Young hotboaters beware!!!

[Just Streamin]

While coming home on the St. John's river Sat June 8 I was stopped by a game warden for what I believe is being a young hot boater! I left Silver glen without incident and headed home. As I approached the South moon idle zone I noticed 2 game wardens in the idle zone. I wasn't speeding and I came to an idle as usual. The game wardens waved me over for a inspection. Which is perfectly fine, they checked everything and I forgot an extra life preserver. I had one and 2 seat cushions with straps. I know I should have had 2 but I was not going to be running at any speeds necessary to have 2. I know I was at fault for this but read on. I also recieved a ticket for not having a boaters safety course license.. I have never heard of one but it is required to have if you were born after Sept 1 1980 that you must have one. I thought he was kidding, I could run the sheriff's boat around safer and more knowledgable than he could on the St. John's considering I grew up there.. The total ticket came to $126.00. I would not have a problem with this except for the fact that while he had me pulled over 2 boats ran halfway through the idle zone obviously drunk!!! And they got warnings!!! No ticket or anything!!!!!I am considering challenging this in court. I know my mistakes were wrong and I will gladly pay the fine. But writing me a ticket and letting them go!!! Get Real!!! They pulled me over cause I'm young and in a boat they wish they could have when they were 21!!! What do you guy's think? Is it something that just "happens" or should I fight against the citations??

[Techno]

You confused me on the life jackets. If your alone you only need one. If you weren't then there's not much point in fighting it.
What does having 2 jackets VS. 1 have to do with going fast?

Seems a pretty stiff fine for something that is related to a date your born after. Not even age related.

[wildhare]

That does suck......I have never heard of the boaters safety couse the dates mentioned....I would be a little POed myself..especially about the other boats running into the no wake zone...but.. prob no tmuch you can do about it....another case of law enforcemnt flexxing their muscle....a simular thing happened to me a few weeks ago.... I just dealt with it

[Raceman]

I don't understand the lifejacket issue either, but if Fla. law says you have to have an extra one and you didn't, and it says you have to have a safety course and you haven't, I doubt that you'll prevail in court. The issue with the other two boats, although typical, and real frustrating, won't have any relevance in court.

It's an aggravating situation when law enforcement seems heavy handed. On the local lake, the bassboaters are the ones that get the breaks. In over 30 years of boating on this lake, I've never seen a bassboat stopped for the "safety check", or fishing liscense check. They're not written the tickets for the 100' rule either, with the DNR seeming to always look the other way for them. In contrast, get on a pontoon and ride the length of the lake and you're liable to get stopped two or three times for a safety check. To the best of my knowledge, a pontoon has never been involved in a moving accident on the lake, and I've never heard of one going down with 8 on board and only 7 jackets, but that's where the tickets are written. Fact of the matter is, it's not about promoting safety, but rather writing tickets, and history shows that pontoons with big crowds are far more likely to be one lifejacket short or have people drinking. Drinking and boating isn't an issue with me because I don't do it, but I'd much rather face a drinking pontoon driver than a bass boater that's had a few too many.

In your case, you're probably better off to bite the bullet and just pay the fine. It's a tough thing to do.

[merc225pro]

I don't know where you have been hiding at but I have been stopped and checked plenty of times by the GA DNR in my Bassboat. I also have heard of several accidents involving some drunk on a pontoon doing something stupid and drowning or hurting someome else. Don't make this out to be poor pitiful little ol' me, the DNR checks everybody. If you want to run a boat that draws more attention than most, then you had better be ready for it and have all of you chit together.

JS I hate that you got a ticket, but the fact is you were in the wrong. No matter what anyone else on that lake was doing you did not have all the required items. Court would be a waste of time and probably just cost you more money.

[deck1312]

that certainly sucks and while you are correct merc225 i think what you are misconstruing is the fact we have been on this river before game wardens ever patrolled it. So for some rookie cop to give a citation on what I believe is a chit law of age than it tends to piss a few people off. Life jackets you better get more if ya plan on going out. Hey just streamin i have 3 in my boat should have given ya one.

[H2Onut]

Yep, they were jealous... I feel for ya man. BEEN THERE DONE THAT, except it was for being young, having long hair and being educated.

IT SUCKS.

Thats all I got to say bout that .

