welding ?

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i`m wondering why so much talk about welding on lowers? why is a welded on skeg , if done properly so bad? you see guys welding blocks and that seems to be fine.i`m not running a rocket by no means nor do i have a welded lower, i do have a cut mid that is welded. also you see alot of cut down shats to 15", some welded some resplined. i was always told that the origanl splines are hardened ? thanks

[transomstand]

Heating any metal changes it's properties, frequently making it stiffer, more brittle, and prone to cracking. The types of alloys used in gearcases can be quite difficult to weld. Welding a skeg at it's root is pretty much an impossible task, they just can't tolerate the enormous force that's applied in a performance application.

It's just not worth the risk. Losing a skeg at 80 or 90 mph, is gonna cause you to have a very bad day.

[Robby321]

Heating any metal changes it's properties, frequently making it stiffer, more brittle, and prone to cracking. The types of alloys used in gearcases can be quite difficult to weld. Welding a skeg at it's root is pretty much an impossible task, they just can't tolerate the enormous force that's applied in a performance application.

It's just not worth the risk. Losing a skeg at 80 or 90 mph, is gonna cause you to have a very bad day.

Yep, so right. Theres are VERY few, VERY FEW, people that can weld aluminum...RIGHT ..(guess we are talking aluminum here), and I worked 21 years a Machinist, (also a qualified welder too, but not certified pipe), the weld shop same bay..(Reynolds Alum, back in Illinois). Have to say too, alum, will NOT tolerate heat much at all, simple warp. I knew some the best welders at the shop, and I was restoring a old HD Sporty Ironhead motor. It was dumped at one time, and a massive gouge on the clutch cover. Gave it to a dude there, to fill it in, and the jerk did just that. BUT? ZERO, some one else with soaked constant towels around it, draw the heat away. And he never braced/clamped it down done either. SOB came back looking fine, I polished it up, like new. BUT? Put it on, and it was twisted into a "rocker", 1/4 gap, any side. And it was a off year, and took me 3 years, to find a "good to go", orig.
My take, ANYTHING welded a mid, trash it. OK a skeg,..(AT the lower part broke off, NEVER AT THE CASE! Alum prop work, OK, as expendable. And won't kill ya trying either. Pete nailed it..:thumbsup: Don't go cheap here...as yer life will depend on what ya do.

[TEXAS20225]

maybe your last day. its amazing what people will do trying to save a few bucks!!!! i have seen what happens when a skeg is snapped off of a Sporty when its never been welded at 105 mph the boat owner lost his life

[TEXAS20225]

i weld it all the time on fishing motor cases, mostly little stuff and a lot of cavplate blow outs. it cast and not very good cast its full of impurity's that snap, crackle and pop even when pre heated to 350/400 before root is attempted its just very brittle before you start and gets unstable to adjacent metal. when i add to a fishing motor skegg i always use part of another skegg it gets it closer any way but never as good as a non welded unit

[Image 21]

ok so the lowers make sense, i seen them fall off after being welded, now mids being cut down, why the bad vibe on them, cutting down to a 15" you see tons of them, i had one and i was thinking about doing another one, two vendors on the board make them and all you hear is how great they are,sounds like a double standard,the skeg thing 100% agree

[transomstand]

I've seen all manner of cut down mids, some excellent, others junk. Many of the stock cut downs have broken. My guy (Ronnie), will only do an offshore casting. They are much thicker, and he's never had a failure. There are several other guys who also do very good work.

The stock casting is not receptive to a cut and reweld. When cut in half, the two portions don't mate together, so a lot of engineering is required, plus the casting is extremely thin (about 1/8"). The offshore casting is about 1/4" thick, will partially mate together when cut, and gives the welder a lot more material to work with.

[milkdud]

With a mid you can use backer material to beef up the area where it is spliced together. Normally there is an extra layer of material added inside the mid to add strength.

With a skeg it has to remain thin and no material can be added to beef it up so to say. That skeg is your life. Conrad

[Robby321]

Back to cut mids. Ya have to remember, EVERY ounce, of prop "push", is transfered, thru the mid, up to the motor, pushing all boat weight, off the transom. Don't go cheapthere, as yer life is on the line here. On broke skegs? I'd for SURE, find a new case, transfer the guts. Like Conrad said, on skegs, also need to mention "torque tabs" I run a 2 blade on my Flatty, but tried a 3 B chopper, off my merc guru. Had to take off the "tab", to swing it. Damn great punch, out the hole, but need a death grip, on the wheel, to go straight. Lay off gas, and dragged the boat sideways fast. Simple scary. Have to say,. that small "tab fin works, and without a skeg? Lets not go there..Boat, "exit stage left, driver?, exit stage right!

[Image 21]

i`ve got a good 4 hole cle,no welds or silly stuff like that,has a torgue tab also.its not my first rodeo i just value the opinion of othersand the thoughts they have. i had a cut 15" mid i sold last year(like a dummy) and that lower is holding together very well from what i hear.i have two more mids that are done by the same guy, they just need some clean up and finish welding.the people i use for welding are are certified pipe welders and are not the type to let something out the door the don`t trust,liability thing as they say never know what could happen, even though sh#t happens with anything.i can dish out a few hundred bucks to get stuff gone over and welded right but to dish out 3000 for a 15" mid ,pockets aren`t that deep.

