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View Full Version : laying up a boat in a mold



boatnut62
05-24-2009, 09:50 PM
I have been in the marine industry for years. A dream of building a boat from scratch has always been a dream of mine and a friends. we have found a tunnel mold for sale with all rights. i would like to know more about the process of laying up a hull in a mold. Like how to make and use a vacume system and any other good practices used in the process. Thnx for any input.

Mark Poole ModVP
05-24-2009, 11:43 PM
Simple process actually but labor intensive. Must have right equipment to shoot gelcoat for starters. Next is lamination schedule. And that needs to be correct for what the boat is used for. Racing? Pleasure? Is this a tunnel hull or Mod-VP bottom. Racing application will require high quality resin and a core material. Pleasure can use standard layup but still with good quality multi directional laminates. Have any pics?

boatnut62
05-25-2009, 12:02 AM
No pics yet. the owner of the mold is going to be sending some and we believe that it is a tunnel not a mod. the primary use would be pleasure but our idea of pleasure is running pretty hard. i have reconstructed many damaged hulls but the theory is reparing from the inside out and i know laying up a new hull is the outside in. Just not sure how to get good lamination of the layers of glass to be good and tight. I think most companies use a vacume system to get a good compression of the layers. but there must be many old school methods before this technology came to pass. any thoughts on who to get materials from for a higher quality job? what resin compound to use for layup. We have a good gelcoat gun and have found a chopped strand gun. but i think that some layers of mat and woven should be in there too. any thoughts?

Mark Poole ModVP
05-25-2009, 07:20 PM
many good suppliers for materials. Here in th Southeast boat builders use FRP, GLS, Composite One, Mini Craft. I here good things about the quality of Ferro gelcoats. Bagging makes for tight layers but complicates the lay up process. Chop gun sould only be used to "feather" overlap edges of woven material. (Keeps from having rough overlap lines with each layer) This can also be done by hand using strips of mat.

Chop gun should not be used for any structural layers. 1708/45 bi axial is a good choice for weight and strength.

olmo40
05-25-2009, 07:52 PM
When it is all said and done .You would be better off buying what you want .

Mark Poole ModVP
05-26-2009, 02:45 PM
"You would be better off buying what you want"

Well, he sounds like he always wanted to build a boat. I know how and have done it. With the space and the time to do it I would rather have one that I built myself, then I know what is under the gelcoat and...under the floor. Lot of personal satisfaction that comes from it despite the work. You learn a lot about fiberglass too!!

boatnut62
05-26-2009, 08:25 PM
This in fact is the way I feel about it. I have given new life to many old jets and V-drives and have done it my way as a hobby. I have been in the repair end of gelcoat and glass for years. I know about the work involved in a pristine looking repair or rebuild. The work is half the fun. And the reward of knowing that it was me from the first layer of gel would be very satisfying. And the thought of someone at the local lake asking me where i got this boat and being able to say i made it would be pretty cool. Mark you say you have done it. I sure would like to know more about what you did. And would deeply apriciate any do's or donts. I think i know enough to get the job done but i would rather do it right the first time then learning through the school of hard knocks. seems they would be pretty big knocks...lol I have pics coming from the current owner. shoould have them soon.

boatnut62
05-26-2009, 08:30 PM
Yes vacume bagging was what i was talking about. wondering if one can make their own system and how or if investing in one would be the way to go. Or if it is even necessary. I prefer to do as much homework as i can before comincing to building so i can do it right the firts time.

Jacob
05-26-2009, 10:50 PM
http://www.sharkeymarine.com/
An experienced builder once told me I could find things on this site that took him years to acquire.. Good luck:thumbsup:

Building boats is one of the most enjoyable things I have ever done.:D:D

RBT
05-27-2009, 08:21 AM
www.vectorply.com (http://www.vectorply.com)

Download the vectorlam software, it will help you determine your schedule. They are one of the premier laminate shops, infusion is there specialty.

tunnels
12-27-2009, 04:35 PM
I have been in the marine industry for years. A dream of building a boat from scratch has always been a dream of mine and a friends. we have found a tunnel mold for sale with all rights. i would like to know more about the process of laying up a hull in a mold. Like how to make and use a vacume system and any other good practices used in the process. Thnx for any input.


