would like to make my j150glecd go faster

[bassfaster]

Hello everybody its my first post :cheers:. I know I'd be better off just buying a faster boat and motor but have to work with what I've got for now. I have a 90 vision 185 with a 98 johny fast strike 150. It goes about 64 with me and light fishing load. I had been looking at 175's and thought of swapping parts in my 150 into a 175. Not really cost effective until I found a guy with a blown 175 and bought his carbs and throttle bodies for cheap. At the time I thought that was the only difference but turns out after further parts list examination http://www.boats.net/parts/search/BRP/JOHNSON/1998/J150GLECD/parts.html the case is also different :(. So I have these carbs and throttle bodies already on their way and wondering if the swap will still work out ok? The carbs and throttle bodies should have larger throats and orifices so at least my motor should get some more juice but wont be quite the same as a true 175. So should I down size the high speed jets from what a true 175 has or what? Maybe just try a spark plug read and see first? I've been searching through old posts for awhile. Any help or advice appreciated. Aslo any other simple power upgrade ideas for this motor? I cut out a hole in the lower unit exhaust just above the cav plate on advice from a friend but that did nothing but make my motor lounder :confused:.

[200venom]

I'm pretty sure the Faststrike 150's already had the larger 175 carbs and throttle bodies. I know my dad's 91 Faststrike 150 does. I would say put some 99-2000 Ficht reed cages with composite reeds for those cages in it and work on your set up. 64 isn't bad, my dad's 17ft champion bass boat runs 65 on gps with his Faststrike 150.

[bassfaster]

The carbs and throtle bodies have different part #'s for the 98 150 and 175. If they are the same as what I already have I will be very sad. They are still not here, usps sucks:mad:. Anways I think my setup is about as good as I can get it. I have a 24p original raker that was blueprinted by Marks props in Indiana and a 6 inch jackplate. Running the prop shaft 3.5 inches bellow pad. I can run the motor up higher with good water pressure but lose speed. I tried 8 inch setback but didnt help the speed any. I have trim left but the boat runs a little faster at about 3/4 to 7/8 of full trim.. will the fict cages and reed do much for top speed? I had been reading that composite reeds mainly help idle, throttle response and overall smoothness. Thanks for your help.

[200venom]

Your're right, the 98 faststrike 150 & 175 does show different part numbers for the carbs & throttle body. Where as the 1991 Faststrike 150 shared shared the carbs & throttle body as the 175. So maybe there is something there to gain. Maybe Racer or Jenksam on the forums can shed some light on this. Your motor and the 1991 faststrike does have the same reed cages so if your gonna put composite reeds in it, then get the 99-2000 Ficht reed cages. They come up on ebay quite often. Also, the 1991 Faststrike had higher compression heads, part #335195. So you can look for a pair of those also. Here is a pic of the diff between the regular cages & the Ficht reed cages. The Ficht reed cages are on the left.254799254800

[bassfaster]

Thanks for the reed cage tip. That looks like a good bolt on upgrade allong with the reeds. I will probably do that sometime in the not so distant future. Not sure how much it will help but wth I like to tinker. :) I'm not so sure about the higher compression heads, but thats on my list of posibilities. Wouldnt milling the heads I have now accomplish the same thing? I guess after that I might also have to change the timing and use premium fuel? I'm getting alittle ahead of myself with that but like I said it is something I will look into. Thanks again for your help :cheers:

[Lockjaw]

The fast strike 150's and 175 have the same size carb and throttle body. Difference is the main jet in the 175 is 2 sizes larger.

You are pretty limited on what you can do to add more power to the motor. Baker hot heads, if you can find a set add a little over 1mph. The ficht cages help, especially with idle, and as you can see from the pic, they flow better. The other mod is a tuner mod, you have to pull the power head and then there is a hole between the 2 exhaust paths about the size of a quarter that needs to be welded close. You can send it to Monty Racing, or have a good local welder do it for you. That adds 4 to 6 hp. You can also have the heads milled, but you have to get the squish angle changed, best to have someone with experience do that, and you will have to run better gas.

I have a couple pairs of the 91 heads.

Short of that you are looking at port work.

[bassfaster]

More good advice thanks. Yeah I figured since everyone on here is talking about mercs that the fast strike was limited in the mods that could be done lol. I sure hope you're wrong about the carbs being the same. The carb bodies and throttle bodies have different part #'s, I assumed the carb body came without the orifices. They should be here soon so I will post if there is any difference. If there isnt I guess I will have a spare set :nonod: . Maybe one day I will pull the powerhead and weld up that bad boy myself. As far as the heads go looks like the safest bet would be to get some of those 91 heads. Would the 91 heads require better gas?

[bassfaster]

well my parts came and it looks like I now have an extra set of useless carbs and throttle bodies :eek:. Made the mistake of asking the guys model number of his motor, looked it up and assumed he had the part numbers listed for that motor. Well not only did I not get those part numbers the part numbers I did get dont even show up on a part search :confused:. The throttle body is # 336646 and 336647, looks the same as what I already have except the side has plugs instead of a cover and gasket and the butterfly has three holes in it instead of one. The carbs are 433656 and they have three fixed orifices (30,40,72D) instead of two fixed and an idle adjustment screw. Guess I will just try to sell these. Anybody know what motor thet actually go on. Like I said the part number search for these on a couple of websites turns up nothing. What a dissapointment, guess I will just have to go back to searching for that magic switch under the consule that turns your 150 into a 175 :leaving:

[stratosdad]

I just got a set of the 335195 heads (recalled 1991 Heads) and will be installing them and rejetting in the next week. I also plan to cc the old 458 heads as well as the 91 recalled heads. I have a 96 GL 150 Intruder that has never been apart but has what i have found is I have the lowest perfoming heads 458's The 458's are the part number for the standard 150's an I should have the 311's . I have a good decarbon regement and have always seen 95-105 on a compression test with my meter. I plan to have a friend check it with his higher end SNAP ON before to check accuracy. If you want a set of heads Lockjaw is the man, if he isnt selling, let me know. I have lead on 3- 1991 motors with the 335195 heads.

I am puzzeled as those heads are the correct number for the 1991, 150 and 175 faststrike and only the 150 were recalled because of the 10% HP rule. That means that all the 1991 175 fastrikes/intruders either are running or went their grave with the HOT heads. They are easy to spot by the big castign numbers and they have the 1/8 threads for the water pressure gauge unlike all the rest that have the 1/4 " threads.

I have read everything I could find about the 150/175 and many claim a good running 150 Fastrike/ Intruder is only about 12 hp less than a 175. The 150 are in the 160-167 HP rang range and the 175 are 175-180. Some claim the hot 1991 150's were 187HP might be a bit high but they didnt have F'in Ethanol then either. 10% moonshine is costing up 10-15 HP then all the dam water issues.



254854

[bassfaster]

It guess sometimes johnson used whatever parts were on hand. You made me check my heads they are the 311's. I searched my 175 throttle body #'s on ebay, looks like they are for a 91-94 175. The guy I bought them from had a 96 GL175. Anybody want to trade a set of 175 carb/throttle body's for some 335195 heads or 99-00 fict cages? I seen some of those 195 heads on ebay. I'm not going to get any until I can get rid of these carbs or get over the butthurt of wasting money on them.

[Lockjaw]

Put them on ebay, they will sell.

I like Stratosdad have read alot, pretty much all I can find about these motors and the 150's are hotter then the 175's. My original motor was an EL 150, and it, after ficht cages, boyesen reeds, the big carbs and tb's and baker heads was putting it all over any of the other 150 boats in my fishing club. I passed a guy in a TR19 triton with a merc 175, he was solo, I was carrying a passenger and his junk, not to mention all my crap. Mine started out with the 548 heads. I never ran the 91 heads on it, so I have no clue how they run compared to bakers. I was running dead even with some Stratos with a 200 yammie on it too.

Once I get the bugs worked out of this 91 motor, then I am giong to see what it's gonna do. My old motor ran almost 69 mph GPS, and hoping it will surpass that with this motor.

We shall see.

[bassfaster]

Thanks for all your help guys. I will probably get these parts you suggest sometime this year hopefully. I guess the baker hot heads are harder to find than the 335195's so I will probabaly end up with the 195's. Dont see any fict cages on ebay at the moment either. But once I do get these how many sizes up should I change the jets. Also would I have to change the int. orifice as well as the high speed? I see alot of the 150's in the '90's have very different size combos. Mine has #38 and #69D. I'm sure testing them out would be the only sure way, but be nice to not have to buy several sizes.

[Lockjaw]

I don't think they have to be Ficht, if you can find some johnson reed cages off ones made in the low to mid 2000 model years, and see. They should have a black rubber coating on them. Look close, you'll see.

I don't think you need to up the main jet for just ficht cages, if you go to baker heads, you need to go up 2. And Yes they are hard to find. I have found 2 sets in the last 4 or 5 years.

I am waiting for the info from Stratosdad on the CC of the 91 heads. I crossed that part number on a part site and came up with the heads he currently had, so..... you know.

The thing you have to keep in mind is you aren't going to find 5 mph in a head swap, or reed cages. You might get 1 to 2 at best. Far more is found in getting the boat set up properly. On my boat, going from 6 inches of set back to 8.5 adds a good MPH. Getting the right prop and getting it worked, that will add a mph or 2. That's where you get the speed.

When I started with my boat, it would not turn any prop over 5400. By the time I got done monkeying with it would put a 24p tempest on the limiter at about 66. I tried a ton of props, ended up with a Fury. It ran almost 68. I have a one off Merc 4 blade that runs almost 69. I could turn it almost 5900.

You just have to tinker and find what works on your boat. I have my jackplate marked with a sharpie, so I know where it needs to be. I can go up a little more, if its just me, and the boat might run slightly faster, but add some weight, like a passenger, and it will slow down. It is a fine line. I have also sanded my pad a little bit to get good laminar flow.