[Racemore]

I just call the division of law enforcement office in Jax Beach and got a recording which states the same thing that the boaters saftey pamphlet. a approved wearable flotation device for each person on the vessel and if over 16' at least 1 throwable with straps.I think your getting screwed.It didn't state any thing about the boaters saftey course but I thought it was required if you were between 16-21 but my stepson said you have to have it if your born after 80which he has.:cool:

[Raceman]

Your comment:
"I don't know where you have been hiding at but I have been stopped and checked plenty of times by the GA DNR in my Bassboat. I also have heard of several accidents involving some drunk on a pontoon doing something stupid and drowning or hurting someome else. Don't make this out to be poor pitiful little ol' me, the DNR checks everybody. If you want to run a boat that draws more attention than most, then you had better be ready for it and have all of you chit together."

Stupid me. How could I possibly think I'd know more about boating on the lake where we've had the lakehouse since 1961, than an out of state bass fisherman? I'm sure that my neighbor who laughs at the fact that he's never been stopped in his bassboat, but was safety checked 3 times last 4th of July on his pontoon, must be mistaken also.

[Jason J]

Go to the Coast Guard site and check the rules and look the inland rules of the road for your state. Copy and waterproof them and keep in your boat along with the state stuff. C.S. is Federal rules but each state can/will add they're own bullshi## to make it even worse. Texas for example, no noise law but a muffler altering law!? Try to smile next time you flip them off.
Jason J.

[Just Streamin]

Thanks everyone for your responces. Yep I totally believe I was stopped for being young and in the kind of boat I was in. However when the 'cop let me go I was nice and told him "thanks and have a good day". His responce was "Why are you thanking me I just gave you a ticket" What a D!@* this guy was. Oh well Just wanted to let other young hot boaters know my experience on the idle zoned covered, Jacka@# patroled river here in Central Fla.

[wildhare]

Thanks for the heads up . I wish i was 21..:D ... hey if nothing else jus tbe glad that you are 21 and are also enjoying the envy of such jacka*% patrols in that idle zone..... I just hope i can pass thru there soon..... all I'm lacking is an engine :(

[Techno]

I think you should go to court if its not going to be a time hassle. could be worth the trouble an be educational.

I found this

Anyone 21 years of age and under who operates a vessel powered by 10 horsepower or more must pass an approved boater safety course and have in his/her possession photographic identification and a boater safety identification card issued by the Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission. A person is exempt from this requirement if there is a person on board who is not affected by this law, is at least 18 years of age, and is attendant to and responsible for the safe operation of the vessel .

Seems that this means there is no law, Got me. It contradicts itself.

It also mentions not having the photo and proof means your gettting a ticket too.

http://floridaconservation.org/law/boatsafe/StateReq.htm

[B.Leonard]

That's news to me (license & 2nd jacket).

I'd pay it. It's just another form of revenue collection. Consider it your donation to the upkeep of the river :rolleyes: It ain't worth a day of work to go fight it.

I have enough of those cheap class 2 vests to make my own floating dock, I better stash a few in the Sterling. :rolleyes:

-BL

[Techno]

I've had to go to court because of my grass(lawn) and license plate on my boat trailer, I had a plate on it. Pissed me off! it wasn't a total waste of time, somewhat entertaining. I probably was the best enterainment of all of them!
Wow! In CRIMINAL court because he didn't cut his lawn! 20 people ran out the door! some walked up and plead guilty, others just bent over and kissed Thier *** goodbye.

The part of that law that gets me though is it says you have to be over 21 but could be exempt if 18? Now you know that politicians definatly don't speak the same language we do!

BTW the grass one was done in january when there was 2' of snow on the ground. The inspector called me to the side and said he'd checked that morning and everything looked good and keep it that way. - I hadn't cut it since I got the appearance in october. I'm not fighting the system. The system is you and me.

I get called in again and I'm wearing an orange coverall, chains & hobbles, gotta fit in.

[Racemore]

:cool:

[woodco]

Took the words out of my mouth !!!!!!!! :D

It's all Donkey Dung !!!!!! if ya ask me !!!!!!!! :cool:

[pyro]

I'm 23, I got stopped a couple of years ago in northern MI with my 17' Baja with 5 friends on board. Needless to say, it sat low in the water, limit is 6 or 900 lbs, 2 of my passengers were sitting on the gunnels as we idled across the lake, so we were a sitting duck. Short on life jackets, and I didn't know at the time that the cushoins don't count, everyone needs a wearable in addition to one type V cushion. he wrote me for 3 jackets short, I wrote a letter to them and they knocked it down to one short.

As it is, I always get the double-take, cause I look like I'm 17, driving a Hydrostream. We're bait for the cops.

