Triumph and tragedy.

[Hydrophobic guy]

Sincere condolences to the familys of the 22 Navy Seals and air crew that were lost yesterday. It may not be front and center but, far away there still is a war going on.

[rock]

Very sad to hear. Prayers for them and their famillies.
Rock

[Robby321]

Some day that stupid war will end...

[Rodney Nance]

I wish we were out of that ****hole but the powers that be keep us there. Yesterday we lost some of the best Americans among us. God's speed guys and thanks.

[Instigator]

Was just going to post this. Was praying to hear a different result. Now will the ****ing talking heads let us take off the gloves and do what needs done?? Can't even wrap my head about this.


Update: Most of 31 U.S. Dead in Copter Crash From Navy’s SEAL Team Six — Taliban Claims Credit

* Posted on August 6, 2011 at 11:20am by Scott Baker Scott Baker
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WASHINGTON (AP) — The Associated Press has learned that more than 20 Navy SEALs from the unit that killed Osama bin Laden were among those lost in a helicopter crash in Afghanistan.

The operators from SEAL Team Six were flown by a crew of the 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment. That’s according to one current and one former U.S. official. Both spoke on condition of anonymity because families are still being notified of the loss of their loved ones.

One source says the team was thought to include 22 SEALs, three Air Force air controllers, seven Afghan Army troops, a dog and his handler, and a civilian interpreter, plus the helicopter crew.

The sources thought this was the largest single loss of life ever for SEAL Team Six, known as the Naval Special Warfare Development Group.

ABC News:

A helicopter crash in Afghanistan killed 31 Americans, including as many as 25 Navy SEALs in one of the worst single-day U.S. losses of life since the war began, a senior military official told ABC News early this morning.

A total of 38 people were on board the Chinook helicopter when it crashed overnight in the eastern Afghan province of Wardak.

Initial reports indicate up to 25 Navy SEALs were on the aircraft at the time.

It was also carrying seven Afghan Special Forces troops, one interpreter, five member helicopter crew and one dog.

Troops were apparently involved in a raid at the time.


BBC News:

The helicopter was taking the personnel back to their base after an operation.

Neither the US nor Nato have confirmed the cause, but witnesses, officials and the Taliban say it was shot down.

[specboatops]

I've been on the phone much of yesterday ( as I awoke to a call around 3am) ........ I have no words:(:mad::( very sad indeed. God bless the soul's of these brave warriors and ease the suffering for their familes. The only easy day was yesterday............................


Chris

[Forkin' Crazy]

RIP true heroes. :( God Bless their families in their time of need.

[BUSHWACKER]

150 views, 7 posts very sad :nonod:

[XstreamVking]

What can we say about this? Makes most of us so pissed off, words can't describe our rage. Our govt. has got to change in so many ways.... Sad indeed that these warriors were killed. But, they would not want our sadness, they would prefer for us to get revenge for their deaths. But with our present admin. the U.S. will do nothing, and their deaths will be another reminder of how poorly we are running this war....

[H20WKD]

150 views, 7 posts very sad :nonod:

http://i51.tinypic.com/vynu61.jpg

Dad WWII Major US Army.

Found this in the breast pocket of his dress uniform preparing for his Funeral in 1972....

God Bless all who have and now serve.

[specboatops]

150 views, 7 posts very sad :nonod:

Sad we can post 300 and some pages on hot chicks but we have 9 posts about a few brave warriors that gave all.....says alot about our community and what is important to most folks today..........


Chris

[Robby321]

Body's coming home today, heard on the earlier cable news. Heard nothing since....

[rock]

http://i51.tinypic.com/vynu61.jpg

Dad WWII Major US Army.

Found this in the breast pocket of his dress uniform preparing for his Funeral in 1972....

God Bless all who have and now serve.

That is one of the saddest (and probably truest for many) things I have ever read. I spend a whole lot more time thanking God than I do asking him to bail me out and to not have respect at all times for the service men and women in this country is just plain wrong. These people and Jesus both died for you. What more do you want. At least Marlborough and you dad had a clear perspective. Thanks for posting that. Something to always keep in mind.
Rock

[Hydrophobic guy]

I for one will always spend the time to honor those lost in the brotherhood in what ever way I can. For those that can't appreciate it or, don't want to spend a few momments of their precious time piss on them. I know I'm going to have good company when I get to the other side.