And here is something else. Run the BRP XD100 oil in the VRO for a while, and see how it runs. I can assure you, you will notice a difference. I love that stuff. Once i get my powerhead broken in, that is what I am going to run in it. Amazing stuff.

[bassfaster]

you guys are killing me, now I need to start using the xd100 too :D. I've been using xd50 for awhile been thinking of switching to penzoil with these crappy gas prices. I do use 100% gas though. Havent noticed much difference in my boat but the 2001 ram 5.9 gets a few mpg better. I'll give the xd100 a try just to see. I could always switch back I guess.

[BIG AL]

Ok I've been out of the boating circle a while so what I'm about to type here is from memory.
Back in the 90's I had a 92 Javelin 389t with a 92 150 Faststrike. The research that I did told me that the 91s and early 92s were the best motors of the Faststrike family. They were putting out nearly 190 hp so the claimed 187 is close. The newer ones were detuned, I was told heads, carbs, reeds and tuner were changed to put the engine within the 15% + or - horsepower range that the government allowed at the time. Now my 389 hull weighed between 1400 and 1500 pounds dry weight, when I got in 93 it had no jackplate, a 24 pitch Raker and would turn around 5900 at 64 mph. After a lot of research and advice from an OMC tech from Texas on another board here is what I ended up with. Remove the heads a little ways down the cyl. you will see a small hole, 1/4" I think, these were called idle reliefs I believe, I was told to go to the hardware store and get 6 1/4" set screws a 1/4" tap and tap the holes. Then apply locktite to the set screws and sink them in just below the cyl. wall. After this mod premium fuel is required, The OMC tech told me this mod alone was 5 hp. Then I was told to remove the intake and remove all the casting flashings, you will need to stuff rags in the intake for this, if you dampen the rags with oil they will catch and hold the flashing better. After this he told me to rejet the carbs that these engines were fat from the factory and he was correct I ended up going down 2 jet sizes on mine. I picked up no noticable speed and 150 rpms. Next I was told to silicone the 2 top water holes shut and install a 6" jackplate, I picked up a couple mph and more rpms. Next I intalled 2" spacers on the plate, this netted 68 mph and 6100 rpms. Time for a prop, after a lot of playing with differant brands and styles I settle in on a 26 pitch Trophy, I got 71 mph ans 5600 rpms with the engine trimed level with the pad 2 and a 1/4" below the pad this was the sweet spot. I tryed a 10" jackplate lost speed and gained rpms. I don't know if this will will work with the newer Faststrikes but It did work with mine. If they are still around Skeet and Carolina Burt both saw the gps speeds on it. I dynoed it once, it was putting out 195 at 5700 and 197 at 6200. I left the settings where I had them and let it live at 5600. So yeah the early Eagles had a lot of power stock and with a little love there was more to be found. I'm not sure if the newer Faststrikes like the mods but they worked on mine. Sorry for the long post but all of this brings back memories.
Al

[stratosdad]

Very nice write up Al. I think there was one typo 6500 rpms? im betting you meant 5600. While mine has always ran well, like you I always want more. I have read everything I could find about the recall and detune and most I can find is Heads were swapped & possibly jets. I have become very frustrated by the fact I have an original, never been taken apart 96 Intruder. The original owner whom i know paid a premium to get a Intruder over the regular 150 and he didn’t get a thing but a decal. The heads are the 458's that are only spec'd for the regular EL 150 and instead of the larger carbs and throttle bodies mine has the regular small bore carbs and TB's. I have seen other post on forums where people list their faststrikes and post the carb numbers and see others have the small bore carbs by mistake as well. <o:p></o:p>
The 335195 heads that were part of the recall on the 150 faststrikes are still around as they were the only heads for all the 91 motors. They came on the regular (non faststrike non Intruder motors as well as the standard 175 and the 175 Faststrikes and Intruders. Again only the HOT 150's got the recall in early 92 and the heads were replaced with the 311's that became the head for all the 92-99 carbed fastrikes and intruders. Well at least non mine. I have a few leads on some 1991 175 Faststrike large bore carbs but 91 carbs do not have the adjustable idle mixture screws. Friday my motor is getting a new VST cover and the 91 heads and i will take some before and after compression readings. I have tested mine several times over the years and a high of 105 and a low of 95 (lower cylinders) come to mind. I plan to check it again with my guage and pricy new snap on for comparison.

Time will tell.....<o:p></o:p>

[BIG AL]

Your right on the typo it should have been 6100, if I remember right the limiter was 6250(?)I sold it in 05'. Your compression seems low to me, or compared to mine. I had 120 before the idle reliefs were pluged and 126 after plugging them. Mine was built in early 92 so it may have been a left over. Check with Jay Smith on cutting the heads to get your comp. up, I know he was to do it for me, that and a full block defalshing and port job were my next steps before I sold mine. I do regret not ever trying my Eagle on my dads Allison xtb, it would hit 80 with a stock Black Max on it and we did hit 105 a couple of time with his Bridgport before it hand grenaded.
Al

[stratosdad]

I have the loosest heads on mine now, that may be the reason for the lower compression. I bet you had the great heads yielding the 120 PSI. I will see where i stand Friday night with my new to me Hot heads.

[BIG AL]

That was what I thought when you posted your #'s, if your compression comes up a good bit you'll know for sure. Does yours have the idle relief holes in the cylinders? I know when I blocked mine off you could feel a seat of the pants differance. I wish I had dynoed before and after. But going up 15-25 psi on comp. will really put a smile on you face I'm sure. What size are your main jets now? I want to say I ended up with 69's in mine where it had 71's or 72's from the factory but I'm not sure. But you really need several to try to get it right. Fuel from 15 years ago was a little better too. I also ran the Amsoil syn. premix thru the vro, this was just personal pref. there are a lot of good oils out now.
Al

[Lockjaw]

The better way to do the idle reliefs is epoxy. Putting in set screws tends to distort the block. The bottom 2 cylinders have less compression then the top 4. I don't know if they did that through the heads, or how, but that is what they did to make the motors idle better.

Those 389's were fast boats for their weight.

[bassfaster]

I have the losest heads on mine now, that may be the reason for the lower compression. I bet you had the great heads yielding the 120 PSI. I will see where i stand Friday night with my new to me Hot heads.

So you got those new screaming heads on yet?

[stratosdad]

Yup just finished, compression went from 100/105 to 110/115. I had a leaking VST and the schrader valve (Red arrow).

[bassfaster]

Hey statosdad I was just thinking since your motor had the lower performance heads and carbs do you know if it has a different crankcase also. Looking at a parts list I see SL and GL models have a different case. Also nice job with the head swap. Did you plug those relief holes while you were at it?

[Lockjaw]

The best 150 block to have is an EL block. GL's have a lower exhaust port then EL's, after that, get a 175.

[stratosdad]

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335195 on left 337458 on right.

Wasnt able to get the heads CC my local machine shop is swamped with spring race motor work. What you can see is the 195 chamber is almost perfectly round like a tennis ball could sit in it and evrry bit of it would perfectly fit the countour of the chamber after the taper. The 458 heads are more of a u shaped with still curved sides but a definte area where it rolls into s flatter area around the spark plug threads. The picture on the right, right where the bright reflection is is the area thats the most differnt. I do see the 91 called for a colder plug the 77's . Anyone want to comment on that?

255396

[Lockjaw]

That ring looks a little tight. LOL!!!!

[stratosdad]

That ring looks a little tight. LOL!!!!

Its twisted and actually loose, lost 48 lbs last year and keep 38 off . That finger is a little FU as I got a ring caught and lets say i was hanging by it, well till all the skin popped open and........

248 lbs - 199 i picked up .5 mph LOL

[Lockjaw]

A guy on FB got his ring finger with ring shorted to a battery. It looked gross. That is reason enough for me to not wear one.

[stratosdad]

all up and running, the Vapor Pump to VST cover screws where a bit loose and thats all it took for the first pump not to prime the VRO. I will be "ordering the large bore tommorrow. Also 4/6 high speed jets were loose, 2 i dont think where even caugth on the threads. She is running very sweet on the muffs, all over 110+ psi. going to get the carbs and Reed cages and may go one step more and epoxy the reliefs. I found a large G stampled in the block right above the starter, wonder if that degsignates a GL motor

[Lockjaw]

Go run it and see what you get, and then run it after carbs and reeds and see. I bet you notice a much better idle with the ficht cages.

[bassfaster]

I was looking at the monty racing website and seen that it cost $100 a head for miling to his specs or whatever you want. How would this compare to a 195 head swap or baker hot heads? Seems like the $ cost would be about equal. I wouldnt be able to use my boat of course for a while. I have the 311 heads currently.

[Lockjaw]

His website is probably a little low on the price side. I think more like 250. He just did a tuner mod for me, and it was 110 shipped.

The milled heads will add a mph or 2. More punch down low, and you will have to make sure you re-jet the carbs, but he usually provides the jets. Then make sure you don't get deceleration knock when you let off the gas, if you do, you will have to go richer still on the main jets. I think he also specifies 89 octane or better gas.

The 195 heads when I ran them on another motor didn't give me any decel knock, but I don't have any sort of benchmark to compare them too. Baker heads maintain stock combustion chamber volume, assuming they have not been milled, you have to re-jet, but the set I have added a good solid 1+ mph. However, currently, I have decel knock with my heads, so even though the previous owner claimed they were not milled, I think they are.

There is no free lunch with these engines when you start adding compression. I'd do ficht reeds/cages, I like the monty tuner mod, its worth 4 to 6 hp with no jet changes.

Here is a link to an Eagle motor they modded in B&WB mag.

http://www.land-and-sea.com/articles/bass-and-walleye_dyno/bass-and-walleye_dyno_hop-up_article.htm

There were 2 articles, this has them together. First was the head mod, and the second was porting. This should give you a good idea of what to expect. John Tiger who wrote the article is a member here, perhaps he will see this thread and chime in on the differences between just the heads and a full on ported motor.