-Chad

[wing nut]

man if u look 17 and drive a hydrostream im dead.. im 16 and look like 14 or younger and i got a vixen (14'7) with a big ass jonrude 70hp engine! LOL

scott

[Boaterbum]

I hear ya with the age bit, I got my Stream when I was 21, and every time I launched her, I got 'harrassed'... All I can say is STUDY the ruls book, Abide by EVERY rule, religously, and deal with the 20 minutes of them messing with ya! They get more pissed off when they find NOTHING to site ya with, it gives them a HARD ON when they find something, even the smallest things!
As for fighting it? Just cut the check, and chaulk it up as a lesson learned.. The way the DNR, Coast Guard, and Boyz in Blue are here, they figure you'll run out of money and time (with court appearences and Lawyers fees) a helluva lot faster than they will! Oops, thats right, you pay there fees as well, so your getting DOUBLE screwed when ya fight em! They will just sit back and Laugh! I Have yet to be cited for anything on the boat, and get stopped EVERY time I hit Lake Michigan, several times on occasion. I don't think it's my age as much as it is the fact that the lil' stream will out run em' if I choose. I get the same crap when I ride the 'CrotchRocket', for the saem reasons...
Point being, just be LEGAL, give them respect, and play along, sadly, you mess wiith them, they will win in the long run! They will just keep digging and get you on something!
Just my advice......
~tony~:mad:

[Greg Moss]

You see I think every one that is out enforcing the laws needs to get laid before they go to work! Around here we have the coast Guard , the Parks and wildlife, the county Sherriff and now the constables are out. See anybody with a badge is just tring to increase revenue for their deptment. Each Dept. enforces the laws the way they can gereate the most money for their boss. I have a firend that got a ticket a couple weeks ago. He had just bought a new boat. Brand new so they think this guy has money so he needs to contribute to the fund. Along with the new boat the dealer supplied the safety kit.You know the one with all the life jackets and flares and horn and throw cushion evrything you new to pass inspection. Well he got pulled over with 4 people on board. they ask for lifejacket. He said he had 6 in the kit and when he went to show them the started writing tickets He ask what they were giving him tickets for they said he didn't have the jacket accessable for use Because they were still wrapped up in the bags. Now that is chicken **** if I ever heard it.He got 4 ticket for life jackets because he had new jackets and didn't unrap them. That was definetly a cop that needed to get laid before he came to work!!!!

[Just Streamin]

I'm just gonna cut the check and be done with it!! IT just sucks that everytime I put it in the water there always stopping me oh well! I'll be out there next weekend too!!!

[pantera1]

I've fought a few tickets and won every time ..Heres how I did it .. Get all the facts ..when you go to your hearing be patient and polite , explain the entire situation and how you feel strongly enough to take time out of work to fight the ticket..If you get anyone with a little sympathy they will cut you a break ..Its worked for me , but I actualy did have to take a couple days out of work with no pay ..So it did cost me something , but its off my record ..Good Luck

[Just Streamin]

Thanks Pantera I am still considering that I am very close with someone in the sheriff's dept. and they are getting me all the info and finding out what I need to do to file a case and if this is even worth pusuing will let everyone know what happens.

[Techno]

Having lifejackets and having them not accessable is his fault. The reason we don't have boat licenses is most are responsible to learn the rules and follow them, thats one of them.

It makes a great deal of sense to have jackets but not to be able to put one on. What other BS rules are there? having a signaling device but it don't work, or a dead fire extinguisher?
I don't mean to come down on anyone but to say he got a ticket for a lousy reason is crap. Its in the rules, the jackets have to be accessable.

[Just Streamin]

HEy TEchno the life jackets are not my concern I am very well aware of what those rules are and am ok with paying that fine as I stated earlier.. my concern was the boaters course.. I have never heard of that.. IS it a drvers license for boats?? You all may think I'm whining but all I am trying to do was figure out the best thing to do and to let younger boaters know my experience in case one day it happens to them.

[Greg Moss]

If a boat is sinking I can and will tear the bag that the damn jackets came in to shreads if it means saving myself or others. That is and will remain to me a chicken **** ticket to give someone.

[Rickracer]

When you pass it, they send you a card and certificate. I've had one for about 2 years. I did it out of boredom one night. :cool:



http://www.boatus.org/onlinecourse/

[pyro]

He's right, the jackets have to be accesible. In an outboard, this means in the side compartments, not under the bow. On a pontoon boat, believe it or not, this is what the cop said: They have to be available for use. They cannot be stowed under the seats. He said it's OK to clip them onto the railings, one for each person.

The only reason we don't follow this rule is because we're on a private lake, and the Sheriff marine patrol doesn't visit very often. But when he does, we all got to behave. I always go straight to the launch site and see if the sheriff truck and trailer is there. OK, they're not here, let's race!

