Mirage vs. STV

[Mike 1410]

How would you describe the differences between a Mirage Jaguar Ski Racer and a STV? To the unexperienced eye the STV seems more finished but I'm not sure I know enough yet to know what I'm looking at. Any help, thoughts would be appreciated.

[Techno]

I think that they are designed for 2 different things so the hull shape is different to do those 2 things. Different compromises.

I don't know what they are.

[Mike 1410]

Specifically I was referring to the STV River Rocket

[captcarb]

http://forums.screamandfly.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16972&highlight=mirage+stv

Jim

[Mike 1410]

I don't know what two different things that they are designed to do. Can you be more specific?

[DaveR]

I think this was just done about 2 weeks ago. Try a search and see if you can find it. It was several pages long.

[Sam Baker]

I'll try to be brief. Mirage has two boats - the Ski Racer and the River Racer. The ski racer is designed to seat 4 people in a comfy cozy cockpit. The river racer is a 3 seat boat (driver sits in center). STV has two basic boats - the Euro and the River Rocket. The Euro has more space than the Mirage Ski Racer. The River Rocket has less cockpit space than the Mirage Ski Racer but more than the Mirage River Racer.

I wouldn't say they're designed to do two different things necessarily. The River Rocket can be set up with a four person interior - albeit VERY cozy confines.

From a mold and finish standpoint, STV does a better job, no doubt. However, there's a cost difference of about $2,500.

Speedwise, I'm not even going to touch. I would say they're all very close in speed. There are some river rockets that are faster than Ski Racers and vice versa. The River Rocket is more suited for racing.

Sam

[KELLY]

I THINK YOU ARE JUST PARTIAL TO STV'S.
MIRAGE BABY!!!!!

[NPK2003]

doesn't Mirage still offer the 1/4 Master? That would be three models on either my toes or fingers. Com'on and laugh. Seriously, you drove both the Ally 2001 and the 1/4 Master. How do they compare for DRAGING! In fact, I think your old BakerMarine Yellow & White 1/4 pony is for sale. I know you will be as unbiased as you can. Why did Bob A buy a Jag RR over the 1/4Master over the Ally Drag or SS?

Inquiring minds (and even no-minds) want to know!:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :)

Nick K

[PaulR]

Nick is that a boat or a F-16 with the wings cut off? I've been thinking River Rocket lately??????????????????

See ya the 19th

Paul

[Techno]

The bottoms are different so they were built to different needs. I don't know what that is since I don't know nuthin about Miragees
From other posts they are setup differently and run differently. I don't know how the mirage turns butht eSTV was built for it.

[kathy]

I now understand the difference here between the mirage and stv. The question is the Liberator is that a mirage or stv? or is it in a class by itself. I am trying to picture Damages boat in my head I just can't figure out the what made his different. I believe the front looked like a fork. Am I correct in my thinking there?

And the hydrostreams.... they are the ones that look they have small wings off the back.... We have sleeksters in our driveway so that one I can pick out. The hydrostreams seem to be tricky on the water more so then the stv's. is that correct in thinking? I am referring to when I saw these boats race at the Rumble. Erics Allison simply seems to just go like a rocket is that due to the body style?

Thank you.

[Sam Baker]

Bob needed a boat to run around in too so the QuarterMaster and Allison drag boats were out. He was looking at the STV River Rocket, but couldn't find a good used one for the right price at that time. So, I got him the Mirage and gave it to him for my cost because I wanted to get one out there and show people that the boat CAN actually win. A Mirage Jag RR on a trailer is about $11,000. An Allison SS on a trailer is closer to $19,000 by the time it's rigged, so a lot of it was simply price. There was a lot of laughing behind Bob's back when he bought that boat.

He was driving my Allison SuperSport while we were rigging his Mirage. We even went so far to put Bob's name on the Allison to try to fool people into thinking that he bought it. Bill Gohr saw him pulling the Orange Mirage one day and asked him about it. Bob said he was just helping me and Bill said "That's good. Because that boat will NEVER win out there." I guess God is not all knowing.

As for what I prefer....If I had to pick one boat to drive at all the places I race (windy and rough at blarney, calm at ODBA, etc.) I would run the QuarterMaster. It's a blast to drive, it's impervious to cross winds (the Allison will tend to tilt sideways in crosswinds) and the thing is a monster in the rough water surprisingly. Plus, sitting up in the front like that, it's like being in the front car of a rollercoaster.

The downside to the quartermaster is it doesn't float real well. the rear of it is so thin that when it's floating at the dock, everybody tells me my boat is sinking.

However, for those of you with enquiring minds, I've sold my Allison and bought a new QuarterMaster. Had I known my old one was for sale before I ordered this one, I probably would have bought it back. That thing is rigged really trick.