[Lockjaw]

By the way, the motor I have now is a 91 EL block, I epoxied the idle reliefs, have ficht cages, boyesen reeds, baker heads and the monty tuner mod. Still breaking it in, but I know I need to go up on the main jet. I have 73D's right now with decel knock, and have a set of 74's on the way. I had to put in a 2000 model crank, and I also have the large bore carbs. I have 2 pairs of the 91 heads, so, I may go back if I can't get this one to behave with the baker heads. I also have solid upper mounts to go in it.

Alot of people say not to run boyesens in these motors, I haven't checked, I do have another set of ficht cages with stock reeds I may try eventually, but I have never ran a set of boyesens that didn't run better then stock. Chris Carson swears his reeds will make a diff, but I haven't tried his yet either. Maybe once I get moved later this summer I can piddle around and see.

There are not a bunch of people who really fool around with these motors right now. Jenksam does. Monty still does.

My next project will be to find a 175 block, and fiddle with it.

[KSRanger]

I would like to keep this thread going. At least for a little while longer.

I'm new to this forum and working on outboards. My '95 482VS Ranger came with an Intruder 150, of the same year. The engine is set low, as the local lakes can be rough. The prop is a 26P Raker II, loaded with me and my gear GPS's at 60mph.

I really haven't done much to the engine maintenance wise. This spring when I took the cover off to install a fresh set of plugs. I noticed a linkage roller had fallen apart and was laying in the lower cowl.

After reading this thread. I found a set of 195 heads on ebay. My engine btw is a E150GLEOM, so it's a GL block. Before I swap heads I would like to gather additional parts, like the larger carburetors and FITCH reed cages or buy Chis Carson's units. Upon rebuild, my plan is to go with forged Wiseco pistons and send the block off to either Monty or Jay Smith. Have yet to call anyone about what my needs are.

At this point in time. I would be happy to do my own sync & link. I'm not sure there are any decent local shops that I would trust. The dealer I bought my boat from had a really rough looking mechanic. I'm sure he was qualified to service engines but he was scary looking to say the least. I'm a mechanic and have been for over 40 years. The last 25 have been spent working on CNC machines for Boeing. I have somewhat of a racing background. I raced Karts in '80 & '81. I ran a Yamaha KT100S 100cc engine in a Margay Expert chassis. In '87 I rebuilt a 150hp Johnson outboard for a neighbor. I talked him into honing the block for forged Wiseco pistons. I ported the case and matched all the port windows, blended and smoothed all the bends etc. Installed Boyeson reeds and tuned it myself. It's still running today. This was before in internet so the only information I had was looking through catalogs and following the service manual. Today I know of no one local that's into building outboard engines. Their a mystery to 99% of people that own them.

[stratosdad]

256155256156

Just finished pulling apart the motor, wasnt to bad for a first timer. I took alot of pictures. KSRanger if you post your carb part numbers or take some pictures its very easy to tell them apart. Also you can pull 1 main jet and if its a 57 they are small 69-72 large. I will be putting the motor back together tomorrow. I put on the Chris Carson Reeds Saturday. I also just bought a OMC Ignition Analyzer to be able to set it up. Lockjaw, Jenksam Chris Carson and a few other members are a wealth of knowledge and always answer emails and PM's.


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256152256153

[Sparkieboat]

I have a mid 90s 60 degree 150 also. I have the 335195 heads, but I am only getting 95-100 PSI on each cylinder with new rings and freshly honed cylinders that were all within tolerance. I want to plug the idle relief ports, what epoxy do you use, JB WELD?
My motor is running very weak on the top end. I have the small bore carbs with the small 57D jets. it is likely that the previous owner may have done some mix matching. My block is at least a 94 as I checked the part number on the lower crank seal. whelsh plug number is G4094131 if anyone could tell me what year/model block I have. I think my serious lack of power could be a result of wrong carbs/throttle bodies, I am not sure why compression is not higher, new head seals. any suggestions on things to check or changes to make would be very helpful. If you think the bigger carbs/throttle bodies would help a lot let me know. I am really interested in your results Stratos.

[stratosdad]

Cranking speed make a pretty big difference. I have seen a diffenrce of 10 lbs on mine depending on starter battery voltage. Have you tried a second gauge? I have asked the same question on plugging the idle reliefs and have heard JB weld or Marinetex. Have you checked the timing? The reed cages are good for 13 hp and 20 lbs of torque over the regular cages I was told by a well known member.

[Sparkieboat]

your kidding me 13 HP??? wow do you still have those large carbs/throttle bodies for sale? do you mean the 99-00 ficht cages? I have used these guages on many motors, I am fairly sure they are close. yes checked and rechecked timing and sync

[stratosdad]

I never had the large bore carbs for sale. I'm selling my orignal small bore standard 150's I just took off tonite. Yes the 97-9x FICHT cages are the ones you want.

[KSRanger]

stratosdad, thanks for the info and pictures. We love pictures. Wish they were a bit larger though. Every forum has it's own way of attaching pictures and rules concerning pic size, so I understand.

On the ignition tester. Someone posted a few small pictures of diagrams on how to build one. I'm not much of an electronics person. Owning the tool would be much nicer.

I started my boat engine tonight to make sure it's ready for Wednesday. Fishing guide is going to show me how to be a Kevin VanDam. Anyway the engine has always been cold-blooded. Tonight was no exception. I'm using XD-50 OMC oil. It smokes so much I'm concerned it's fowling plugs. I just learned about the red oil injection prime knob. It had been on since I bought the boat four years ago. Now it's off and pointing down, so it doesn't smoke and load up as bad as it used too. I still have to wait for the engine to fully warm up before putting it in gear at idle. I have a small oval watering tub for cattle that's perfect for running the engine in, instead of ear muffs. The water level is above the cavitation plate. Cold starting, have to push the key in every few seconds to keep it running. This loads it up. Then I have to carefully give it throttle to clear it out. Smokes up the neighborhood for a while. I turned a few of the idle air bleed screw in to see how many turns out they were, four turns out. I left them there until I know what they are suppose to be. I found a gas station that has ethanol-free gas and only use 91 octane in the boat. I'll get some part numbers off the carbs tomorrow and post them.

Got a set of calipers to measure those carbs throats with?? Looks like about half an inch difference between the two. I'm going to need a set of those for sure!

[stratosdad]

KSRanger,
You can double click on the picts and they will enlarge some. I have been blesssed up to now with a great motor, all the horror stories of starting, idleing i have never seen. On any givien day I first pump the bulb, push the key in 5-7 times and turn the key, even on a 30 degree day it fires without any problem. I have a hot foot and dont ever touch it. From that point on it will idle perfectly for hours. i can put it in gear and go. Any time after that i just turn the key and it instanly starts and idles fine. I was dumfounded to find 4 out of the 6 main carb jets loose. 2 were so bad it took 5-7 turns to tighen up. They actuall may have not even had the threads caught. Funny thing OMC in the later years made the brass bowl plug screws with longer tits that actual just about touch the jet to stop it from walking out.

[stratosdad]

I have a mid 90s 60 degree 150 also. I have the 335195 heads, but I am only getting 95-100 PSI on each cylinder with new rings and freshly honed cylinders that were all within tolerance. I want to plug the idle relief ports, what epoxy do you use, JB WELD?
My motor is running very weak on the top end. I have the small bore carbs with the small 57D jets. it is likely that the previous owner may have done some mix matching. My block is at least a 94 as I checked the part number on the lower crank seal. whelsh plug number is G4094131 if anyone could tell me what year/model block I have. I think my serious lack of power could be a result of wrong carbs/throttle bodies, I am not sure why compression is not higher, new head seals. any suggestions on things to check or changes to make would be very helpful. If you think the bigger carbs/throttle bodies would help a lot let me know. I am really interested in your results Stratos.

I did see your post on the other board and you list the motor model number, from that number you have a non fastrike, non intruder "E" model motor and should have the smaller carbs.

[Sparkieboat]

the model number I posted was actually only a educated guess, the model tag is missing, I researched every part number I could find and came up with that model number, but I have been unable to confirm the actual block year/model, I know there were some differences in porting and such depending on model and year...So it would be nice if I could determine the exact year/model of the block. the part number on the lower crank case seal was only on 1994 and newer motors, the small bore carbs and throttle bodies indicate it is not a GL model, but the fact that I have discovered this is a mix match motor, means that I cannot use part numbers to determine year / model. and may actually have some wrong parts that are costing me HP.

[stratosdad]

look for a stampled letter right above the starter I have a G, also look at the port side lifting ring where it it machined flat i have a 458 funnythink i had the 337458 standard 150 heads? What are you intake and carb numbers? 3 or 4 wire VRO?

[Sparkieboat]

the place above starter is 022 stamped upside down. the throttle body is 340649, carbs 436797 with 57D main jets. on the block where the throttle rod goes up about in the middle is C3 then under that is 438419. 4 wire VRO

[bassfaster]

sounds like you have the small bore carbs. I bought some ficht cages off ebay for $90 and the chris carson reeds for $110. Seems the key to finding the cages for cheap is to search "ficht intake manifold" and the cages are still on the manifold and throttle bodies, the cages seem to be high priced from sellers selling them individually . I will put them on this week hopfully. I'll post my results. I haven't done any other upgrades but plan on getting some 195 heads and closing off the idle holes.

[Sparkieboat]

Yes small bore carbs, I noticed the same thing. the guys selling the cages by them selves seem to know they are worth something. I could buy an entire blown motor for what some of these guys are asking for the cages..LOL only thing on a ficht worth a crap...

[stratosdad]

the 436797 carbs are 96 carbs small bore just like I had.

[Sparkieboat]

when are you doing a test run stratos?? very curious to your result.