[Techno]

Just Streamin
I was talking about what Greg Moss said. But the safe driving thing isn't around these parts so I don't know much. I did read where some states have it. Its not a license only proof you took a safety course that you are required to take. Plus in florida you would have to have a photo ID. might as well just be a license!

Jet skis are getting this because of the high rate of deaths. A few years everone regardless of age will have to if they want to drive a jet ski. Its ramping up through the lower ages until its everyone. 2,004?

I don't think the rule about the jackets is bad but I do think the cop could have just scared him and let him off with a little education instead of a ticket. He stops him for a safety check and is more concerned about crap than the safety check.

[Just Streamin]

No prob Techno .. Yes here in Fla. it is required I am takin the online test right now it's easy!! a 10yr old could pass this!! oh well next time I get stopped I'll have everything he wants with a big ole grin!!

[machinist]

Just stream , did you register the boat? if so when they saw your
b day I think they should have had the obligation to inform you
you needed to pass a boating saftey course to comply with florida
law. Sounds like they are leaving people in the dark until ticket
time.

[Just Streamin]

I totally agree I know a guy that I went to high school with that's younger than me and he bought a brand new boat and registered it not knowing any of this!!and they didn't say anything!!

[Just Streamin]

Well just finished that online course Does anyone know if the state of Florida will honor it?? they are mailing it to me in 2 to 4 weeks

[Kirk Dunteman]

If you YOUNG kids knew how to run a boat as well as the older gen. you wouldn't need to take any tests:D My lastest pig with a badge story involved me and my 3 yr old son on our jet ski. I was doing about 9mph not even on plane trying to keep the water from splashing in my 3 yr old sons face when a FWC (fish and wild life cons) gave me a ticket for $85 FOR BEING ON PLANE IN A MANATEE ZONE. My son learned that day the differnce betweeen a good cop and a STINKY PIG!:)

[Just Streamin]

Hey Kirk

I know what you mean memorial day weekend a friend of my dad's was putting his jet ski in the water and it started to float away from the trailer. Well he jumped in and got it (was headed for another boat) and the pig wrote him a citation for not wearing a life jacket when he jumped in to get it!!

[Ally 1988]

ON MY LOCAL LAKE IN GA. OUR SAFETY CHECK ALWAYS STARTS IV'E STOPED YOU FOR A SAFETY CHECK NEVER LOOKING FOR REGISTRATION FIRE EXT. LIFE JACKETS OR THROWABLE SIGNALING DEVICE IT STARTS WITH HAVE YOU BEEN DRINKING.... PURE HARASSMENT OH AND I OWN THIS RIVER AND THAT SANDBAR. SO SHUT UP HE SAYS. I'M JEALOUSE OF YOU FLORIDA FOLKS.

[Just Streamin]

Gary that sux I can't imagine it being any worse than it is here in Florida but I guess I'm wrong

[Ally 1988]

If someone has a party at a house on the lake they will sit like vultures waiting to do there safety check no matter what the hour of day or night. That is how concerned they are about there safetychecks. I know they don't like being out there but unless your acting like fool what is the harm this lake is 4500+- everyone has been stopped probably once or twice there could be as many as five different types of watercraft working this lake not to mention the one from Alabama who uses common since in pulling people over in other words looks for idiots and not for the score.

[Racemore]

During the season which started 6/1 I shrimp the ST.Johns in Jax for Dead Shrimp Production(for food).There is 100yard from shore rule that was implemented 40 yr's ago to protect the grass beds in the lower part of the river.We use to be able to drag to Palaka,then they took it toShands bridge in Green Cove Springs,then to the Buckman Bridge the southern boundry of Jax.Then they took away that part to the Fuller Warren Bridge in downtown Jax(for no true reason I might add).This leaves us where there is no grass in over 1/2 meter of water but the 100yd rule is still in effect(they claim the Manatee as reason now).I mostly drag the river east of town and Jacksonville University has kept filling in an area creating a little penensula that is 150' into the river and 60'ft wide.It's a trap.When the shrimping is good in thre area there might be 10-15 boats working this 3 mile area and when we pass at JU it is easy to get pushed tight to the line.The row boats there think they own the river and call and complain along with the old farts that think they run the port also. The GFC will send someone out,they will come through the college early in the morning in camoflage and they will hide in the bushes and do recon on the shrimpers with their range finders.This **** is soooo stupid,not one ticket that has been contested has held up but they still do it.Your tax dollars at work.

I expect they will be there this year harassing as usual,they suck!I can deal with law enforcement but this gives the good officers a bad rep,just like the guys at South Moon and Jungle den.phucmall.:cool:

[CDave]

I can't speak for the cops in y'alls area but where I live they are all over the place.