[rev.ronnie]

It is a tragic loss. My prayers go to the fallen and their families.

I wish, in all due respect for the fallen soldiers, that the military and media would have kept a lid on the whole thing, or at least not let the terrorists know that it was the same special ops team that took out Osama. This was probably a huge morale booster for them, and a reason to keep up the fight. They are probably still celebrating. If they thought it was a "normal" recon helicopter, and 4 soldiers, it would not be seen as a hugely celebrated victory.

Sometimes, the media, and the American people just don't need to know things in best interests of the big picture. I'm not some proponent of "big brother" keeping us in the dark, but you know, as big a loss it is for our country, it is equally a huge victory for them...one that they did not need to know about. We want to pay our respects for the lost soldiers, but sometimes is comes at too high a cost at the time.

A bully can see when he gives you a bloody nose...he does not need to know that he broke it...

Just my thoughts on this sad loss.

[Robby321]

I for one will always spend the time to honor those lost in the brotherhood in what ever way I can. For those that can't appreciate it or, don't want to spend a few momments of their precious time piss on them. I know I'm going to have good company when I get to the other side.

Dude, its simply "Apathy", the US is SOOOOOOOOOOO F&$Ked up, with STUPID, it hurts. All they want..(how much percentage USA, "are unemployed, how many pay zero taxes, how many on welfare, how many on food stamps,.........HOW MANY VOTE?")
Pathetic. This from the heart dudes, (wheres the Dudett's?). I was in Nam, 1969, at 19. On a gun truck, convoys, I was the Mech, for all trucks, rode rear truck, "clean up",. I was if not a wrench out, spare Gunner, on a 60 Cal.MG. Guys like "Bushwacker", were in the "birds", in the air, support fine at us "suppression"
I saw up close, Vietnamese, in villages, C-Rat cardboard boxes for a "house", handouts for any C-Rat cans of food tossed out to them. But ya know what? That was 42 years ago to me, and KNOW? How many VN refugees's, are robbing ya, doing drive-bys, rest big city ills? NONE.They, ( I know a few here, "still a HUMBLE.."Thank You guys, lost my parents there, but you people here gave me a home".
So heres the rub. The USELESS, have VOTED IN, the WORST PREZ in history, for freaking free "lifestyle"? Hang on to yer welfare check, as some us, REAL", are getting tired of ya. GET a "education" THEN?...get off yer lazy ass, and get a job.
Whoops, I forgot to mention, those lost in the chopper crash? I live close to McCord AFB, WA, into landing over me. See all the jets at night too, ocean coast 60 miles west, dunno altitude, going to points west, Hawaii, points father, after a refuel?. BUT I see the "afters burners light up", just as the hit the coast line!" And many times the "Chinook chopper", the "bird that went down SEALS".. they come in now, and when a usual..look up, and thumps up..(they come in low me, hearing one now, out in the shop, sounds like a CG?), its a head down, and a silent, but heard, to them, a "Brother in Arms", Prayer...RIP, (just kids too,..)

[H20WKD]

One word......Draft. These wars would have been over long ago if more than 1% of the population had a stake in them.

BTW....M60 7.62x51

[JR IN JAX]

Who in their right mind would want to go back to the Vietnam days of conscripts being forced to do maintenance on the aircraft that good men would have to fly into battle. A large percentage of aircraft lost were due to poor maintenance. Don't you remember the broken down equipment in the Iranian desert when Jimmy Cater sent them to rescue the hostages? We never need another conscript army...

[H20WKD]

Who in their right mind would want to go back to the Vietnam days of conscripts being forced to do maintenance on the aircraft that good men would have to fly into battle. A large percentage of aircraft lost were due to poor maintenance. Don't you remember the broken down equipment in the Iranian desert when Jimmy Cater sent them to rescue the hostages? We never need another conscript army...