[stratosdad]

weekend at best putiing it back togehter tonite

[stratosdad]

Well it all went togehter. Its not to bad a job. I didnt like what I say after putting the reed cages on. the intakes where warping a bit. they seemed ok on the motor after tightening all the bolts. A little grease really helped the spagetti gaskets stay on the grooves. Blue loctite on all the intake bolts, the newer intake seals look a better design than the orignals.

256196256197256198

[Sparkieboat]

great job..hope she flies.

[KSRanger]

Nice work stratosdad! Can't wait to read how she runs. There is no satisfaction like building something yourself.

I checked the part numbers on my engine today. It's a E150GLEOM through and through. Evinrude, 150, Special, 20" shaft, 1995.
Carburetors 436798. Carb plate 341267. Heads 338311.
I have the parts book, everything on this engine is as it should be. Small carburetors, low compression heads etc.

Someone posted that the EL was the better block. I don't understand. "G" designates the decals placed on the engine cowl. Intruder, Ranger etc. The "L" designates the shaft length. L = 20". The E and O are: E = 1900. O = 95, 1995.

E - Evinrude
150 - Horsepower
G - Decal package
L - shaft length
E - first number of year
O - second number of year
M - Origin

I'm just trying to sift through all this and make sure I understand the year differences. It's tough enough with all the ebay listings claiming the 150/175 power heads are the same thing. Somewhere on here an OMC rep chimed in and laid down the law. They are not the same. I didn't book mark the post and don't remember the exact differences so forgive me for not listing them. If I remember correctly, it has something to do with the exhaust chest. The 175's are different in that area.

I might have found the reason my engine is hard to start when cold. It's called QuickStart. Here's an acrobat file page that explains how it works. http://www.cdielectronics.com/downloads/troubleshooting%20guide/OMC%206%20Cylinder%20Optical.pdf

[stratosdad]

Thanks, now let’s see if it runs. I primed the bulb and the carb filled and bulb got hard that’s a good sign. While I’m still a newbie and give lockjaw the credit on lots of investigation. I have some good news for you. 436798 are the big carbs. They are the same ones I just bought. also the 338311 heads are the good faststike/Intruder heads. If you look down the carbs throats you ill see a very, very small ridge in the necks down the passage.
The small bores have a huge reducer in there almost like a restrictor plate. The front end of the carbs are the same size as the airbox but the rear part of the carb is much smaller. Now the heads. the only one that may help are the 1991 heads that are part number 335195 they were on all 150/175 in 1991. But due to being over the 10% rule on jsut the 150 Fastrike/intuders they were recalled. They remained on the standard 150 cause they had the small bore carbs and the stayed on all the 175's cause they didn’t break the 175 hp 10% rule.


with out a grinder you can go the Ficht reed cages, 335195 or Baker Hot heads, and plug the idle reliefs. After that is unbolt the powerhead and weld up the hole and massage the ports.

As far as the 150/175 block difference it is the port hight of the exhaust port. I may be corrected but this is what I hace read adn been told. The GL 150 blocks have a port height of 1.69-1.71" the standard 150 are in the 1.66- 1.68" range and the 175 are in the 1.62-1.65" range this make since as the 150 GL fastrike/intruder was perfect of heavy bass boats. it is well notes to have a better bottom end and makes peak power at 5300-5400. the 175 makes a few more ponies but that’s at 5700. They also jet the bigger bore carbs 1-2 numbers higher than then 150 big bore carbs 150 are 69-70 and 175 come in at 70-72. the mids are different and then the idles are very different across the board as some have the air idle bleed jets and some have the good old adjustable needle valve that msot claim 5-5.5 turns out of the seat. Good news the 436798 at least mine have the idle screws and my small bores had them as well. my small bores idled perfectly and i count 8-9 turns out and guess what the brand new large bores are set from the factory at 8 as well.<o:p></o:p>

[stratosdad]

Small left............Large right

http://www.dropshots.com/zoom.html?large=http://media10.dropshots.com/photos/245321/20120521/b_201757.jpg

http://www.dropshots.com/zoom.html?large=http://media10.dropshots.com/photos/245321/20120521/b_201808.jpg

[Lockjaw]

That's what I found, the best 150 blocks are the EL ones, but be sure to measure the exhaust ports height to the deck, the lower the port height number, the more hp the motor is going to make, within reason.

I bet you find that sucker will idle like a dream once you get it in the water.

Love to see the speed increase numbers too.

Oh and I don't like those intake carb gaskets.

[stratosdad]

LJ? your intakes bow a little after installing the cages? Im sure they are flat once bolted to the motor and carbs installed. I like how they have the plastic feet so they cant be over tightened

[Lockjaw]

Never noticed that to be honest. I just swapped cages and slapped them on and bolted them down.

[stratosdad]

It fired right up and had to get to the idle screws, I should have set them before 2 @ 8 tunrs a few at 4 some at 5. Sam said I would probably end up around 7-8 . and he is right on. one carb was sneezing just a little, shut her down counted and that carb was at 4.5 cranked her out to 8 that cleared that up, got a bit worried as when I was reving it up a bit 2500-3 tops, one entire bank I could see a flame behind the carbs blades, shut her down then found that one carb on each bank had 1 idle screw filled wiht a green epoxy. It appeared to be a tamper product so you couldn't get a allen wrench in it. The flame had me worried so I started all over agian counting the turns out, most of them where in the 4's. Set all the screws at 7 full turns and its pretty good went to 7.25 to be sure it wont sneeze.

Got the ignition analyzer but have to get/ make a piston stop tool to be sure the pointer is accurate.

[Lockjaw]

To late for me to call you, and I had something to take care of. You need to set those with the lower in the water, on the hose won't do.

I set all mine at 5 turns out before I fired it up. LOL!!!

Glad you got it running, now take the sucker out and get some new numbers on it.

[KSRanger]

Hey that is good news! I just figured by '95 all the performance stuff was long gone for the 150. I had been told the 25P Renegade that came with my boat, was way to much prop for a 150. I never ran it because of people's advice against it. I bought the recommended 21P Raker prop and the RPM's were way high at part throttle.

The 195 heads came today but the UPS driver needed a signature. I'll get the FITCH reed cages at some point.

I wonder what sleeves would be best if a guy were to resleeve the block? When I rebuild my engine, I'm going with Wiseco forged pistons. I guess I'm looking for a high performance engine with durability.

[Lockjaw]

KS why you want to go with Wiseco's? I would get some good advice on clearances if you go that route. These engines have a 6150 rpm rev limit, you'd be fine with stock pistons. That is what I put back in mine.

I had a 25p gade. My BIL is running it now on his Ranger with a Fast Strike 150. He likes it because he doesn't have to trim all the way down to come out of the hole like he did with a raker. No idea what his runs like, his boat was always pretty stout for a 150 bolted flat on the back of the boat. I have a 25P TR04, its pretty stiff though. I haven't tried it on this engine yet.

I run a 24p raker 2 right now. I cruise mid 50's at like 4.5K rpms.

[KSRanger]

Thanks LJ. When I first bought the boat it was mid-winter. The shop guy handed me the Renegade 4-blade and said it needed a new hub. Didn't say if it went to this boat or not. Having time to waste, I got on the forum's and asked around what prop would be best with my rig. I don't want to mention names but one prop guru posted that the 25P Renegade was too much prop for my looper 150. He went on to say these engines don't like to be lugged and the 25P would only let it spin some low RPM that would gernade the engine. I needed a a nice small 21P prop that would let the engine spin up to at least 5500rpm. Several people chimed in saying he was right and just. Being th enice guy that I am, I obeyed this free advice. I have yet to replace the hub in that Renegade and run it. But I'm certain it's not as bad a prop for my boat as they claimed it was.

My reason for wanting to go with forged pistons is from old knowledge of running 2-strokes. More a durability reason than anything. Maybe cast piston's have come of age and durability isn't an issue anymore. It used to be a piston skirt issue when a 2-stroke blew up. Cir clips came ot and ended up on top of the piston. These are all motorcycle and Kart 2-stroke engines. I'm not up on what blows up on marine 2-strokes.

[stratosdad]

22 or 24 raker and a 23 or 25 Renegade are the most common setup for many 150 HP /18' Bass boats. I will admit the 25 Renegade might be a bit stiff for a 18' Ranger but is defintely worth a test on a strong 150/ lighter bass boat, setup properly in cool weather. If its reaching 5350 you are ok.

[Lockjaw]

Well if you were over on a certain bass boat website, then I can see where that might have come into play. As SD said, the most common props on bassboats in the 18 foot range in 22 to 25. Just depends on what you want to do. I have found for me, a 24 is just about perfect, I was hoping with this motor to get to where a 25P was about perfect. I could run pretty well with a 25 with just me, add a passenger, and it slowed down more out of the hole, not to bad once I was going.

These engines are limited to 6150, so I wouldn't get a wiseco for that. If you do a search on here, there is alot of negative about them, they tend to stick, so tolerances are very critical if you want to use them. I think they need a much longer break in period too. The best thing you can do is make sure you get a good machinist to do your block work. I used Nichols Outboard in Tennessee because I know Paul, and he is only a couple hours drive. They did my assembly of the short block too, not to mention they did a sleeve.

I have run 23p up to 26 on my old engine. I really liked a fury, even though those aren't recommended for a 150. There is also a difference in prop diameter to consider. I think if you are talking a 15 in diameter 25 p 4 blade, then yes, to much prop for a 150. If you are talking a 13.5 in diameter one (A gade is that) then that is a different story.

This is what I ran on mine on the original powerhead.

23p gade
25p gade
25p Turbo TXP
24 raker
24 fury
26 mighican raker copy
24 turbo
25 tr04
24 tr04
24 tempest

I liked the fury the best and it was the fastest. My second fave was the Tempest, and I wish I would have kept it. The 26 was to big, it could deal with it if just me, light on a cold day, but not with a passenger in the summer. The TXP drove awesome, wasn't fast. The TR04 in 25 was faster then the 24 TR04, and I didn't see much change at all going to the 24.