When I got my old Glastron I got stoped everytime I went out. W&F, Sheriff and Coast Guard. It pissed me off but in time they recognized me and quit stopping me, I was always legal.

My advice is be legal, friendly and show maturity. Remember, wether you like it or not they got the badge.
Don't like the laws vote the SOB's out of office, get a petition to change them but don't argue with the water cop, they hold grudges longer than an exwife does. If they give you a ticket that isn't right, fight it in court! Use there rules to your favor.
I got a ticket, when I was in High School, for following too close, I was stoped at a redlight at the time. I got the ticket thrown out. Thank God the Mayor fired that police chief.

Now I just got an Allison XB02 so I get to go through the harrasment stage all over again, yeephee. :mad:
I can just imagine how bad it's going to be now that the idiots where I live voted Janet Reno's evil sister in as Sheriff and Wildlife&Fisheries is crying that they need more money.

[Scott]

Hey thanks for the link! I been puttin' off the course, boat aint ready yet anyway, but was wonderin' how I could get the time for Kath and I to take the course! I've been a BoatUS member for 2 yrs, never knew 'bout the online course. Thanks!

BTW this is a good thread. I see both sides of the ticket/safety issue. If we don't take care of our own safety and boats we'll just be slapped with more and more regulations/requirements. There is however a line between concern for our safety and that of others on the water and plain 'ol harrasment.

Good post ya'll

[Firestarter]

I am sure famillier with the young thing, when I was 17 I had a brand new STV Euro with a brand new 2.5 EFI, I could not pass the police without them pulling me over. I would be in a no wake zone and without breaking a single rule get pulled over, only to watch a sea ray drive by on plane without notice. I never once got a ticket, but the water cops new me by name, now 9 years latter and as many STV's I never ever get pulled over. I figure that we are highly visable, and as such need to be model boaters in order to not get charged.

You know that if you were idleing up a river and a sea ray hit you the newspapers would start out ......." an accident on the river involving a high powered speed boat (notice no mention that it was idling) was involved in a colision...........


RT

[ZZGRAFFIX]

Got to agree with Raceman on this one. Lake Thurmond, GA has the same problem. Might be a GA thing.

RACEMAN WROTE: "It's an aggravating situation when law enforcement seems heavy handed. On the local lake, the bassboaters are the ones that get the breaks. In over 30 years of boating on this lake, I've never seen a bassboat stopped for the "safety check", or fishing liscense check. They're not written the tickets for the 100' rule either, with the DNR seeming to always look the other way for them. In contrast, get on a pontoon and ride the length of the lake and you're liable to get stopped two or three times for a safety check."

[tabararacing]

One afternoon here in northern Minnesota we were testing our SST 70 boat and a Mod U. Anyways long story short, my dad was driving the Mod U, and he was running pretty good, I was in the safety boat timing laps for both boats. All of a sudden I look over and here is this little red alumacraft heading right for the Mod U boat. He almost Tboned my boat coming out of a corner, my dad stopped when he realized it was a sherriff's boat...
When dad popped the canopy he heard a guy screaming frantically at him that he was going to throw the book at him, he was going to loose his drivers license all this and that, and then dad took his helmet off and saw a 45 year old guy with greying hair.
The weekend before he saw an article in the Duluth paper where they had an article about our team and how fast the boats went. Long story short, this was his time to even up with a younger racer...
After he saw it was my dad he ended up just saying, ok this is your warning you guys need to slow down you guys are going to kill someone...
The next month at the Moose Lake gran prix, I had him along with 2 other police officers come up to me and apoligize for acting so rude without knowing us first. My point of this story is, not all the cops/DNR are bad, but until they know you, if your young you will get nailed by the longest arm of the law.
Brian Tabara

[Glenn]

Somebody was asking which states require a course or what the age requirements are and such....I found this...

http://www.nasbla.org/education_requirements.htm

Up here we'll all need to have passed a course by 2009. September this year if you want to drive your PWC. I purchased the book and read it at home. They were giving exams at the boat show. Passed it and got my card 2 months later. The card is good for life. Some feel it's just another way for them to tax you. It could be. I do feel some comfort in knowing that that guy bearing down on me in his huge Bayliner at least is required to know the bare minimum about operating a boat.

I haven't been hasseled personally but I do suspect with the requirement of an operating card to be checked more frequently.

