Mad EFI Intake 3.0L Madness!!!!! Yeehaa!

[Stitch King]

The used intake and ECU's I bought from Eric Simon arrived the other day and I spent the weekend bolting everything up. Backed the boat down the launch Monday night and fired it up. It seemed to be running rich so I called Wayne Taylor at MAD EFI for help the next morning.

We went over the basics of the TPS settings and that the butterflys needed to be completely closed for the thing to idle properly. Mine would not idle unless they were cracked open. He said it was wrong and that I needed to check the 2 Idle Air Orfices. When I told him there was only one and that the other port had a barb fitting for vacuum for the MAP and Fuel Pressure Regulator he said that second port was needed for Idle Air and to get Vacuum elsewhere.

Taking Waynes advise, I pulled off the hoses and took the Barbed Hose fitting out. Next I knocked off the barb and drilled it out to the same size as the other Orfice and screwed it back in. Still needing Vacuum signal, I drilled the intake (nervously) and installed the vacuum ports taken off the stock intake then hooked up the MAP and Regulator.

I installed a brand new set of plugs and headed to the launch. After turning the key the motor fired instantly and idled at 650. Never once touched the gas or had to babysit it. I let it idle as I pushed it off the trailer and out a couple hundred feet to deeper water and hopped in. I continued to Idle in gear for a couple of minutes until the motor came up to operating temp and then stabbed the throttle to go. The boat took off with zero hesitation and pulled like a freight train. It was windy and about a 1 foot chop plus there were a bunch of boats out so I could not really open her up but I can say for certain that my 3.0L is a completely different animal now.

The low end torque and holeshot are unbelievable and the midrange is real strong. Best of all no loading up at Idle like stock. No smoke and zero hesitation on the holeshot. After an hour of running I pulled it out and checked the plugs. They show it's running perfect!

I can't wait to get this thing out in the next day or two and really run it.

With the advise and parts from Wayne Taylor and Eric Simon I was really able to wake up my 225 EFI and bring out it's real potential!

Thanks guys!!!

Ken Wolkens

[THE HOGG]

They Both Are Truly Awesome People To Deal With.. Congratulations!!! You'll Love That Motor Now.

[Instigator]

Nice when projects go the way they are supposed to and then you get help from people at that level.

Good job!

Gary

[Stitch King]

Got my new Sportmaster from Randy, bolted it on and put the boat in the lake again today. Wind was making a 1' chop again and a couple of deck boats were pulling tubes in figure 8's. The lake was a mess but I had to run it anyhow.

Same as yesterday. Fired instantly and idled at about 1000 for a couple seconds then settled to 650. Let her warm up and shot it up on plane. It was rough so I couldn't open it up but got it to 90 a couple of times. On the last run I shut it down and let the wind carry me to shore. Read the plugs when it was on the trailer. Still perfect!

Now all I need is no wind.....The waterskiers may have to wait Saturday morning.

[Stitch King]

Now that the TPS is working correctly got it out and ran it a little harder this evening. Lots of fishing boats and pontooners in the way but managed to find a couple of straight lines and got it to 94 mph at 5800 with a Hoss HPD 29. Still have 400-600 rpm left but need a bigger lake without the targets to weave around.

Still idles perfectly and takes off like a scalded cat when you stomp the gas. Wayne says it's got more in it if I had more spark advance at 3000 rpm. The box I have is only 14 degrees at that rpm. Can't imagine what it will do with more timing. Stay tuned.....

Ken Wolkens

[karman 2]

I told ya it was the t.p.s.!!! (just kidding) Looks like I need to spend some $$$, don't want anybody on the lake sayin' I got whipped by a little 225! Congrats, Keith

[Stitch King]

Don't know that I would go that far just yet...

Your motor should perform better in the midrange because my timing is still lagging at 14. The 300X's got the stones they do because they get twice the timing in that range.

When you haven't seen me for a few days and see the new MAD EFI Ign/fuel controller on the dash then worry. :D

Give me a call in the AM.

Need a second opinion on the Hoss HPD vs the Drag 4. Want to run em back to back. The Hoss seems much stronger out of the hole and according to the calculator at 80 it's slip is 4% where the Drag 4 is almost 8%.

Ken Wolkens

[Markus]

Need a second opinion on the Hoss HPD vs the Drag 4. Want to run em back to back. The Hoss seems much stronger out of the hole and according to the calculator at 80 it's slip is 4% where the Drag 4 is almost 8%.



You cannot do that kind of slip comparisons, because the pitch is not that exact on a prop. 28 inch pitch means "about 28 inches", not "28.000 inches".

[WILDMAN]

Ken, I told you when you bought that boat that you would'nt be happy with a 225! " 80mph is fast enough for me" Is'nt that what you said?

[Stitch King]

Man I hate when my words come back to bite me in the butt. Ok, Ok you were right.

Not that I was not happy, but got bored with 80 just like you said I would. At the time I knew the 225 was a buildable platform and if you were right I could do something about it. Heck even stock with a torque shift prop the boat would outrun the pesky jetboats on the lake and was an absolute blast to own and drive. Best of all Laura felt safe in it at those speeds. No way would I have ever been able to sell her on a 104 mph boat at the time.