Best thing to do is find some bud's that have some other props, and go to the lake one day and just fiddle and see what you come up with. I have found mine likes a 3 blade pretty well, and I have the height set to work with a passenger. I can go up on the plate if its just me, but add a passenger and then I can't lift the bow. So if I am running solo, I will set the plate where it runs the best, then come down about 1/4 to 1/2 in to deal with passengers.

Don't forget also a good prop guy can tweek your prop to work for you and your set up. It might take a couple trips, but.... it's worth it.

[KSRanger]

Lockjaw, when you were talking about exhaust port higth differences between the GL & EL blocks. Could a guy resleeve a GL block to the EL specs? Maybe these are questions for a builder but could a guy take that a bit further and install "finger" ported sleeves? Maybe I shouldn't go into some of my other vehicle engine builds on a marine forum but my standard way of thinking is to "entertain" the idea of building the ultimate normally asperated engine. Find out as much about the engine as possible. See what kind of performance enhansements are available, who the best people are to do the work etc. Then return to reality. Gather needed parts to build the most for what I can afford or what is most reasonable/reliable. I'm not a plain vanilla kind of guy. If I'm going to take an engine apart, it's not going back together stock.

[Lockjaw]

I don't know that is a good machinist question, however, it seems to me if you went to the trouble to make a GL an EL, why not just make it a 175? Here is what I know from talking to Del (Paul's Machinist). He said normally in these blocks, if you stick your finger in the exhaust port the 150's have a slight lip, where the sleeve hangs down below the port. 175's don't generally have this. My 91 150 block doesn't either, and they resleeved it, and I checked that sleeve specifically when I got it back to see if there was a lip now, and there wasn't.

So an interesting question to pose would be what would happen if you took a 150 block with said lip, and had the machinist port that out? What would you be looking at? I really don't know. What I have seen alot said though is there isn't that much difference between a 175 and a 150, the 150 is a hotter motor then the 175, in that a good hot 150 is going to push the 10% over the 150hp limit, a 175 is not.

I am still playing around with mine, this one was an experiment. What I do know though is the ficht cages do make a difference. I have boyesens and I like them, some may say they don't help, however I have never put them in an engine and not see some kind of improvement. I believe the 91 heads help, and I have verified from multiple sources they have more compression then a stock head. Compared to a baker hot head, you might not see much difference, compared to the other eagle heads, you are talking a mph or so. That is what I picked up. I also have the monty tuner mod done to mine, although the can I sent him wasn't my original one, so I had to grind one of the openings in it to match the gasket, which my original one didn't need.

Del was around when Javelin set the record for a 150 with the 91 motors, so I think he knows a pretty fair amount about them. I kind of want to go back up there and pick his brain about what does this or that do when you change a port, like widen, or raise. I think raising it lowers compression, so you need to add some to get the motor to run, or increase your high speed timing, or both.

The biggest problem I have had is getting information. Usually I get bits and pieces and have to kind of put it all together. Port heights I got from one guy, the lip from another, ficht cages from others, the heads, others. You know? This is what I got in so much hot water on BBC about, I just wanted to put together a 1 source definitive reference guide so to speak on what you could do with essentially stock parts and what you would see as a result. I got alot of PM's from people about it, but the mod's didn't support it. So.... I don't play in their sandbox, or patronize their venders. I stay over here, and do what I like to do. I think its a little childish anyway, we are talking all stock parts, no one things changing reeds is a major modification, so whatever. I thought the whole thing was just plain stupid. No one was cussing or posting porn. And the thing that really irritated me about it is, I felt the mod's knew the answers, but wouldn't say. Like what made the 91 motors so hot? All you heard on that was crickets chirping. :reddevil:

Personally I think it would be really interesting to put together 3 blocks, an EL, a GL and a 175, use the same parts, but use ficht cages, do the tuner mod, and run 91 heads, and see what they put out on a dyno. Then run them on the same boat and see what the difference is. Then get one ported and see what it puts out, and what it does. Even in the article B&WB mag did, you don't know what base motor they started out with, or carbs. You know? You just know it was an evinrude on an allison.

Oh and sleeves are like 300 installed, so... not worth it to do 6 sleeves, unless you have a ported block. You would be better off to buy another block and start over. I would not have sleeved mine if it wasn't a 91 block.

If you, me and SD try to collaborate some, I think we will end up knowing alot more and it will be in one place, which is better then trying to piecemeal it.

[Sparkieboat]

here are a few pics of my ports. can anyone tell anything from these?
256325256326256327256328

[bassfaster]

-->Lockjaw, yeah it would be great if you guys could peice it all together so I could make my boat go faster :D. There really isnt much info consolidated into one place about upgrading these motors. The other website seems to frown on modifying the jrudes for some reason. Monty racing never answered my email so I guess he didnt want to give away any free advice lol. There realy isnt much mechanically I'm afraid to do, although I'd rather not blow up my motor expirementing. I will add to this thread the results of adding only the fitch cages and carson reeds to a stock 98 gl (large carbs 311 heads) if I ever get a few days off work and hopfully more mods later.

[stratosdad]

Just ran the boat 6100 rpms 71 mph.

[stratosdad]

Ran some special fuel.

April fools 256333

[KSRanger]

Port timing is everything on a 2-stroke. They all respond to raising or lowering the intake and exhaust port. Some respond well to widening the transfer ports. I seriously doubt any builders will disclose what they do. But that's okay. There are plenty of 2-stroke drag racers out there that are willing to answer questions. I'm going to speak with one tonight and see what he has to say.

Lockjaw you hit the nail on the head. BBC is where I used to frequent. The prop advice I got was way off. I did my own calculating and did pretty good on choosing a prop. Then kind of drifted into modifying the engine in my Corvette.

Any information I find out I will post here. These engine have been around much too long for there to still be secrets on how to get more power out of them. The thing that get's me is: if you were a dealer that made high performance parts for these engines, but no one knew your parts existed. How could you expect to make any money selling your parts?

I used to modify and rebuild turbochargers. Some were highly modified. Rebuild shops did not do the kind of work I was doing and still do not. At one point, shops refused to sell me rebuild kits because they couldn't make any money off just selling kits. I found another source and continued on. That's all blown over now but back then I couldn't believe how stupid it was. Guys seem to like monopolizing everything and it hurts us all. There's plenty of business for everyone. Things can die off pretty quick. Look at the old chevy 23 degree head engines. Couldn't give me one today. LS engines took over. All those people hording 4-bolt main blocks, 461, 292 etc heads. Not worth anything today. Technology can change at any time and all those super secret parts guys had stashed away...aren't worth a dime even if you could find someone that wants them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOq9jkm_QXs&list=UUPU26PUO56rCPZKuTPBFlLg&index=6&feature=plcp

[KSRanger]

Here is a good web site for reading up on 2-strokes. If you read far enough, you'll find out what loop charging is.

http://www.macdizzy.com/index.htm

[200venom]

91 Eagle power!!!!256365256366

[Sparkieboat]

71 MPH...heck yea..great job. I plugged idle relief ports, and got me a set of ficht reeds..I will post my results.

[Lockjaw]

Just ran the boat 6100 rpms 71 mph.

Details please. Kind of boat, prop, etc.

Sounds like it is smoking. Hope I get mine there.

[Lockjaw]

-->Lockjaw, yeah it would be great if you guys could peice it all together so I could make my boat go faster :D. There really isnt much info consolidated into one place about upgrading these motors. The other website seems to frown on modifying the jrudes for some reason. Monty racing never answered my email so I guess he didnt want to give away any free advice lol. There realy isnt much mechanically I'm afraid to do, although I'd rather not blow up my motor expirementing. I will add to this thread the results of adding only the fitch cages and carson reeds to a stock 98 gl (large carbs 311 heads) if I ever get a few days off work and hopfully more mods later.

Well so far, here is what we know.

EL block is best for 150. Get the big carbs, 91 heads, ficht reed cages. That seems to be the best bang for the buck. I have the monty tuner mod done, boyesen reeds, and plugged idle reliefs. Still tinkering with mine.

Whoever posted about monty, best thing to do is call him. I have emailed him too, he never answered, but when I call and leave him a message, he usually calls me back in a couple hours. He was very easy to work with on the tuner mod, called me and told me when he was shipping it back, and did a real nice job. I would love to pick his brain sometime, and see if he would school me some on what all these different things do, like with ports and stuff. I doubt I could grind them I can't see up close for squat. :D

"The other board" is what it is. We aren't talking about taking one of these and telling people to mill heads, port them etc. This is more just what factory parts work best to add a little more spunk to you motor. None of this should shorten the life of the engine, or put it at risk of blowing up. Sadly I think those mod's knew all of this, and just didn't want to let go with the info, for whatever reason. Personally I found the whole thing childish and pathetic. But you know how opinions are, everyone has one. Oh and I think there is a major case of little man syndrome going on too. :reddevil:

I would like to know how Carson's reeds do. He has tried to tell me they would help, but, you know, hard to get someone to pony up for a set of reeds when they already got a set. But it would be interesting to see. I am kind of intrigued by his race ones.

[Lockjaw]

here are a few pics of my ports. can anyone tell anything from these?
256325256326256327256328

That is what mine looked like, I bet you have a lip on the exhaust port between the sleeve and the block. I don't know why they tend to have those scuff marks above the exhaust port.

You know what I really want to do, but it would cost a ton of money. Send the block off to extrude hone and have them run their abrasive polishing media through all the ports and clean everything up.

[stratosdad]

Guys I was jsut kidding about the 6100, 71 gps. I havent run it on the lake yet. Didnt you see the picture of the NOS?

[Sparkieboat]

last guy that joked about running fast, well lets just say he has not made a post in a while...ROFL

[bassfaster]

Guys I was jsut kidding about the 6100, 71 gps. I havent run it on the lake yet. Didnt you see the picture of the NOS?