Glenn

[Just Streamin]

Hey Scott I started this thread not knowing what to expect... Now I realize that Fla. isn't the only place where crap like this happens oh well be on the riva this weekend with boat safety card in hand

[Ally 1988]

THE BEST THING I'VE FOUND TO DO IS PUT ON YOUR JACKET THIS LEAVES NO DOUBT TO WHETHER YOU HAVE ONE OR NOT MY WIFE HATES IT BUT IF YOUR UNDER POWER IT'S NOT SO BAD IT'S A LITTLE HOT THROUGH NO WAKE ZONES BUT IF YOU GET THROWN FROM YOUR BOAT HAVING ONE NEAR YOU AIN'T GONNA HELP YOU.IT'S THE BEST THING I'VE SEEN TO DO SO FAR IN MY AREA. I'VE HAD THEM SLOW DOWN ON APPROACH AND AS SOON THEY SEE ME WEARING IT PASS ON BUY.
MORE ADVICE STAY OUT OF PONTOON BOATS ANYTHING CARRING MORE THAN SIX YOU ARE THERE MAJOR TARGET MUST BE THE SPEED THERE MOVING AT. AND NEVER HAVE YOUR BUDDIES WITH YOU THREE SEEMS TO BE THE MAGIC NUMBER IN ANY OTHER BOAT.

[Racemore]

This is the USA and it's still (I think) a free country.These guys aren't suppose to be the gestopo.They are Law enforcement officers that are civil servents.They shouldn't be Profiling.We have a few members on this board and maybe we should start e-mailing the State offices with complaints and fighting tickets that are given without real cause.The police don't stop everybody that comes down the road unless they have reason in 90% of the cases,The only way to slow them down is to file formal complaints. If ya just roll over you will just feel it from another angle.:cool:

[Ally 1988]

COULDN'T AGREE MORE I'M JUST SAYING IT CAN'T HURT. BUT YES THEY DO PROFILE. AND YES OVER 500 SIGNATURES WERE TAKEN ON THIS SMALL LAKE EXPRESSING THERE ANGER AND THERE WAS A MEETING WITH LOCAL PEOPLE WITH THE DNR THE RESULT WAS THAT A LOT OF THE DNR GUYS WHICH WERE (NEW) (YEAH RIGHT) ARE JUST A LITTLE OVER ZEALOUS WITH THERE NEW BORN POWER AND THAT THINGS WOULD CHANGE THAT'S WHAT THE SENIOR OFFICER SAID DURING THE MEETING ANYWAY I'M HOPEFUL FOR SOME CHANGE. ALL I WANT TO DO IS UNWIND WITH MY FRIENDS AT THE SANDBAR AND NOT BE AFRAID OF WHO'S LOOKING AROUND THE BEND THIS IS NOT THE LAND OF THE FREE JUST THE BRAVE RETALIATION IS PROBABLY ON THE WAY. SUPPOSEDLY THERE WILL BE A RIVER BLOCK FOR A SAFETY CHECK JULY 4TH WEEKEND ON THE RIVER TO SHOW THAT THEY ARE BACKING DOWN. I WILL RIDE THE DOCK THAT DAY.

[tabararacing]

Life jackets? I don't think you guys want to get me started on that... I always wear my helmet and lifejacket when leaving the trailer. Long story short, after testing a DNR got into it with me telling me I have to wear a regular lifejacket not my racing jacket... Long story short, I pulled out the law book and in the bottom there is a exclusion to the law for race jackets. Thats in Minnesota. (2 years ago that happened)
yes I am a person who never likes to see boaters going over 80 without life jackets... Or anyone in a race boat should have one and a helmet on... (if you plan to run on the edge)
Brian

[Raceman]

On my soapbox again:

Brian T hit dead at the root of the problem in an earlier post. The DNR was gonna lower the boom until they saw his father was somebody they knew. Law enforcement should always be evenly delivered, IOW, it shouldn't have mattered. Again, we see the same treatment of bassboaters on the local lake, who are held to a much different standard.

Tragically, a 15 year old, driving a low performance sterndrive by himself had an accident with an inner tuber a couple of years ago and a young boy on the tube was killed. The 15 year old cut across a blind point, and the mother pulling the tube (not her son that was killed) was in a blind spot also, in an extremely congested area in a real busy time of day. Neither driver pulled the throttle back according to witnesses, but rather tried evasive maneuvers and the young driver hit the tube. The DNR went into a feeding frenzy. There were public meetings (absolute circus) with talks of speed limits, drivers liscenses, attaching boat violations to regular driving record with resulting points and suspension of car driving liscense. Not one person said, "the only 2 moving fatalities in the 50 year history of this lake involved tubes, lets address that". What resulted was restrictions on PWC operation, although there was not involvement in this incident, age restrictions, 100 foot rule (although bassboaters seem exempt) and the purchase and staffing of 5 more patrol boats (including county boats) I'd be willing to bet that about 90+% of fatalities in boats would be prevented with mandatory life jackets. I'm not advocating that, but just making the point that if that's what would prevent the deaths, deal with it, or either accept the consequence, but don't make a lot of unnecessary collateral laws that don't solve the causes.