Then you get that 99% to enlist...this Country just doesn't a sh$%, that's the problem. The only sacrifice given is by the families of the fallen. Every war thru Viet Nam has been supported by the draft.
No draft... 12yr wars, multiple deployments, general population not invested in the outcome, when it's only the money these wars cost that politicians have to worry about, what's the incentive to bring them to end?.....We need a "conscript" Country!!!

[Hydrophobic guy]

I completely disagree I was in two services and attached to a combat unit and did alot of hairy $hit and my GF is career AF currently serving as a recruiter. I frequently witness the levels of the new recruits of the various services and they are far and a way a higher caliber than even when I was in. You start opening it up to anyone with a draft and we'll have a complete mess. Not to mention none of the services are hurtin for recruits. These people know exactly what's going on when they sign up.

[H20WKD]

HG,

It's not the quality of the troops I question, it's the "quality" of the Country's commitment. Put that yellow ribbon on your bumper and forget about it.
12 yrs is enough, if we aren't going to win it and get out, then just get the hell out!

"not hurtin for recruits".... then why is my brother-in-law getting ready for his 5th deployment?
Why has his family had to endure the postponement of his retirement due to the stop-loss-order enforcing his MSO?
Don't you think if we had the manpower we would use it?

I can't recall anyone of my era being called back to fulfill their 8yr MSO....or being held in country past their tour.
Those who re-upped in country volunteered to do so.

[specboatops]

These people know exactly what's going on when they sign up.

Yep....especially for guys that go into Special Warfare......yea I know a few people who signed up to go regular inlisted for the Benifits ( College Fund ) but everyone I personally served with knew the danger's and welcomed them. As someone stated earlier, don't feel bad for the fallen, feel bad for the family's........we all knew good and well what could happen......... part of the job. Again I just hated seeing it happen to this particular group..... but I guess I would have the same sick feeling in my stomach regardless of who they are/ were or what SOC they came from.
Josh, hope ALL is going well for ya brotha !!

I saw something brief today too....looks like the bastards that did this got a little payback from American Forces today...... Good on ya Boy's !!

Chris

[Hydrophobic guy]

As someone stated earlier, don't feel bad for the fallen, feel bad for the family's....... Josh, hope ALL is going well for ya brotha. Chris

Yep, only thing I was concerned with if I didn't make it was back home.
Thing's are goin pretty dam good Chris I owe ya a call.

Now H2OWKD, your brother in laws deployments have nothing to do with recruit levels they have everything to do with his mod and his rank also his experience in country. In the service as they say pick your rate pick your fate. And as I previously said troop levels are at what DOD has been told to keep them at. A draft is not going to change that except cause complete havoc. Do I think things could be done differently? Sure but unfortunately politicians are now the ones that have full control of our ability or, should I say lack of to be victorious in war.

[specboatops]

Do I think things could be done differently? Sure but unfortunately politicians are now the ones that have full control of our ability or, should I say lack of to be victorious in war.
great statement...... the stories I and others could tell about the political bull**** when you have raghead in the crosshairs and you are simply waiting for the "GO" order to be given......gets damn frustrating.......even worse if you DON'T wait ...the fall out from that.......a carrier ender !

Chris

[mirage243]

I pray for their children and families.

[H20WKD]

.........Do I think things could be done differently? Sure but unfortunately politicians are now the ones that have full control of our ability or, should I say lack of to be victorious in war.

Exactly my point.... the pol's restrain the DOD thru ROE, troop levels and $. It's DC that keeps them from doing what needs to be done, if they had the will it could be over in a week. If it's a WAR... prosecute it like one. If it's not... cover 'yer ass and bring the troops home.
I'm sick and tired of it. SE Asia War Games 1964-1968 2nd Place.

[Robby321]

Exactly my point.... the pol's restrain the DOD thru ROE, troop levels and $. It's DC that keeps them from doing what needs to be done, if they had the will it could be over in a week. If it's a WAR... prosecute it like one. If it's not... cover 'yer ass and bring the troops home.
I'm sick and tired of it. SE Asia War Games !964-1968 2nd Place.

