360 AMC -**Won't turn over fast enough to start!!**

[Choppme]

Easy Money - 360 AMC with a Berkeley Jet. Put in new battery 800 MCA, new starter (tested), and new starter solenoid. Turn the key, engine turns over but not fast enough. Removed spark plugs so there's no pressure and still won't turn over faster!

Sounds like the jet is grinding or draggin down the engine stopping it from turning over fast enough to start??? First jet boat I thought I got a great deal on....I'm screwed....

Thanks for any help!!

[zstevens]

i'm an amc er but ive not heard of em being used w/ jet ,only older 327's inboard . as for starting system is it ford type w/ solenoid ? if so i use 1 or 2 gauge wire check the ground (its usually the prob)ou starter /flywheel not meshing good

[Choppme]

I just bought the boat in December, says Panther 360 on the valve covers. Yup, a ford type solenoid, cleaned the wires & ground - but it's all 4 gage wire. I might look into 2 gage wire.

The engine is hard to turn by hand, but sounds like it's draggin in the back where the pump is. Is it normal to have to turn a little harder since the pump is always engaged?

[zstevens]

i dont know bout jet s , the 2 or 1ga. noticeable difference. !

[alaskan icicle]

I would disconnect the drive line and see what it sounds like.
That should isolate the problem to either the pump or motor.
Maybe you picked up something in the pump like a rock, trash or rope and that is grinding or dragging on the motor. Take a look up into the grate and into the nozzle.

[Cobra1racer]

I would disconnect the drive line and see what it sounds like.
That should isolate the problem to either the pump or motor.
Maybe you picked up something in the pump like a rock, trash or rope and that is grinding or dragging on the motor. Take a look up into the grate and into the nozzle.


Could be a cat inside holding things back. Besides it isn't a good thing to run the pump dry, they don't last long doing that. Disconect and see what happens. 360 amc's were Chryslers, were the not? Get a 360 with swirle port heads and you'll have a runner.

[zstevens]

amc isnt same as mopar 360 dog leg port shaped heads ! dizzy up front . starter on opp. side of a mopar

[Choppme]

OK, pulled the jet out, it was actually a Panther E-model jet by Maritec. So pulled the jet out, removed the spark plugs, and turned the engine over...still hard to turn over!!

The spindle in the jet turns over nicely...no problem. Removed the bell housing and starter, turned engine by hand and it's hard to turn. No spark plugs, no starter, no bell housing, no jet....still hard to turn? It's the freakin' engine!!

I'm going to use Mystery Oil and douche this bitch down from the pistons down.

Now, if it's still hard to turn (probably will be) I'm thinking of using a high-torque starter and two batteries...in series.

If the two batt's were in parallel it keeps the same voltage & increases capacity (longer radio play time)....

In series, they kick to 24volts and will slam that starter hard and turn over the engine whether it wants to or not! Will also use two 12v solenoids.

Any ideas?????

[alaskan icicle]

Choppme said: "Any ideas?????"

Drop it like its hot:reddevil:

Seriously though it could be a bad bearing.
It won't do the motor any favors to crank the heck out of it,...just yet.
If you are not concerned about it then proceed.
Not hard to pull a boat motor. But you could look under the valve covers and also inspect the oil & filter (cut it open) for tell tale shavings or bits of metal.
No accessories on the motor that could be seized or seizing, alternator, etc. right?

The diesel or mystery oil bit would help if it was just the rings sticking/rusted to the cylinders. Worth a try.

A.I.

[zstevens]

yeah thats not a good sign, depending how long it sat ,where n how it was put away! if you could of lubed up the cyl.'s before turnin it over etc. ? (maybe you did) check oil out n filter as stated above !:iagree:

[Choppme]

Well Gents, it started right up...I kept the jet off and removed the u-joints, slapped on the bell housing and starter, two batteries in series to the stock starter..and WHAM!! It kicked on like nothing...

I put the solenoid between the 1st & 2nd batteries so the electrical is still running off of 12 volts, not 24 like the starter....worked great.

The engine purrs like a kitten at idle and runs smooth as hell...I've had two mechanics look at it and they said no tellin' what's keepin it from starting w/o breaking the engine down and checkin out the guts.

Now on to the oil change, new plugs & wires, more mystery oil, air/oil filters, and greasing up the u-joints & impeller....and changing the gear oil in the bearing end cap of the jet!

I'll be on the water on the next sunny day!....'til the engine breaks down.

[alaskan icicle]

:thumbsup:Good Job!

Does it still make a grinding noise while turning it over?
It idles fine, no need to keep the RPM up?

I see you say "new starter" in your first post but now you said you used the "stock starter"...did you switch back?
or are you differentiating between a normal starter as opposed to a high torque one?

How old is the wiring and ignition switch?

[Choppme]

It grinds, but I'm thinking the previous owner let this thing sit out in the rain for a year or two....maybe really rusty inside.

Idles great, low rpm's but when I turn the engine off it stops almost instantly! No hydraulic lock though, so should be ok.

I did mean a new stock starter, no high torque required..and when I burn this one out, it will be returned with the lifetime warranty....

The wiring is from 1976..so is the switch. But I'm going to switch the 4 gage cables for the starter/battery over to 2 gage and see if that works with 1 battery...

Thanks for all the help!!

[alaskan icicle]

Congrats, your ready to captain your first jet boat.
Sounds like it should be fine, just keep close to shore the first time out:D

If it starts puking oil out the valve cover breathers then you know the rings have been compromised or the cylinder walls are scratched up and it needs work.

Hope the weather cooperates and you can let us know how the maiden voyage goes soon.:cheers:

Get somebody to take some pics! Its historical.

[Slowmo]

Is the crank balancer rubbing on the timming cover?If it is running taht well i would think something outside the motor is rubbing,anything the crank turns..Just a thought.good luck with your squirt boat.They are a blast to drive.

[Choppme]

took it out and started it up on 1 battery! The two battery in series system worked great for getting it started at home, seemed to wear in the engine a bit and loosened up whatever was tight!!

On the river yesterday and had a blast!! Now need to change exhaust manifold gaskets...

[alaskan icicle]

Can we get a pic of just the boat:p

Congrats!

Wow it must have been some tight azz bearing clearances?
Or whatever it was it machined itself. Change oil and look for shiny stuff.

Seriously post a bigger pic of the boat, and less shirtless guys please.

[Choppme]

There's the pic's of the boat! Look at my last post - - revised!

[alaskan icicle]

That is a great looking boat!

Have fun with it.

I especially like the orange :thumbsup:

[Choppme]

Just an update...blew the motor bout 2 weeks later...that thing just locked up and seized up on the water...no hydrolock, just plain screwed. Got a new AMC 360 rebuilt off craigslist for $200 and put it in....runs great!

Now I just noticed water squirting sideways from the jet housing....another day, another problem!

[alaskan icicle]

Ice n snow here...can't get worse.
Did you find that leak yet?

[Choppme]

Got another post goin on that! It's some serious pitting inside the jet housing due to cavitation! Freakin wore holes in the main housing...called Panther, they said it's toast - but I'm gonna JB Weld this bitch with Marine Weld...betcha it'll work fine!