I really wanted to throw up the :icon_bs:flag, but I figured you where either joking or that was your speed with zero fishing gear, one seat and wearing a speedo :eek:. There is a guy in my fishing club with an gambler outlaw that claims it does 80. His motor has 150 stickers (limit for that boat) on it but his model number says j175. It does smoke my boat but he has a 26 raker on it so I think its pretty close to impossible to go 80mph under the rev limiter.

[Lockjaw]

Guys I was jsut kidding about the 6100, 71 gps. I havent run it on the lake yet. Didnt you see the picture of the NOS?

:reddevil:

That is just wrong. On so many levels, and its way past April 1.

I'd like to try a Gambler, don't see that many of them.

[Sparkieboat]

You can get a CDI power pack with no or adjustable RPM limit

[stratosdad]

heading out... wish me luck.

[Lockjaw]

You can get a CDI power pack with no or adjustable RPM limit

You can, but I am not sure the optical ignition system will spin high enough to really make that worth it.

[Lockjaw]

heading out... wish me luck.

Well if your area is like my area, you picked one heck of a hot day.

[stratosdad]

it runs great, idles perfect, no way to test top end due to boat traffic. over all a good trial. back at the ramp had her on the trailer and had a 18" left to go and i dont normally power load it but said what the hell this ramp could take it. stepped on it and it felt like it was running on 1 cyl. threw it in N reved it up and she pushed it right on and over the roller. went to R and she pulled it off the trailer ok.

Hit 5600 pretty easy and was no where trimmed out. sounds alot stronger. mid range was always very responsive but it does feel better. Pops out of the hole like always. Temp was 83 water 77. 1/2 fuel, fully loaded me and the Mrs.

Stock 23 tempest plus 8" plate around 3.25" Water pressure is 25-28 WOT so i have room.

[KSRanger]

Sounds good SD. Take it easy on the break-in.

Lockjaw, that lip that the GL exhaust port sleeve has VS no lip in the EL sleeve. I've read elsewhere on here about raising the ports could mean trouble. I don't see any way around it. Raising the exhaust ports can also increase compression, not lower it. Right now my plan is to buy two sleeves. One 1991 EL sleeve and a 1995 GL sleeve. Then compare ports. Also I think it will be easier to map the ports using a sleeve. The web site I linked a few posts back is where I'm going to spend quite a bit of time until I figure out the port timing of the two sleeves. Then use the software download to calculate where improvements are needed. I still may send the block to Gordon but for my knowledge, I want to degree the port timing and know what it is.

I ran my engine tonight in a small oval cattle watering tank. I removed the prop to decarbon it. I've used this tank several times over the years to run the engine here at home. Water pressure has always been around the 30psi range. Tonight it was barely 10psi. Must be time for a new water pump...

[Lockjaw]

No raising the exhaust port lowers compression. The piston isn't making any compression until the rings get past all the ports. The higher the port, the less distance of stroke of the piston there is, thus lower compression.

I chatted with a guy at length about his. If you raise the ports, particularily the exhaust port, you need more timing and/or more compression to get back to what things were like with unmodified ports.

You need a new water pump it sounds like to me.

[stratosdad]

we all ahave to understand the word lower or higher exhaust port. Raising it to me means making it closer to the head deck thereby lowering it distance. Is this correct? so a 1.62" port is higher than a 1.71" port

[bassfaster]

put in my new carson reeds and ficht cages yesterday. Started right up and runs good in the driveway. I adjusted the idle screws to 7 turns. I took a few pics but I cant get them to post because the file is too large :confused:. Oh well hopefully I can get out and try them in a few days.

[bassfaster]

ok figured out how to resize a few pics...stupid iphone 8mp camera

256447256448256449

[KSRanger]

Those reeds look nice. Everything looks nice and clean.

Just so we are on the same page. Yes, the smaller the number, the higher the port (toward the head).

I need to go back and read. It must have been raising the intake port that raised compression. Longer intake opening allows more fuel & air in.

While I had the prop off, it's a 14.5 X 24 pitch Raker II. I thought it was a 26.... A few posts back I linked a You Tube video of my boat taking off. It has almost no bow rise. The entire boat lifts as it gets on plane. I put an SE Sport 300 cavitation plate wing on it. Was very noticeable at lower plane speeds. Anyway I'm headed to the lake. Water pump has to wait. Going to keep an eye on the water pressure gauge and take it easy.

[Lockjaw]

I would have a hard time believing raising any port would raise compression, but that is just me.

Be interested to see how it runs. What kind of hull do you have? I am running a 24 raker 2 also. I like it so far.

[stratosdad]

Last night opened up the new to me OMC ignition analyzer. First had to check where it was and it was actually in the 4 degrees on the idle timing and 22 degrees on the max. Reset it all to spec and it ended up pulling the timing back i click on the tab and putting the idle up a notch. I also had a 1/8 between the roller and timing cam so I adjusted that so it touched. Then I went and checked to see if the timing pointer was on TDC and while checking it with a piston stop got 30 degrees on one side and 27 degrees on the other so it was off. Then i checked it with a spark plug hole dial indicator and again it was almost 2 degrees off. Reset it and then checked the timing again. I felt better with the high speed timing at the 18-19 it was at and had the idle at 6. I figured she would idle a bit higher but didn’t think it was. I also turned the idle mixture screw in 1/4 turn (leaner). Hit the bigger lake today and with over 1/2 tank and full tournament load it was a different boat. the bottom en was much crisper and midrange was very responsive. Found a longer stretch and it was turning over 5700. Set her down and came back and water was a bit smoother and saw 5800-5900 and i was still trimming but the water got a bit bumpy and was worried about launching it off a wave. The GPS was climbing through 62 and 63 and for a bit was showing 64.4. Seems if I’m making a very long slight right turn she drives so much smoother and faster. I have had many seasoned drivers in my boat and all claim it walks the worst of any hull they have driven. I can keep it flat and the hyd steering is very tight.

I need to try a bigger prop she if she has the torque to turn a 26 Raker. I have a A45 23 Tempest with the PVS Vents and hub on its way to be B&B cupped and repitchd to a 24.

[KSRanger]

I would have a hard time believing raising any port would raise compression, but that is just me.

Be interested to see how it runs. What kind of hull do you have? I am running a 24 raker 2 also. I like it so far.

Port windows are like the duration of a camshaft in a 4-stroke. The more crankshaft degrees the valve is open, the more air/fuel is drawn in. Same thing with a 2-stroke. The more crankshaft degrees the port is exposed, the more air/fuel is drawn in.

In order to get more power in a 4-stroke, eventually you're going to get to a point where changing the camshaft is the next logical step. Changing cams doesn't always mean loosing low end torque. In fact cams with a lot of lift but short duration have much more bottom end torque than a stock cam.

What I've seen done on some hot 2-strokes is: A .100 notch cut in the piston to lower the intake window. Since the piston only goes so low down the cylinder, you can't lower the intake port. So he basically lowers the piston dome to make the intake window open sooner. Then he raised the exhaust port .100. This was a 3-cylinder 750cc engine. Stock it has 66hp. Cutting the intake side of the piston dome in-line with the intake port, and raising the exhaust port. This would produce 120hp.

I have an '02 KX250 dirt bike. I recently did a total restoration on the engine and chassis. These modern 2-strokes have what they call, exhaust valves. A centrifugal clutch device pushes and pulls a rod hooked to a slider inside the main exhaust port. There are two side port doors as well that open & close along with the slider. It's really complicated how it all works. But what it does is even out the torque curve. The flatter the torque curve across the rpm range, the better. This bike is very easy to ride. Power comes on just off idle, front wheel goes up and just stays there. No rush of power, just smooth controllable torque all the way up as you keep the throttle open. Next gear, same thing. The intake transfer ports are huge on that 250 cylinder. There's no way to get transfer ports that large on a side-by side cylinder arrangement. Carbon build-up is a problem with these "valves" on these modern 2-srtrokes. They have to come apart after so many hours. I imagine that's why marine engines haven't picked up on that technology.

Almost forgot. My hull is a '95 Ranger 482VS. It's a 19.7 ft hull with an 18" offset transom.

[KSRanger]

When it comes down to basics. These engines have a best efficiency point. Typically BEP's are where the torque and horsepower lines cross on a dyno sheet. The manufacturer tested this engine under all conditions and came up with the best compromise for a wide variety of uses. All factory engines are generic to a degree. The best designed engines are deep well pump engines. They run at a set rpm. day & night. So the camshaft can be made for maximum power & efficiency at 3500rpm. If it were a 2-stroke 60 degree V6, the port timing would be maximized for 3500rpm and anything below or above that, it would be out of it's BEP and not have much power.

There are dyno simulators (sims). Programs that you can input engine information in and get back very close to real life, what torque & horsepower an engine will have if you build it this way. They've been around for almost two decades now. I've spent months running different cams through Desktop Dyno for one vehicle I have. Anyway, they have them for 2-strokes as well. You have to know the connecting rod length. Crankshaft stroke. Cylinder bore. All the port timing degrees. Input the data and hit enter. It spits out a graph showing torque & horsepower of the configuration. You can make changes, without getting out a grinder tool, and see how it affected the lines. It's probably not as much fun as a video game, but the results are very close to real life.

This is what I would like to play around with. Whatever findings I learn, I'll post here. First I need to buy a cylinder sleeve of the 91 and 95 to get the stock port timings. Then I'll need to know connecting rod length. That may be in the service manual as well as crankshaft stroke.