I will say, the boat is much different at 90+ just like you said it would be.

What did the boat you rigged with a 250XS end up running?

[WILDMAN]

I have'nt rigged one with a 250xs yet. Only a 300xs. They run 104 just like the 300x.

[Stitch King]

I thought you had rigged a "sleeper". Maybe it was a 300 PM with a different set of stickers???

[WILDMAN]

I was gonna put a 225efi with a 300pm powerhead on one, but it blew up.

[Pro300x24LD]

Did I see you at St. Claire yesterday?

[Stitch King]

Like Shaggy said, "wasn't me".

We live on Walled Lake in Novi. Haven't ventured off yet this year. First trip away will be with MHBA maybe to Budfest or Oscoda.

Where do you usually run your Progression?

[Pro300x24LD]

Like Shaggy said, "wasn't me".

We live on Walled Lake in Novi. Haven't ventured off yet this year. First trip away will be with MHBA maybe to Budfest or Oscoda.

Where do you usually run your Progression?

I saw a liberator with a 225 on Lake St. Claire on Saturday.

I run on Tipsico Lake, Lake Fenton, and I have made 5+ trips to St. Claire this year.

The cops have been bad on Lake Fenton, St. Claire is kinda far away, and Tipsico get's small quick, but my folks live there so it's pretty nice.

[Stitch King]

Here's what mine looks like. Watch them 225's you just never know....

St Clair is nice. Gull Island is like a Frat party and Muskamoot Bay is good for hauling butt. Real shallow however so it's better suited for jets. A few of the MHBA guys hang out there on occasion.

[Pro300x24LD]

THe one that I saw very similar, but had teal and pink coloring. Graphics were nearly the same however.

I would venture to say a liberator with a 225 would still be faster then my boat. I'm 75 on an average day and 80-83 on a real real good light day.

[Stitch King]

The picture was right after I got it from Wildman. With the fishing motor at 3" below the pad it ran 83 @ 5800 with a 3 blade Hoss Triton 30.

[Pro300x24LD]

Well if you have improved your setup and added HP you'll smoke me :D

I've broke 80 only a handful of times.

[Stitch King]

Yesterday our lake hosted a Wakeboard Competition and about half of the lake was shut down for the event.

For the first part of the day I was helping patrol the begining of the no wake zone. 3 hours of start, idle, shut off, sit, start, idle, shut off sit....After the sherrif boat got there I turned the duties over to him and idled around some more to check things out. I would estimate that idle time on the engine for the day was at least 3 hours overall. Every time the motor was restarted it fired instantly. No smoke, no cough just a clean idle in gear at 650.

The final test came at the end of the day when 3 people wanted to go for a ride. I idled out of the 1 mile long no wake zone and when I gave it the gas the boat did just like it should. Instantly the rpms increased and the boat came up on plane. No hesitation, no lag, just horsepower, torque and pulling hard right to the top speed that conditions would let me run. Thanks again Wayne. :D

[madman]

We have tested the intakes and have them where they should idle fine. There are two air bleeds on the intake that some people block one of the idle bleed that where they in to trouble but changing the air mixture. They are a fast intake when done right and should idle as good or better than stock and gain 2-5 MPH with box changes. Sounds like your is doing fine with stock boxes.
Thanks for the kind words
Wayne Taylor
www.madefi.com

[jphii]

Hey Wayne. Did you ever get the E-Tec setup done (with injectors)?

[Stitch King]

Wayne,

My boxes have been modified. Still not all it could be. Need more fuel up top and timing curve is stock Promax 300.

Working on that.....

Ken

[madman]

We have some going overseas but we have to tune one of them first then it going down under for a F1 boat should turn 8600 RPMS. (That there limit in there racing)
Ken the new fuel system will handle anything you will need.
Good to hear from you.
Wayne:D

[Wizard]

:cool: Hey Ken, good to hear your got everything figured out. Very respectable indeed for a fishing motor! :D

I took my Bullet out to Lake St. Clair on Sunday and finally busted 90. The 300 XS accelerates just like my old 225/300. What a rush!

Anyway you may want to try my 28 Performer 4. I think you will be very impressed with this prop. Lets get together and try it then fish for awhile on Wixom.

One last thing you need to do on your engine is get more air into that cowl. Not only is the EFI cowl the heaviest ever made but it's practically air tight. I put a pair of these in my cowl and picked up 2mph. Best money I ever spent. It took a few Crown on the rocks to drill the holes though. LOL

http://www.startinglineproducts.com/catalog.cfm?pageID=detail&view=photos&catalogID=3&catID=21&productID=356


Call me.

Dan

[WILDMAN]

Hey Ken, here's what I did today on a new 21 Liberator with a 300XS with one hour on it! I ran the new 32" Performance Propellers Drag Four. 106.4 mph!

[Stitch King]

Randy, That boat is awesome! As far back as I can remember I've always wanted an all red boat. Solid white would be my interior choice. When you and I first spoke that was the color combo I inquired about.