The local boat club (most members are older and there are no high performance boats) asked the state DNR to attend a meeting and talk about new regulations and proposals. These guys were ranking officers and not just local officers. There were complaints from the members about multiple stops in the same day, sometimes by the same officers. The state honcho responded that they were contemplating a safety sticker to show that the boat had recently been stopped and checked. Then he made a stinging statement that displayed their attititude: The sticker will not prevent a boat from being stopped and checked, because we're always on the lookout for BWI, but the stop will be "friendlier". I stood up and said, "why should all stops not be friendly?" (no answer, question ignored) I also asked why they consider us lining up two boats and running them a violation of the law (I'm not even sure what law it is, but they write tickets), yet when two bassboats run down the lake side by side and wide open they just wave at em. He said there's a difference between racin' and "just goin' fishin".

Last year I put a friend's wife in the back of the STV and blasted her across the lake, because she'd never ridden in a fast boat. We both had on life jackets and I only ran her up to maybe 80 under hard acceleration. We got stopped immediately for a full safety check. This was in an almost no traffic time on the lake (mid morning) and the area is probably 1/2 mile wide. The officer, although courteous, asked a lot of questions about any modifications to the engine and seemed to take notes. There was no ticket, but rather just a "take it a little easier" recommendation. Later in the same day all four of us got stopped in my Pachanga (sterndrive). Different officers, but questions about if the boat had a stock engine.

[Racemore]

That is the way it always happens.If someone gets hurt or killed they want to ban everything.I must admitt that our local police officers are pretty cool.We were racing in Pottsburg Creek for years every Thursday afternoon and we self regulated the racing pretty good but then some of the guys would get three wide and not stop at the finishline,instead race into the turn.The stupidity of some could easily kill somebody so the JSO marine unit came out.They told us to take the racing to the protected water in the river or they would start giving rides downtown.They said thatif you pose a risk to youself or others that it is reckless operation.At the same time they said they new that we were organized and we always wear vest and in most cases helmets and if we kept it in the river where there is room we can race.We do and somtimes they come and watch us.The state guys came out and are jerks in most cases but understand that there is no speed limit where we race,we have made it clear that we will fight harassment through our waterways commision.They tend to just stay away from us unless called upon.I don't know what the difference is between us and everyone else except we conduct ourselves in a professional way and yes sir,no sir&thank you sir their ass off. It holds true in most cases that the respect you give is the respect you receive.

[tabararacing]

Before we go testing now, we always place a call into the police dep. so if they have any complaints we will shut down and go home. Unfortantly there's always that one guy on the lake that doesn't realize its a public lake... Everytime I back the boat down he calls the cops. But what can you do?
Brian
PS: The guy that calls is the mayors son, the mayor loves boat racing...

[Racemore]

let him drive it one time,explain how important testing is to have a winning boat in town.get him on your side,the rest will take care of itself.:) :cool:

[tabararacing]

This year, we haven't had a problem, I think the mayor put the kabosh on his kid. Of coarse last year I was testing 4 days a week, this year only doing 2 days a week. That could be a reason why too...
Brian

[Just Streamin]

Couldn't agree with you guys more the day I got stopped I was running 30 in the river (thats the speed limit) Never even thought about driving fast at all Do you guys still believe you should wear a life jacket?? I think I'm going to just to keep them off my back!

[Racemore]

I saw you boat in the under 20',Got to like that color.do you know what that orange is called.it's real real close to mine.:cool: :cool:

[Techno]

If you can wear a jacket then I say to wear one. If it makes little difference in comfort between having it on and not then try wearing it all the time. I think you'll be surprised, of course 400* days where the wind chill only brings it down to 350* isn't going to be too impressive.


They call them accidents because no one plans them.

[Just Streamin]

Agree with you Techno Do you know a good brand to use? where I can get them from? and how much? Thanks!

[B.Leonard]

Got a $40 life, then wear a $40 jacket. :rolleyes:

In my fast boat, the jacket is always on.

In my cruiser with my feet propped up on the dash and fresh mackerel steaks cookin below, no jacket :D

When fishin alone on the fishing boat, I wear an inflatable.