[KSRanger]

Last night opened up the new to me OMC ignition analyzer. First had to check where it was and it was actually in the 4 degrees on the idle timing and 22 degrees on the max. Reset it all to spec and it ended up pulling the timing back i click on the tab and putting the idle up a notch. I also had a 1/8 between the roller and timing cam so I adjusted that so it touched. Then I went and checked to see if the timing pointer was on TDC and while checking it with a piston stop got 30 degrees on one side and 27 degrees on the other so it was off. Then i checked it with a spark plug hole dial indicator and again it was almost 2 degrees off. Reset it and then checked the timing again. I felt better with the high speed timing at the 18-19 it was at and had the idle at 6. I figured she would idle a bit higher but didn’t think it was. I also turned the idle mixture screw in 1/4 turn (leaner). Hit the bigger lake today and with over 1/2 tank and full tournament load it was a different boat. the bottom en was much crisper and midrange was very responsive. Found a longer stretch and it was turning over 5700. Set her down and came back and water was a bit smoother and saw 5800-5900 and i was still trimming but the water got a bit bumpy and was worried about launching it off a wave. The GPS was climbing through 62 and 63 and for a bit was showing 64.4. Seems if I’m making a very long slight right turn she drives so much smoother and faster. I have had many seasoned drivers in my boat and all claim it walks the worst of any hull they have driven. I can keep it flat and the hyd steering is very tight.

I need to try a bigger prop she if she has the torque to turn a 26 Raker. I have a A45 23 Tempest with the PVS Vents and hub on its way to be B&B cupped and repitchd to a 24.

I would really like to own one of those analyzers. Friday I stopped in at the local marine shop and asked the mechanic how they set the timing on a 60 degree V6 150 engine. He said all he did was adjust the carburetor linkage. He never messed with the ignition timing because they were set at the factory. When asked if he had the analyzer? Nope, never used one. That's typical around here though. Kansas isn't known for anything except tornado's.

[Sparkieboat]

sounds typical of most outboard repair shops that I have been to also..this is why I learned to do it myself...way too much incompetence out there.

[Lockjaw]

I have an ignition analyzer too. It's awesome for setting timing. You don't have to have one, you can use a timing gun, but.... I don't like hanging off the back of a boat at WOT to check timing.

Mike I think a 26 is going to be a bit steep, but be interesting to see. I always thought my original motor ran best at 18 degree's of timing on the high side. Never gained anything by setting it at 20. What high speed jets did you end up going with?

Hopefully I will be moved pretty soon and can tinker with mine. Sadly I think all my boat stuff is buried in the back of a storage unit, so until I find a house and move into it, I am kind of stuck where I am.

[stratosdad]

No not 26 at all. I did the check to see if the pointer and the TDC on the motor where correct and it wasnt. the procedute to test if Zero is really Zero is to bring the piston up against a piston stop tool on 2 revolutions and compare the result. I used 30 BTDC as a refernece and if zero is zero the other contact point would be 30 ATDC. it wasnt it was 26-27 so that meant the pointer and wheel where out 1/2 the differnce of 4 degrees making the pointer off 2 degrees. I loosens the pointer se screw and alligned it up and checked it again with a dial indicator measuring the piston hight. You wan to see the highest piston measurement at TDC not 2 degrees off.

[KSRanger]

The worce parts is, you still get charged for the service. Doesn't matter if all he does is loosen a carb rod set screw. The flat rate book only covers "tune up". I went in asking for some de-carbon spray. He rummages through an old carboard box, finds a well worn can of engine tuner with about half an ounce left. He says: there's still enough left in there to do your engine. I'll take $5.00 for it. I pick up the can, at first I thought it was empty. The dogs roaming around were getting restless. I left and drove across town to the only other marine dealer in town. Walking in, they had a '97 150 Fastrike hanging on a display for sale. Have several cans of engine tuner on the shelf. Didn't ask how they tune up an engine.

[Lockjaw]

I have the factory piston stop tool also. They were a little proud of it. :cheers:

[Sparkieboat]

there is a way to make your own cheap.

[stratosdad]

cant beat ebay but i have a double sided chase i drilled the center out and tapped for a 1/4-20 screw

[KSRanger]

I may be having a senior moment here but, according to the service manual. It says all proceedures listed below rotate the crankshaft clockwise (in bold). Install the piston stop tool. Rotate the flywheel clockwise until it contacts the piston stop. Put a mark 1" etc. then continue to rotate the flywheel clockwise... I must be missing something or it was late, having a sixties flashback.

[stratosdad]

get the piston on the downward travel, past TDC. Screw the piston stop in till hit hits the piston good. then turnit Clockwise to move the piston down then it hits the stop on the way up. Record the degrees and split the differnce. I hear ya, had to read it several times and still had me thinking. Its like degreeing a cam but no counter clockwize.

I didnt use the 1" but recodred the mark on the flywheel i used 30 as a reference point. dial indicator is much easier.

[KSRanger]

I'm also interested in what size main jets you ended up with. I checked mine. They were the 69D's.

[stratosdad]

Mine came with 70D's as they are jetted for a 175. I have to check them but im sure im pretty close. 69- 72 is the range all they ever came with. i have seen some reference to a 73 but not that confident that is correct.

[bassfaster]

The 98 175gl has the 73. My 98 150gl has 69 and 38. I really don't get the reason for all the different combos of air bleeds and high speed orifices.

[stratosdad]

funny I got the 1997 -1998 175 GL carbs and they have 70's, they were brand new and have a build date of 10-1997. I may try a set of 72 to see how she runs. Dont think i'd see any differnce with 1 number increase. But again leaner is faster but also melts pistons easier.

[bassfaster]

The 98 150jl has 70 high speed jets with I think a 25 air bleed. I'm just going by the parts list on boats.net. I think you have already proved not all motors have the correct parts according to those parts list

[stratosdad]

Amen.. I'm glad to see my high speed jets have the brass plug screws with the teet' to stop them from backing out.

[Lockjaw]

I am running 74's right now, and think that is a little to rich, but in fairness, drove the boat loaded with a partner, water in the wells, a few bass and about 25 gallons of gas. I thought 73's were better.

Might pull the bakers and put 91's on it and lean it down a little, once I get settled into a house, instead of under an overpass.

also remember these main jets are a little larger then the number says. I think Racer told me .0035 larger, on average.

[bassfaster]

Well I took the boat out sat. for a little club tournament, probably not the best conditions for testing out my new reeds and cages. My idle adjustment was way out of wack at 7.5 turns out, it just idled way too rich and slow rpms. I really didnt have much time to mess around with it, but I backed it off to 7 turns and adjusted the idle timing a bit but was still way off. It ran stronger compared to last weekend by about 100 rpm and 1mph with what I think is similar load. When I got home I did some driveway tuning and found 5.5 to 5 turns out seemed to be the best setting. My manual says 5 turns out is the starting piont for a stock engine. Overall I definatly noticed an improvement in performance not really something that was blowing me out of the seat but more sort of the feeling you get when you change your sparkplugs. I think I must have had an air leak before because I was idling much slower than before and I did notice one of my old throtle body to manifold gaskets was pinched a bit in a spot. The manual says 600-700 rpm for idle speed but that seems a little to slow to me. I was idling at about 600rpm but it would just keep dieing, no spit or sputter just sort of slowing to a stop.

[stratosdad]

I hear its better to adjust them in the water as the backpressure is different than on the muffs. I turned mine all in 1/4 so im at 7.25 now. They run great, the only negative is when cold i use to be able to start it on the trailer when launching, never hit the hot foot and it would start and idle perfect with the old carbs. Now if i never touch the hotfoot and drop in into gear say 10 seconds after starting it will die and need a restart. It starts fine, I hit the pedal to being the Rev's up a bit let it idle down and then it will go into gear and stay running.

Had a little issue Friday after running and gunning we call it a day, my son was driving back to the ramp about 5 miles, got up and was running fine 50-55 and it died, i jumped to check the bulb and it was soft. Primed it and he had it started already and we took off, another 1/4 mile she died. Bulb a bit soft, primed it up and ran back to the ramp 4+ miles fine, while i was getting the truck my son was hammering it up adn down the lake and it never died again. Stumped it only had about 3 gallons left in the tank. I hope that the VRO isn’t acting up. Headed to lake George Ny in a few weeks and hate to have a spare $400 part with me. I have had poor luck with bulbs. Went the BRP route and even had the dealer do all the clamps a few years ago, immediately had the same issue soft bulb. I redid all the clamps and it was better but the bulb got huge, the rubber all stretched out in a few months and bulbs rubber was very soft. Also it wouldn’t prime unless it was almost pointing up and down, sideways forget it. So I get another BRP bulb and it’s the one I have now. Rubber is very hard like it should be but this one still likes to be positioned pointing up a little. My original bulb was 14 years old and still worked perfect in any position. I knew I never should have changed it.<o:p></o:p>

[Lockjaw]

Mine would not run with the idle screws out that much. If I am at 6 turns out, I would be surprised. SD is correct, you need to set it on the water, but you are probably close.

SD I never have to hit the gas to crank mine, just use the primer and it starts right up. Usually dies and then I start it up again, and its good to go. I never drop it in gear until the idle drops off cold circuit.

If In could quit moving junk, I would love to get out and play around with mine. Ya'll are making me jealous.

[stratosdad]

We have some shallow small ramps up here, not like those 6 lane beauties you S'rn guys have. We do need to reposition ourselves so we dont bump., sometimes I have to use R & F real quick

[bassfaster]

Yeah I know I need to get out and adjust it in gear in the water. Just to many summertime goof balls out there saturday. I still have the xd-50 going for now and just judging by the amount of smoke in the driveway 5 turns out just about eliminates the smoke. I dont actually know where the idle timing is set at but next time I'll start with 5.5 turns and the idle pointer all the way to the + side. Seems like mine idles best about 800rpm but I'd like to keep it as low as possible just to avoid that hard clunk into gear.

[bassfaster]

Oh, and I did that little test where you push the key in at full throttle to see if you speed up or slow down. I slowed down so I guess that means there is no need to up the jets with just the cage and reed upgrade.