Ok i just cruised on in and found this , why havent you posted this in the composites section rather than this part ?.
ANYWAY at what stage are you at ??
If you have never sprayed Gelcoat with a GUN OR A pressure pot then you have a lot of learning to do !!you could loose a lot of materials and loose the spray system if you dont know what you are doing
If you have never used a chopper gun before you have even more learning to do !!! My advise is leave it alone !!!
Do you have a schedual for the lay up of the hull yet ?? The placement of overlaps and using those build ups of glass iis a good way of gaining strenght where its needed .

What about the internal structual frame work and the transom ! given any thoughts about what you should be using and how you intend to make it . and what sort of material are you going to make it out of ??

The deck do you have the deck mould ? got a lay up for the deck ?? Does the hull have any coresin the bottom and what about the hull sides ?? the deck need core . What kind of cores are you intending to use ? theres a million questions and 5 million answers !

What about vacuum bagging ,done any of that ??
Vac cores and compacting glass layups , Resin infussion if you dont understand and dont know what you are doing and have never done it before simply leave it alone !!
Its a good system and you can completely waste a whole boat load of materials from ignorance and miss understanding what you are doing ,all in a very short time .
If you insist find a exspert that has done it a hundred times before and get him to do the job and show you how its all done . :confused:

boatnut62
12-28-2009, 06:04 PM
Wow thanks for all the questions! Sounds like your a pro. We decided on a flatbottom mold instead. It is in much better condition and has had only around a dozen boats come out of it. We have aquired lay up scedules from a couple vendors and a software program thanks to RBT. We plan to use balsa core, and materiels from Vectorply. As for shooting gelcoat i have sprayed and regelcoated around a hundred boats in the last six years. We have a hull and deck that are a match set and in perfect condition. As for the chopper gun we do not intend to use is in the boats for now but instead we are shooting some small projects like hood scoops and fenders and stuff like that so we dont mess up a big project like a hull. The guy we got the mold from was full of good advise and told us alot. he never used vacume bagging but his product is nice. We have one of the boats that came from the mold we have. We are not yet putting one together as of yet with winter being here but intend to continue our homework and begin in the spring. Many would rather just go buy something and i have done that many times. But where is the reward in that. does one not need to challenge themselves once in a while. this is a challenge that in the end will bring great satisfaction if it is successful. I didnt buy a mold and plan to just jump in neck deep. With propper thought and planning and lots of reading and talking to those who dont feel intimidated to share in their trade. This challenge can be met. A little luck never hurts either. So do you have any input or advise that may help us to advance in our quest? maybe some advise or answers to all those scarry questions? We are not experts nor do we claim to be. We just want to do it and do it right the first time. Thanks for your reply TUNNELS. And thank you to all who have been kind enough to lend some guidence. There have been many and this says something about the boating community. GOOD PEOPLE!!!!

tunnels
12-28-2009, 06:43 PM
Wow thanks for all the questions! Sounds like your a pro. We decided on a flatbottom mold instead. It is in much better condition and has had only around a dozen boats come out of it. We have aquired lay up scedules from a couple vendors and a software program thanks to RBT. We plan to use balsa core, and materiels from Vectorply. As for shooting gelcoat i have sprayed and regelcoated around a hundred boats in the last six years. We have a hull and deck that are a match set and in perfect condition. As for the chopper gun we do not intend to use is in the boats for now but instead we are shooting some small projects like hood scoops and fenders and stuff like that so we dont mess up a big project like a hull. The guy we got the mold from was full of good advise and told us alot. he never used vacume bagging but his product is nice. We have one of the boats that came from the mold we have. We are not yet putting one together as of yet with winter being here but intend to continue our homework and begin in the spring. Many would rather just go buy something and i have done that many times. But where is the reward in that. does one not need to challenge themselves once in a while. this is a challenge that in the end will bring great satisfaction if it is successful. I didnt buy a mold and plan to just jump in neck deep. With propper thought and planning and lots of reading and talking to those who dont feel intimidated to share in their trade. This challenge can be met. A little luck never hurts either. So do you have any input or advise that may help us to advance in our quest? maybe some advise or answers to all those scarry questions? We are not experts nor do we claim to be. We just want to do it and do it right the first time. Thanks for your reply TUNNELS. And thank you to all who have been kind enough to lend some guidence. There have been many and this says something about the boating community. GOOD PEOPLE!!!!