-BL

[Just Streamin]

Thank you for the responce B. leonard... But I was being serious in the fact that I would like to purchase the best life jacket available

[Ally 1988]

YES WEARING A JACKET PROBABLY IS'NT COOL BUT AT THE HOT BOAT REUNION IN PALATKA THE GUY WHO ROLLED HIS BOAT I DON'T WON'T TO CALL IT A BLOW OVER BECAUSE IT LOOKED LIKE SOME OTHER THINGS WERE INVOLVED LIKE A RATHER LARGE ROLLER THAT APPEARED TO GRAB FRONT RIGHT SPONSON. I HAVE A PICTURE NOT REAL GOOD BUT THAT JACKET HE WAS WEARING WAS WORTH MORE MONEY THAN ANYTHING HE WILL EVER OWN IN HIS LIFE I WAS ONE OF THE HAPPIEST PEOPLE ON EARTH THAT DAY THAT I TOOK A PICTURE OF THE BEST LIFE JACKET ON THIS PLANET AND IT WAS THE ONE BEING WORN.

[Rickracer]

Let me know if ya need one. You may find a good used one too, there have been some around. :cool:

[B.Leonard]

I hear (might be hearsay) that was the first time out for that jacket. It was Tony's jacket and Andy borrowed it? It had never been worn till then. I guess Tony can say it's been tested now :D

-BL

PS
I was out running in that same spot just before the incident. There were rollers coming from all directions criss-crossing right in that area. Just too much traffic for 80+ running.

[Techno]

security (http://www.securityrace.com) Also lifeline but they only have telephone# on thier site.

Price is going to be from $100 to about $450, the degree of protection is up to you.
Also needed for the high speed is a helmet, full face/open is open to discussion. I prefer full face since having my teeth knocked out or having re-constructive surgery even though I had protection is not an option.
Along with the helmet- a helmet restraint is needed. It clips onto D-rings on the helmet, and is worn under the jacket. It's purpose is not for counteracting the scooping of water as some people think,"bucketing" is not scooping water, but the stress placed on your neck in a centrifigal spin of your body. The harness is to protect you neck.
Total for me was ~$740. You can get something less expensive, as the price goes up the protection goes up too. Impact panels in the jacket, better helmet.
An interesting consideration is although jet skis run in this high speed zone they aren't subject to being launched 50'+ in the air!
The cost of one new prop is not too high for the safety stuff.

The hazards as I understand them are
Clearing the boat, you may go through the deck or sides. Helmet/harness/ jacket
High altitude and/or long air time sending your body in a random shake or spin. Helmet/harness
Impact with a solid at high speeds- from high heights. Helmet/harness/ jacket
Motion over a solid at high speeds-again with random body movements. Helmet/harness/ jacket
Transformation of the solid into a liquid- you sink. Jacket
Drowning. Jacket that is still a jacket and not a rag, self righting floatation.
And having an orange color serves the purpose of finding you, rather than a matching color- like blue.

If you boat in extremely hot weather getting a lesser jacket might be better if it means that you would be more willing to wear it.

In some areas (like mine) having a fast looking boat and blaze orange racing jacket and helmet actually clears the traffic for a short period of time, they all want to see the show(what planet is this guy form?). The lake lice cleared off to the sides expecting a good wake, then discovered that I didn't produce a wake. LOL

[Just Streamin]

HEy Rickracer what us the price of lifeline?? Techno- I do most of my boating on the river at 30mph but sometimes do like to go fast what do you recommend for part time speed passes, Would just a full face helmet and lifeline be enough?? The boat tops out at 80 if you wreck at that speed there's not much you can do or is there??

[Rickracer]

That is just above dead cost. I've attempted before to go direct with them, but they are firmly opposed to seeing the price go down below what most are selling them for. They gave me the old "buy $5,000 or $10,000 worth to begin with and we'll do some business" business. If I can help ya, let me know.

[Techno]

Originally posted by Rickracer
That is just above dead cost. You sure you worded that right?

I personaly Choose 60 and higher to put all the stuff on. BK mentioned being hurt at this speed so even this may be too high.
If budget is a problem I would cheapen up on the jacket or helmet or both but still include the helmet harness. At least you would have the safety gear and all styles must be doing something, other wise the makers wouldn't offer them. But include the harness.

Security offers differing levels for the jackets, I'm sure Lifeline does too. Give either a call and they'll help you choose what you need. Then give Rickracer a call.

For the speed- A few have posted going faster than 80 and not being hurt.
I talked to a driver at work who used to race Hydros. Destroyed it at 180 and quit. He said he'd been hurt pretty bad, but you couldn't tell from talking to him. So he not only lived but healed up well. He remembers the hospital stay but not the accident.