[Robby321]

i`ve got a good 4 hole cle,no welds or silly stuff like that,has a torgue tab also.its not my first rodeo i just value the opinion of othersand the thoughts they have. i had a cut 15" mid i sold last year(like a dummy) and that lower is holding together very well from what i hear.i have two more mids that are done by the same guy, they just need some clean up and finish welding.the people i use for welding are are certified pipe welders and are not the type to let something out the door the don`t trust,liability thing as they say never know what could happen, even though sh#t happens with anything.i can dish out a few hundred bucks to get stuff gone over and welded right but to dish out 3000 for a 15" mid ,pockets aren`t that deep.

I think ya fine here, as I know here, as before back Illinois, welders, great "wrenches", friends, but the best always came out on top. And, anything they ever did, as me too, out my private shop, well, me, and them, always said.."if it was mine, I would trust it". If not. tell ya so. All I think ya shold do, is after a run, just check for any cracks. Best to do, is get some "Magnaflux, (spray cans sold), ..get the "Penetrate", "SKL-HF/S...(and soak it to check clean, Acetone first), do that, and then "Spotcheck", "SKD-NF", spray over it. Its a red dye, that will find ANY "hairline starting to crack". Hope this will help someone here too..as I been around the block, years, Journeyman Maintainence Machinist, give me a block of iron, get away from me, call ya when the gear is ready..".......anyway, go use whatever, as we did way more stupid, and dumb kids.."think this will work?"..Dunno.."TRY IT!" !

[Image 21]

lol yeah done some "yeah i think this will work" before. i actually have a entire set for checking for cracks,use it at work for checking drive shafts and misc parts on boats.i cut the mid down today and milled it almost ready to send it to the welder,just have to put it in the jig check it a couple dozen times and send it out

[Robby321]

lol yeah done some "yeah i think this will work" before. i actually have a entire set for checking for cracks,use it at work for checking drive shafts and misc parts on boats.i cut the mid down today and milled it almost ready to send it to the welder,just have to put it in the jig check it a couple dozen times and send it out

OK, cool! BUT, any too be welded, when you "do a flat surface", before weld..check it flat a good piece flat glass, mirrors are better, as ya want a damn good, "mating surface". And "duh", do both sides . And remember, if a good Alum welder, he will.."wet towel, whatever, a heat soak out." Alum can be a real witch, warping. But on a mid, see no prob, just check again after welding, check the mating surface a second time, both. If me? I would stuff them in my mill, "Fly Cut"em", and as ya only have bolts, holding it up/in. Any, not flat metal, mating surface, will be a stress crack, later.. get my drift? Wait, I'm sure ya do! And yep, on the.."this should work?"..HA! I must have good Angels, that want me to hang around longer, and if chit worked as thought, just as we did then, know it all, so why do I still own a lathe, and a mill? HA! go to plan "B"! Wish the best, as I STILL, love to.."this should work!".

"Without Deviation, from the norm, there would be no "Innovation", the new norm"............ never let anyone tell, ya.."ya can't do that"...(try that line on Henry Ford, "you will never replace the horse and buggy" ? :eek::p:D:thumbsup:

[Image 21]

thanks for the positive input and advise, now i did notice something odd on my lower saturday when i blasted the paint off. the skeg is the origanal one its just like my last one, i noticed that it has pin holes here and thier on it were it meets the housing.no weld marks, or somebody is super talented,my last one wasn`t painted and i didn`t notice it,was told it may be from the casting. i gave it a few healthy smacks with a rubber mallet on each side didn`t budge, i have seen them pop right off doing that.going to die test it just to ease the mind, housings aren`t cheap or easy to find empty, this was thrown out to the pile because someone couldn`t get a bearing race out, just have to know the right people and the pop right out, so it was a freebie if i could get it out.

[Robby321]

OK, had to get a grip, on what said. Pin holes, if not a solid pattern, as not a fix. I mess with old IL6' Mercs. When I did my Flatty, the Merc guru, had a good rebuild SS case, and sent out for paint. Few runs, it was flaking off big time..(I run in salt too) In your case, (now pun intended, the "case"..) think no sweat,. but PIX help here too! Anyway, did a half azz strip, and repaint. Lots of corrosion pits, no big deal. Pix.......251157251158

[Image 21]

i`ll get some up tomorrow, no pattern to them just random here there everywhere,one side mainly few dozen kinda like what you have going on in the pic

[Image 21]

SO NOT COOL.was doing some more cleaning on the lower and its been WELDED ON.skeg was welded on so not cool so back to square one on a lower.:nonod:

[Robby321]

SO NOT COOL.was doing some more cleaning on the lower and its been WELDED ON.skeg was welded on so not cool so back to square one on a lower.:nonod:

BEEP BEEP!..back up here. Just what the hell are we talking about here, boat, length, motor HP?

[Image 21]

lol my 4 hole cle that i have had given to me,had a race stuck in it,so he gave it to me if i could get it out.so my buddy at the machine shop popped it right.so today i was cleaning the rest of the pant off it and found that it was repaired.one heck of a job cause i couldn`t tell till i cleaned the paint off,so in the scrap pile it goes.now i`m looking for another lower,plus someone got into my paypal so i`ve had to put a freeze on that till its all straight.