The Allison is a better quartermile boat in low wind conditions, but I've lost a few races because the boat literally starts rolling over onto its side in some of the nasty crosswinds we've had at the island. I'm getting old and I don't need all that excitement.

Sam

[NPK2003]

This is the kind of information you can only get on scream&fly and the many professional racers that contribute so much to all of us.

Do you have the 1/4MASTER Yet? Love to see one close up.

Nick K;)

[Rodney Nance]

Has anyone ever got wet or know of someone that has in a 1/4 Master? The one we had should of crashed several times but never did. I am just curious if one has.

[Steve Zuckerman]

Rodney:
That is a frequent subject with me and my fellow Quarter Master
racers. I hope this doesn't jinx us, but none of us are aware of
any blowovers (and believe me, Tim Phillips has "tried"/just kidding Tim) or barrel rolls.............
I was having gearcase problems due to an improperly mounted
nose cone, and blew mine out at well over 110 several times, and
like you said, it should have/could have easily spun out or barrel
rolled, but I was able to keep it right side up.
I think (we should ask him too) that Marty Logan almost or did
sink one of his due to a bottom failure of some kind. But that is a
structural issue, not a crash. When Brad cooked up this little rocket, he was on his game! I love mine.
Regards,
Steve

[Rodney Nance]

If nobody posts different then thats pretty amazing considering how many are out there and how they are used.

[Jones Racing #157]

1/4 Masters are great boats

[Unloaded Racing]

Are the stuff. Really safe boat. If you don't think they are safe and forgiving check out the Thread Shuttle Launch. My boat launched that high and still ran a 10.1 at over 108 mph. I wouldn't go back to a Mirage River Racer after owning and driving my 1/4 Master. The deciding factor in me buying mine was talking to Brad Collins at Jasper Last Fall. He said as far as he knew there had never been one blow over. And as Steve said mine has gotten jacked out of shape a couple of times and it is easy to recover. Just my .02 cents.
Tim

[Sam Baker]

Never heard of one blowing over. I can't remember who it is, but there is a Pro Fisherman that has (or had) one. Mark Schwind, who used to work for us, fished the FLW tour the last two years as a non-boater and got hooked up with this guy. He's a big name too - dang it I can't remember. They started talking about fast boats and the fisherman tells Mark that he's got a QuarterMaster and how much he loves it, but doesn't get enough time in it.

What a hoot.

The deciding factor for me was getting back into Bracket racing this year. The Allison is tougher (I'm getting old and don't want to work so hard) to be consistent with and the whole secret to bracket racing is being consistent....not necessarily being the fastest - although we all want to run low ETs and big MPH numbers.

The other factor was simply cost. The QuarterMaster is nearly half the cost of an Allison. There is several thousand dollars difference and for a race boat that is a single purpose boat, that is significant.

Sam

[Ally 1988]

Does 1/4 master come in a river racer type meaning two seats or drag only.

[Unloaded Racing]

Single seater.
Tim

[Ally 1988]

Bummer

[Rodney Nance]

There is room behind the drivers bulkhead for another seat. At one time Marty Logan had one in his. I don't remember if he made the rear cowling a two piece or not. It would be pretty easy to do if you had to have two seats.

[Ally 1988]

Was mostly curios but I do like this boat and have heard of its strong advantages in the handlind dept. As far as drag racing goes anyway.

[BK]

Originally posted by Rodney Nance
There is room behind the drivers bulkhead for another seat. At one time Marty Logan had one in his. I don't remember if he made the rear cowling a two piece or not. It would be pretty easy to do if you had to have two seats.

RawwwwwwWDNEY!! :eek:

Yikes!!!!

This makes me think about Ditzig when he had his CAPSULED Mod-VP and he used to mail us video tapes of his test sessions.....

I was watching his latest tape one night, where he was flying past a stationery bass boat filming him at approx 100mph.....The image would be blurry as his boat screamed past.... but I did notice the rear boat cowling was off.

On another pass, I saw something behind the cockpit, up against the backboard -- on top of the gas tank.

I kept rewinding the tape and got to the point where I could freeze the frame.....and, OH LORD........ I saw it........

There was a PERSON back there! :eek: Sitting backwards against the capsule backboard!

I talked to Ditzig and asked him - sternly - if they, perhaps, carried a passenger during the test session - his wife beamed and said "Oh yeah! That was me!!!" :D

GULP!

Ditzig said that he told his wife to knock on the board if there was any problem.....And at the end of one pass he heard a loud "THUD" on the board....

....but it wasn't his wife signalling to him......it was his wife's head smacking the board when he let off the gas pedal too fast!!! :eek: Holy moly.........

:D

[Rodney Nance]

Sorry I didnt make it clear that the 1/4 Master's I have dealt with did not have a capsule. Both people facing the same direction. STV, Allison & I am sure others build them that way. Buuuut. I aint riding back seat in any of them. It still might be safer than a parade. LOL