[stratosdad]

Checking the plugs after a WOT run would tell if your lean or rich, The motor will make its most hp when the fuel is a bit lean but thats when piston melt starts also. We jet a bit rich to keep a 2 stroke piston cool with a bit extra fuel. If your in the 68-70 range on mains I don't think the reeds and cages would effect that much at all to require a richer jet.

[Lockjaw]

We have some shallow small ramps up here, not like those 6 lane beauties you S'rn guys have. We do need to reposition ourselves so we dont bump., sometimes I have to use R & F real quick


That's what a trolling motor is for. You are just going to fatten the pocket book of your gearcase mechanic if you don't let it drop under 1K before shifting.

[stratosdad]

Got to run it again today and got my new prop in. First I tried a stock 26 RakerII, Hole shot was pretty good and was able to turn it 55-5600 rpms. The lake was pretty buzy and was hard to really trim her out but gps was showing 64-66 and I know I needed more room. Then i put on my just worked 23.5 A45 Tempest. This thing is sick, super thin and is a full 15" prop with tons of cup. The hole shot was incredible, midrange very responsive and the top end was 67.6 and still had more but conditions where not the best. This was with just me 1/2 tanks and loaded to fish. Fyi both prop had 25-28 lbs of H20. Lake George next weekned hope for some good Smallies and some calm conditions.


On my last run i sether down to a loud horn "low oil" checkd the tank and its way down. Gues i have used 50 gallons so far this yea but anyhow. From the early 2000 this motor has used Pensoil semi and nothing else. I use maybe 3-4 cans of seafoam and year and do Decarb with the BRP stuff. So ??? Pensoil is $17 gallon and XD is ??? I never priced it. I knwo my local place sells it out of a 55 gallons and am wondering if i should do it and it really will be about the same if oyu add in all the SEAFOAM and engine tuner.

LJ can you comment on how that 100 ran in your motor?

[Sparkieboat]

there may be some benefits to some of the more costly oils, but I run the cheapest stuff I can get usually. the penzoil at wal-mart or on sale at bass pro, Sams also carries it. but I am just fishing..not racing..never blown a motor yet.

[bassfaster]

So ST how much of an improvement has all your parts swapping given you? I took my boat out last weekend by myself for the first time in awhile expecting to get a new top speed. I think something is wrong with my motor I lost about 300 rpm of top end but it felt strong coming out of the hole and midrange :confused:. I think I might be sucking air in somewhere, bought some new fuel line. Hose was pretty loose around the vapor sep to carb hoses, I hope thats my only problem.... I think I am going to switch to penzoil full syn. from the oil-store. Been using xd-50, too expensive and dont see any advantage over penzoil semi synthetic.

[stratosdad]

This weekned will tell, got a big lake to try it out in. I'll be bringing the just done A45 15" Tempest 23 and a 26 RakerII. If I can spin the 26 to 56-5800 it will be a big improvment. While top speed is always high on the wish list. I just want it to run good loaded to fish with 2 guys. Thats where it had been lacking ever since I added the bigger Minnkota and batteries/charger.

65 loaded I'll be very happy thats 5 over where it was. then there is always a bluprinted prop. But the Tempest is very close to that now.

Good luck with yours. What did you do since the last time that you could have lost 300?

[Sparkieboat]

cool...the ficht reeds and plugging the idle relief ports picked mine up 6 MPH. probably almost 20 HP, just a guess.

[stratosdad]

SparkieBoat? Did you do a before and after compression test and can share the results?

[Sparkieboat]

yes, I was at 95 on 2,4,6 and 100 on 1,3 and 105 on #5. all went up 5 PSI after I blocked the idle relief ports with JB weld. no noticeable cranking or idling problems. I was told I would jump 10 PSI, but only got 5, but it seems to have really helped along with the ficht reeds. I highly recommend doing it.

[Lockjaw]

I like the XD100 because you don't ever have to decarb. You should notice your motor will run better with it also. I think the XD50 is ok, I mainly ran XD100. I don't like the Penn oil, to me I never saw a reduction in smoke like they claimed, and I don't think it burns near as clean as Xd100. Plus I like the way it smells when it burns. :D

Seafoam is almost 9 dollars a can. 4 cans a year is basically a gallon of XD100. I know alot of people like Penn, I just don't. I guess that is why they make different oils.

SD sounds like you have that boat running good. Who did the tempest work? Mine ran 65 loaded with a 24 fury a couple years ago. Don't know if it will do that with a raker 2. I always liked the 24 Tempest I ran, wish I had kept it and had a little more work done to it.

[stratosdad]

Mark Croxton Worked it. Said it was a very rare prop. Huge wheel 15" and everything about it thin. It has the Flo-Torq hub but only had the vents. i had him machine it for the PVS and am running 3 meduims. It has a great holeshot and spins very easy. We will see how it runs this weekend. I may have it BP and repitched if the revs are to high but he thinks the big blades will make it a much stiffer wheel than the actual 23 on the pitch blocks it is.

257459

[Lockjaw]

OK I think that is the faster tempest, the A45. Does the Raker 2 ventilate coming over on plane? Mine does. I have a new 22p one for pulling tubes, but I haven't run it yet. I was hoping the Tr04 I have will work on this motor.

[stratosdad]

No the 26 doesnt vent at all, just the opposite lugs just a bit, 2500 rpm. But i have to admit the bow only rises a very little and is down very fast. The bigger the prop the more vent they need. A 22 will vent and blow out every easy with the same size vent holes as compared to a 24 or 26. I had a 24 with stock holes and it always blew out coming over.

[bassfaster]

I think I found my problem; spark plugs were all gapped supper tight. Guess I will add gapping spark plugs to my long list of things I shouldnt do after several beers lol.... I have a blueprinted by Mark Croxton 24 raker, it doesnt blowout at all on breakover so long as motor is trimmed all the way in. But if I'm in the big waves at KY lake just trying to go fast enough to stay on plane it will blow out all the time. Panic and fear also play a factor in my blowouts in the big waves I think too :eek:

[stratosdad]

Its .030 not .003 burp.......

[Lockjaw]

I think I found my problem; spark plugs were all gapped supper tight. Guess I will add gapping spark plugs to my long list of things I shouldnt do after several beers lol.... I have a blueprinted by Mark Croxton 24 raker, it doesnt blowout at all on breakover so long as motor is trimmed all the way in. But if I'm in the big waves at KY lake just trying to go fast enough to stay on plane it will blow out all the time. Panic and fear also play a factor in my blowouts in the big waves I think too :eek:

You should try a 4 blade for stuff like that. Alot more stability. I was amazed at the diff between a raker and a gade in rough water. I never had problems with my fury losing bite on Guntersville in the big waves either. My stock Raker 2 24 only blows out coming over on plane, after that it stays hooked up. I never trim all the way in. I am 1/4 up when I take off. Only time I am all the way down is when I pull kids on tubes.

SD the only 24 that didn't ventilate with my boat was a turbo. Everything else that is a 3 blade required small or totally block PVS plugs. I am thinking about sending my R2 to Steve at SCP and have him drill the vents for PVS plugs, and clean it up a little. I need to get a spare prop out of storage though to do it. Oh and the turbo won't plane with my mag case.

[stratosdad]

Well it appears that I gained an honest 5-6 mph with 2 aboard. Today with the fuel and oil tank filled to the brim, me the wife and a full load of everthying I saw 64.7 with the A45 Tempest. Temps where around 50 and water 66. May have had a little more as well. Never with a full tank has this thing ever ran so good. Tommorro when the tank is low I'll do some solo runs.

[Sparkieboat]

congrats..wish I could see 50 MPH with mine.

[bassfaster]

50 degrees :eek:!!! Do you live in Alaska? Nice job with the motor. Are you going to plug the idle holes next? I'm thinking of pluging mine and just using my original heads as I have been suffering from cash flow interruptus.

[stratosdad]

ok it was 45 at 6 am in upstate NY, but funny thing it was the same temp back in RI. I think i'm done for the year with any mods. I want to redo the carpet next. Over the winter I may. In this cool air she is loading up just a bit at 625 idle. I may bump the idle timing up a little or lean out the idle screws a bit. She wont stall but is struggeling.

[Lockjaw]

That is alot of gain for the money, and about what I saw going to the bigger carbs, ficht cages and baker heads.

[Lockjaw]

Just got my boat out this weekend after getting the 91 powerhead broken in. Saw a high of 68.5 spinning a 24p raker 2. That is faster then I ran with a B&B 24p Fury on the original powerhead.

[bassfaster]

Nice! My boat is going slower than ever since i have added some weight with an extended deck new heavier seats and batteries :/ I have only one 335195 head i found on ebay. Been looking for another for awhile. They seem to have disappeared now that i actually have the money to buy some :(

[Sparkieboat]

just as an update on my boat. After plugging the idle relief ports and gaining some PSI, I installed a set of fitch intake manifolds and reeds. I got up to around 46 MPH at around 5400 RPMs if I remember right. I sold the motor and got me a 2.5 merc 150, it is a 1996 motor if I remember right. with a 17 pitch prop I get to 47 MPH at almost 6K RPMs. The merc gives much smoother and better performance at the mid range RPMs, this was a good move for my boat, I have not even started to soup this thing up yet. I have a 19 and a 21 pitch prop that I am saving for when I get some more HP out of this motor, but I am pretty happy with it right now. I have not tried to see if I can get more speed out of a bigger prop because of the very impressive mid RPM range performance that I am getting, remember I am using this for fishing so I have to go slow in the choppy waves and I need good firm response in the 3500-5000 RPM range depending on conditions.

[Lockjaw]

Get a good prop for it, at least a 23p tempest and see what happens.

[Sparkieboat]

I have a 21P Mirage plus, a 24P power tech and a 25P quicksilver laser 2. I may try the 21p prop and see what happens. I just do not want to lose the great response that I am getting in the mid RPM range.