .Maybe it's the angle of the photo ,but from what I see, it looks like it might dig in 'a little' as you come of plane.My first 'test ' pad did exactly that. Trust me,it's not the way you want yuor boat to handle.BT

[Bob T]

Got the gelcoat to stick,sanded it to 600,sharpened all the edges,flipped it,put it on the trailer,drank a beer with the boys.DONE.BT

[Murph]

Ok here’s a different way of trying out a ski/pad. First figure out what area on your hull your going to have the pad and tape off an area a little bigger. Wax/PVA it up and coat the hull with gel coat. Then lay up some glass on the prepped gel area. Let it harden. Next you make a mold for your pad design out of plywood and either cover the inside of the mold with resin and wax the heck out of it or you can use arbright on the inside. Again take you pad mold and coat it with gel and then glass it up. Now take the pad out of the mold and shape the sides to fit on the hull where you have laid up the glass. Now take the piece of glass off the hull and glass it to the new pad you laid up. Now you have a pad the will fit right on you boat. Secure it with lots of silicone and maybe two screws/bolts at the front and two at the back and presto. You don’t like it all you have to do is take off and fill four holes or try a different design. No fuss, no muss. You can do all kinds of hull mods this way. If you have a buddy with a boat you can even take a mold of their pad and apply it the same way.

[yanny_haulinbass]

What province are you in?

I was wondering if you have had the boat out with the finished pad, give us some feedback!

[Bob T]

Live just outside Edmonton and boat on Wizard Lake,south of 'E'.Boating has been on the back burner ...health reasons.Memory loss due to stress.My wife tells me the last time I drove it , it was "faster" but I really don't remember.Since last fall I've added 4" more set back and am in the middle of adding knee braces.Hope to be in the water in the next couple of weeks.I'll try to remember to post my results when I know.Thanks for your interest.BT

[yanny_haulinbass]

Bob,
It's been a while since I bugged you last, have you had the boat out? I am getting close to finishing my pad mods and would love to hear how yours worked out before I finalize mine.

[Bob T]

Things got a little rough so it went to the back burner.I'm hoping in the next couple of weeks.Maybe even next weekend.What kind of pad are you doing,i.e your pad dimensions,set back ,type of set up?Did you do any testing?A smooth transition on the leading edge is a must as are sharp edges all around.BT

[yanny_haulinbass]

check out my thread in the tech talk forum "step by step pad project begins monday"

Let me know what you think. I hope to have the boat right side up Monday.

[Bob T]

Is it 3/8 spruce plywood you're using.Id think long before I did that.If you're using solid stock all I can say is wipe it real good with acetone just before glassing as the spruce is oily and your glass won't stick if you don't BT

[Moodgam]

I'm thinking of adding a pad to my 22'6" Avenger Bay Boat. Raw boat weight is 2000#. Friend of mine that builds 22' Moodcraft Bass Boat made a pad for me right off his hull. I set it on the bottom of the plug for my rig and it's amazing how well it fits. I've attached some pics. keep in mind that this mold is the same bottom of my boat but mine is two foot longer.


My question are: Since I have 13 degrees of deadrise how much height should this pad have? I'm thinking that it must be tall enough to be below the bottom of the first lifting strake. Also how can you reasonable predict any impact on hole shot and turning capability?

By the way I was told by the bass boat mfg that a pad can be no narrower than 10% of the beam of the boat and must be 1/3 as long as the length of the hull. This particular pad he molded for me is 14" wide and flat. He suggested that I use foam to fill the void. I'll call and find out specifically what type foam he's referring to.

[Bob T]

First time out 67-68,dead flat water and 90 degrees.In better conditions ,it'll do 70+,Thank,guys for helping put the stupid grin on my face.Still there 4days later.BT

[sho305]

Wow is this an old post! Glad you got in on the water, but how much of a gain do you think you got out of it? (before/after) How about handling and trim/etc., with the setback/notch? Unfortunatley I'm still mired in home projects and with gas prices I lost interest in the boats for a bit, if I even had time to run one anyway. I just finished a nice patio out back, but it doesn't have a motor on it darn it.:)