Yep, agree 100% Yep on second place too us..(Welcome Home dude, as those were the real rough years). Made a Nam shadow box, hangs next to the door going out of my shop. Can't remember where I found the T-Shirt, but whats left of it is in the middle of the box. Kinda ironic to me, as thinking about it now, "The gov sent me to Nam, and all I got was this lousy T-Shirt"
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[Robby321]

This crap been on my mind all day. I was gonna get something done in the shop, out here now..(DAMN... PERFECT day WA state, friend just left here, down to his boat, mine sitting there in the slip..go out later)..but I can't think straight. Me and Bob..(H20WKD, and Larry, Bushwacker), been either PM, or emailing thoughts. Ya know, as to this latest BS war crap, don't think for a second, many don't.."ever forget". But what pisses me off, is why aint the war still front and center, first on any news broadcast daily? Damn, when I was in Nam, the freaking reporters, were showing DAILY live footage, and my mom and dad saw it every night the tube, knowing I was there. Those are the people that have son's and daughters, etc in war. My mom, bless here heart, and dad, both departed, had a "fake and flocked..(remember them?) Christmas tree up, and she KEPT it up, AND lite, until I came home. She had every letter to home, under that tree.
Get the book, .."Dear America, Letters home from Vietnam". Should be at Amazon. TRUE letters, and "war", explained, is in those 300 pages. Want the graphic story? Pick up also, and I can't get by page 101, out of 350+.." ..and a hard rain fell, a true story of the war in Vietnam", by John Ketwig.

Anyway, I got out of Nam a week earlier than the last letter home. May, 69. No freaking instant email then. Got out the "hell hole", landing Seattle..(plane almost flipped on its side, landing..everybody..one side.."LOOK!.. A F%^KING STOPLIGHT AND TRAFFIC!". Then the "john" was packed! WHY? A flushing toilet!, no more ****ting in a bucket!

Got back to Illinois, O'hare, and decided to cab it home. Do a surprise.."I'm Home!". Cab driver said to me, .."Welcome home, the cab fare is on me.." Dad turned white when I walked in, Mom almost fainted, and she showed my the "tree", with every letter home, under it.

Those "30", will not get that "I'm home", but be a knock at the door, from the Military.. "we have bad news". A parents worst nightmare.

Then years later , back in the "world". But good old Chicago, did a "Welcome home parade", downtown lakefront in 1986, 17 years later. June 13th, also my Birthday! Had the news on, recording it too VHS..(still have it). Big ass party nite before, on the couch then. GF calls me.."jump on the Harley, we gotta go down there! I had no interest, but said OK. What the "news people" thought a 1 hour parade, turned into 6 hours solid. The "moving wall" was there too, Grant Park. I walked over alone, as really did not want to see it. Damn, INTENSE emotion years later..on my knees, tears flowing. I don't think I could handle the real "Wall".

BUT, that was a start, to awareness, that war DOES have causalities, and the names are right there.

Got a friend out here west coast, PGR rider..San Diego, brother is a disabled Nam Vet.. Check the link..

http://www.patriotguard.org/

So many "remember", "never forget"...either. And every swinging dumb a$$..(ya right Bob), with that stupid faded "magnetic Yellow ribbon", back the cage? Screw you. Just what have YOU done, but elect the most useless gov known to the once proud, USA? ESAD.

And Bob. You were in the roughest years Nam too. Very little back up, a LOT more those little commie bastards than thought, and why the troop build up, when I showed up.. and ..well, ya know the rest. Larry, I'll see if I can get a replica M-60 for ya, and.."thanks, for ya in the birds, air support". Heres a pic my old Guntruck, got slammed with thought a RPG, but found out a B-40 rocket. Thank God for that old lumbering beast, "and a ****house fulla "armor". Last pic is my old childhood friend Steve, born on New Years Eve, killed Christmas day, from the wrong Artillery coordinates sent to the tanks. 12 were killed. One tough "grunt", and one hell of a nice kid. War sucks, UNLESS ..ya.."go in to win"...nuff me. welcome home, any and all Vets...(and still, only Vets, will understand other Vets..the rest, will never "get it". Be well, all. Robby..(damn, 42 years alter, a lot of hidden thoughts still in my brain, war"..thanks for the shoulder....:thumbsup:

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[Hydrophobic guy]

Thanks Robby for bringing this thread back to where it belonged.
Fact is we still have brave, honorable, men who love this country and risk their lives and fight and die for what they think is right thousands of mile away. This thread was started in respect for those who we recently lost hopefully it makes a few people place this war front and center again.

