Mercury working on 4-stroke catalytic converter with CARB funding

[Markus]

I stumbled across this link:

http://www.arb.ca.gov/research/icat/projects/mercury_marine.htm

[Capt.Insane-o]

YAY! Something else to have to work around!

[msm]

It sounds like Mercury really does want to kill 2-stroke outboards.

I wonder if BRP can get down to those emission levels with their etec?

[staylor]

....since the "Smog Nazi's" are starting to push for greatly reduced emissions for all watercraft. The stern drives mated to auto engines are facing mandated adoption of catalytic convertors and outboards will be expected to meet the same regs if they are to survive. Ithink Merc's approach is smart- take money from the Feds to see if the technology works. If they run into fire issues from the hot converters in either OBs or I/Os then the Fed may rethink the entire issue. Just remember that California is still trying to figure out ways to cut down emissions from farting cows- and they have yet to figure out where to stick the converter on a cow without offending the "Animal Rights Nazi's". Once anything goes political intelligence no longer applies, so Merc may well be doing this as a proactive response.
Doug

[Mr.Rude]

So much for the >500lb outboard, Welcome to the world of 100lbs of catalytic bullshat on top of the already hefty fourstroke. The left wing libs are winning again!

[Stinky]

It sounds like Mercury really does want to kill 2-stroke outboards.


:confused: :confused: :confused:

[Stinky]

I wonder if BRP can get down to those emission levels with their etec?

5 g/kW-hr......No

:cool:

[E-tec1]

E-TEC everything tried, everything conquered,,hmmmm theres alot more to be developed

[msm]

:confused: :confused: :confused:


"Mercury Marine believes that the target for a catalyst equipped outboard should be 5 g/kW-hr, a 70 percent reduction from currently mandated levels. Attaining this target in this project will be a key enabler for the ARB to propose catalyst-level emissions rules for outboard emissions."

Unless the article is inaccurate, it sounds to me like Mercury is pushing for lower emissions just as hard as CARB.

The article does not say that Mercury is working on its' 2-strokes to meet the lower emission levels.

I've always assumed Mercury's profit margine on the DFI 2-strokes is minimal due to having to purchase the technology from Orbital.

[MIJI]

Go back and touch your catalytic converter when you get home and try to picture that thing nestled under your cowl against the fuel system.:eek:

[Markus]

Unless the article is inaccurate, it sounds to me like Mercury is pushing for lower emissions just as hard as CARB.



They are. It creates a nice replacement cycle and it is a way to kill off the smaller competitors to get to a nice Mercury-Yamaha-Honda-Suzuki oligopoly.

[Stinky]

dont ever say it cant be done..........



It can't be done.... without catalyst. You can't defy the laws of physics man.

:cool:

[Sam Baker]

I think this is a brilliant F-U move to BRP. I think they're going to work with the government to try to get the EPA to make such stringent requirements that the only thing that will pass will be a four-stroke with Catalytic converters. It will virtually eliminate Evinrude.

Of course, it will kill the industry as a whole and the only motors we'll be able to run will be stern drives, but I think they're that pi$$ed off.

[Stinky]

"Mercury Marine believes that the target for a catalyst equipped outboard should be 5 g/kW-hr, a 70 percent reduction from currently mandated levels. Attaining this target in this project will be a key enabler for the ARB to propose catalyst-level emissions rules for outboard emissions."

Unless the article is inaccurate, it sounds to me like Mercury is pushing for lower emissions just as hard as CARB.

The article does not say that Mercury is working on its' 2-strokes to meet the lower emission levels.

I've always assumed Mercury's profit margine on the DFI 2-strokes is minimal due to having to purchase the technology from Orbital.

My guess is the article should have said 'will be' instead of 'should be' to aline with CARB 4 Star.

The article is about grant funding for cataylised four stroke research. Why would it talk about two strokes?????

Don't assume. You know the saying......

Me thinks you guys are reading to much into this.

;)

[mrcrsr]

and you work in mercury marine so you would definely be in the know?!?!!

[David]

Yamaha put a cat on the RZ350 motorcycle for a while. Maybe it could be done by BRP. Sucks if Mercury succeeded in wiping out 2 strokes, if that is their intent.

[Sam Baker]

At some point, it really isn't going to matter any more. The motors are going to be too big and too heavy and too much money with too many moving parts and too much expense to maintain....

What drives me crazy about this whole EPA thing is that SEMA is one of the biggest trade shows in the world with every possible thing you can hop up your car motor with. If we so much as breathe on a DFI motor, it's a fine. How come cars - which put out an infinite amount more carbons than boats do - can have the bejesus modified out of them, but boats have to stay exactly as produced?

[Capt.Insane-o]

Because they are'nt veiwed as a "neccesity" by those "in the know". To them boats are just a gross waste of fuel, coupled with being used on a natural resource. Be glad we have'nt been banned as it is. Yet it is perfectly feasable for airlines to use exceedingly stupid amounts of fuel, or better yet, do a search on how much fuel it takes to move a cruise ship one mile.

[BarryStrawn]

At some point, it really isn't going to matter any more. The motors are going to be too big and too heavy and too much money with too many moving parts and too much expense to maintain....

What drives me crazy about this whole EPA thing is that SEMA is one of the biggest trade shows in the world with every possible thing you can hop up your car motor with. If we so much as breathe on a DFI motor, it's a fine. How come cars - which put out an infinite amount more carbons than boats do - can have the bejesus modified out of them, but boats have to stay exactly as produced?

Mainly because SEMA has an effective lobbying group. In the marine industry, I expect the OEMs will favor the rules to keep modifications prohibited.

[Stinky]

and you work in mercury marine so you would definely be in the know?!?!!

If you asked my boss, he'd say I don't work much.:D

[Markus]

I think this is a brilliant F-U move to BRP. I think they're going to work with the government to try to get the EPA to make such stringent requirements that the only thing that will pass will be a four-stroke with Catalytic converters. It will virtually eliminate Evinrude.


Yes. That is what I alluded to above.

10 years ago, Yamaha were working on 2-stroke outboards with cat converters, but it seems like nothing came out of that. I have faint memory that they tried, but failed, on PWCs.

[E-tec1]

that brp has done no 4 srtk work that is

[Maritime_Eng]

I know of one outboard manufacture that all ready meets this spec and it is not one of the big 4 manufactures. :D

[fountain1fan]

i can't see why nobody has ever challeged the epa . somebody need to grow some balls and say we have had it . they would not like me up there .

[jtb]

Yes. That is what I alluded to above.

10 years ago, Yamaha were working on 2-stroke outboards with cat converters, but it seems like nothing came out of that. I have faint memory that they tried, but failed, on PWCs.

i was told yamaha ha not yet abandon that....
by the way, Volvo has them in there I/O packages available for sale in CA.