Whats the length of the boat ? what sort of hp are you intending to use ? outboard or inboard ?.
Two people can build a boat and use the same materials and the same quantity BUT one can be really nice and strong and could be a fraction lighter than the other . Its all how you use what you have got to work with , Balsa is the only choice for the hull bottom and it should be a minimum of 3/4 thick not the 1/2 you see people using and saying thats what was there before . when a hull flex's the change of shape kills speed ! and over a period of time causes damage such as cracks in the gel coat etc and thats just the start .
I am glad about you being able to handle Gelcoat spray . The chopper gun can be used as just a saturator gun to spray just the catalysed resin without the glass !!. Its a good way of getting your mix the same always and a quick way of wetting all your dry materials . Just remember it is easyer to bring resin to the surface than try to push it down though the cloth !! so when you put down a layer of what ever wet out completely the surface and then put the material onto the wet surface so you have lots of resin coming up through the glass .Saves time , saves effort and is a lot easyer to get all the air out of the laminate. Another little trick is after you have finished rolling the air out use a mohair roller and lightly roll the surface , this will help to mop up any wet patchs and also break up the bundles of glass fibres better and makes a nice looking job ready for the next layers of glass to go on .

Can you send me the glass layup for the hull and the deck !
stuartwrcom@gmail.com id like to see whats in the specs .Any pics of the hull and deck could be a great help as well !.
Have spend a lot of time using a saturator gun and a chopper gun over the years . There is nothing wrong with a gun laid boat ! its completely up to the operator !! he is the one that is in total control of what goes where and how much gets put where .
If you intend to mix resin by hand then you must deligate one person the responsability of weighing and catalyzing and mixing the resins you use , he is the only one that does that job !!. so if you have a problem then you can point the finger !!Its a good thing to write down on a blackboard the quantities as they get mixed as well . That way you can double check what been used!! , what you have left!! and what you started off with!!! and then do you calculations looking for percentages and checking constantly looking always for consistancies in everything you do . Resin to glass ratios and gel times of resin as well .
We live in a constantly changing enviroment and Humidity and temprature play a big part in the overall performance of the resins you will be using . Hi humidity will slow the gel time and the resin will never go completely as hard as it should . also temprature will slow the resin gel time but this can be rectified at the end of the build by simply warming up the boat and the mould for a 24 hour period . Humdity is the killer and all the heat in the world wont get you to that point . Build a tent work in a low humidty enclosed area of some sort if possible . keep your glass completely dry before you start unrolling and cutting it for the boat , the lower the humidity the better! 70% or below is the target for survey work . If you can control the temprature and humidity them everytime you work on the boat your resin will always go off at the same speed and and gel at the same time and you wont have to change the catalyst ratio at any time during the building process.
Sounds like a lot of crap but in actual fact you would be building your boat to a survey standard and if you ever sell the boat you have all these records the buyer will be blown away with what you have done . It is better than what you could buy from almost any powerboat manufacture.
This is what i do ! it takes me lots a places to do just that !!
:D :cheers: :thumbsup:

BottomsUp
12-29-2009, 05:09 PM
A good resource is fiberglast.com practice on a small part if possible. If the person you are getting the mold from has a lay up schedule get it. It is a great starting point.

Billy

tunnels
12-29-2009, 06:15 PM
A good resource is fiberglast.com practice on a small part if possible. If the person you are getting the mold from has a lay up schedule get it. It is a great starting point.

Billy


They always make it look easy and it is when all goes well it just takes one tiny pin prick air leak to totally stuff a whole job . everything has to be 110% perfect because you only get one shot at it .
Biggest boat ive seen being infused was 180 ft long and all done in one shot . wow it was a major. My friend Norm Dowling was in total control and it almost put him away in a nut house ,the tension was so huge . Took a month off work and away from work when it was over .
Good luck !!:thumbsup: :D