BTW, Thanks boys.
You all know who you are. ;)

[H20WKD]

Robby,

Hell of a job smoothing the water guy!!

Semper-fi

[Robby321]

I guess I should bring this up too, people who care. I grew up as a kid, with this girl. When we were not only knee high, to a grasshopper, but when the grasshopper told the ants to beat us up. Both born 1950. Oldest of 3 sisters. Dad was a giant of a man, 6-10 at least, mom the sweetest known, and Meredith always wanted to be a nurse. She did all the schooling, and wanted to go in the service, and Vietnam..(oh yeah, GOD BLESS THE SERVICE WOMAN, NURSES :thumbsup:)

Dad said no way. She ended up being our old HS nurse. She married a 1965 Nam Vet, great times together, lots of Harley riding, but "Agent Orange", got to him. Started losing his eyesite, other issues, a few years back, had to sell the bike. He was a solid, honest, Union worker, and Meredith was always right there, fighting for equal rights.

Then she started a organization .."Operation Stars and Stripes", NO PROFIT, ALL VOLUNTEERS!..:"donate stuff to the troops" in the start of the mid east war, in the what, 90's?

Well, she did damn good, and asked nothing in return. She has been, my old homestead digs, she still there, on the local news, many awards for her dedication, don't know how many, 4th July parades, she was voting in the "Queen of the parade". But stuff went south her, about 2006. I saw her a a road trip back to Chicago burbs, for a old High school, "any year attended, LETS DO A LAST BLAST PICNIC!"

So some 40 years later, see all the old HS crowd again, (most1968 grads, lotta Nam Vets)..did a 26 day "Gypsy roadtrip back, me and the doggy in the van, from the west coast, for a all day picnic.

Then crap started to go "south her". I won't go into all the stuff she has told me..but she now has been diagnosed with ALS..(Lou Gerigs disease). And the progression is, well, not good. John, hubby, who needs his own help, war related, is doing his best too help her, and many friends. Last heard, she cannot hardly walk, going down, and to the hospital Wednesday for a feeding tube. ALS is a TERRIBLE death, no cure, brain stops telling the muscles to work, and (read up on it), guess the lungs stop to function, and can't breathe.

This woman, who has done SO much for others, does not deserve this. Wish I could do something for her. I'm 2000 miles away, but shes among many friends.

Anyway, heres a link, what she started....a better woman than her, are VERY hard to meet. Shes a sweety, always loved her, always will. Be well Meredith..(aka "Dithy", or "Beans"...(they are looking for a new chair woman, to take over what she started too, might have happened, no word yet to me).

http://www.operationstars.com/

[Robby321]

I just went to the site, and seems no one has took over yet. Links are old, no new anything..sad...anyway, heres is..(was), the mission statement..

Who are we? And what are we about?

Operation Stars & Stripes was founded in 2003 by Meredith and John Kelly after talks with General Motors /SPO in Bolingbrook, U.A.W. Local #2114 Veteran’s Committee and the Region 4 U.A.W. Veterans. We are a non-profit 501-C3 organization that sends care packages and much needed items overseas to our men and women in all branches of the military. All donations support our men and women overseas.
Mission Statement:

Operation Stars & Stripes is a non for profit group of volunteers who provide support, morale, and “care packages” for our military personnel deployed to Afghanistan, Iraq, Kuwait, Horn of Africa, Kosovo and S. Korea. Our mission and goal is to provide them with some comforts of home, equipment, and uniform needs when needed. We also send support to our Combat Support Hospitals here and at home.

Our Troops need to know they we stand “united with them."
We are all volunteers and no one is paid for services rendered. All money that is received goes toward mailing the care packages to the Troops or to buy items or necessities that are needed by our Troops.

"Operation Stars & Stripes" dedicates this website to all our American Heroes present, past, & future who maintain our Liberty & Freedom. Thank You for all your sacrifices