106 wow! Just when I was in striking distance of 100 you raise the bar even higher.

[WILDMAN]

Hey, I can always order another one for you! Has Kieth got his sled running any faster? Are you gonna kick his ass with your little mota?

[Stitch King]

Dan,

Wayne keeps telling me "More fuel, More air, more timing". Thanks for the link on the ducts. Looks like they will help with the more air part. Looks like a hole saw and some liquid courage will do the trick. Where did you put them on your cover? I was considering a NACA duct like the Import Tuner guys use but these would be a lot easier.

I will take you up on the fishing offer and give you a call. I keep telling myself I need a new low cost hobby. :D

[Stitch King]

Randy,

The X's are real strong. Don't know if I can get all the way there. The only way I stand a chance is if he leaves the Mazco on. Even then it would be just keeping up.

Tryin to schedule a trip to see Wayne the first week in August. After that who knows.

Ken Wolkens

[karman 2]

My ears are burning!!! Randy, my ride is running good, thanx for the setback. I need to quit drinkin' though, that way I have more $$$ for fuel! On sunday alone, went through 100.00 in fuel. It's worth it though. And yes, a new prop is in my plans. Kenny's Hoss is bad ass!!

[WILDMAN]

The drag four seems to be the best prop.

[Stitch King]

Had a 28 Drag 4 until last Friday. They work real well (obviously) but on my setup the 4 blade Hoss HPD 29" outperformed it hands down. Everything from hole shot to mid to top end was much stronger. Took Keith for a ride for a second opinion. We did back to back runs. He agreed that the difference was remarkable.

I have a twin of the prop as a spare (small shaft) if you want to give it a try. You will be impressed.

[Wizard]

Ken I put them in the front of the cowl very low to the bottom. The screens are very thin and will stop water from entering.

My Bullet Cut may not be enough prop for you on top but man I bet it will pull your arms out on holeshot! It's worth trying every prop cause you never know. I wish your Hoss would fit a fat shaft. I'd love to try that prop.

[Stitch King]

Update....96 Mph in a chop on Friday morning. Starting to add fuel with the MAD EFI fuel knob.

This is turning into the "Little Fishing Motor That Could" :)

[Stitch King]

Pete,

Larry's doing great. I will tell him you asked about him.

You are right, the triton 3 should be faster. 3 blades vs 4 and thinner too. problem is that I run a small shaft Sporty. Unless it's flo-torq I'm out of luck.

Stop by if you are in the hood. Just south of Larry about 10 houses. Boat's on the lift can't miss it.

Ken Wolkens

[Liquid Force]

Hi Ken,

Sounds like you got that thing running good! I should have jumped at those two madefi intakes in hindsight!

James

[Stitch King]

Had some time to kill yesterday so I pulled the cowl off the motor and took her for a run. Wayne keeps telling me, "More air, more fuel, more timing", so without the cowl, I knew there would be a lot more air.

Let her warm up set the knob (Mad EFI Fuel Knob) at 525 (just right with cowl on) and was cruising at 3000rpm stomped the pedal and it had no power, bogged and almost thought it was going to die. Cranked the knob to 725 and stomped the pedal again. Now it was making some real power. Continued to play and found the sweet spot at 800-810. Whoa mama!! This little skeeter fogger pulls like my old BBF Jet did in the midrange.

Waited for the lake to settle out and ran the long part of the lake to a new top speed of 98+. RPM was 6200-6300 (couldn't read shore was comming up real fast) with a Hoss HPD 29 4 Blade.

Lessons learned:

Cowl causes the engine to starve for air. Need a better flowing cowl. Working on that.

Need a new Ignition curve. Wayne says timing stars to fall off at this rpm. Need more timing anyhow.

Next Step:

After New Ignition Curve and Cowl are done, develop a new fuel curve.

Stay tuned.....Going for 100+

[WILDMAN]

Not bad for a little 225 EFI ! It started out at 84 mph. What did you say the speed limit was on your lake?

[LakeTrash]

We use Wayne's cowl on both of the 3.4 monsters he built. One has his 6 horn intake and the other has the three horn like yours. No air problems with either and we are turning them way over 6200.

http://airmasterstab.com/Cowl.JPG

LT

[stoker2001]

My Buddys (Scott&Steve Noland) Just finished rigging there cougar 19' tunnel with 300XS with 1.62 sporty and ran 101mph on GPS with the 28 pitch Pro ET4 labbed that i sold them (hasnt been modded,came straight from merc racing).They say they hear the buzzer (hitting rev limit)real quick.With a 6200 Rpm limit the prop slip math doesnt work:confused:Not sure this is possible?

[WILDMAN]

The limiter is 6400. I ran a 30 on a 21 Liberator that was on the limiter at 103. I went to a 32 which ran 106.4 at 6050. They have more power and speed if you keep the rpm down. Peak HP on the 300xs is at 5800 rpm.

[Stitch King]

Even at 6400 101mph with a 28 does not add up. Ran the calculator and it says 100 mph is 4% slip. 101 @ 6400 would mean the prop is no longer slipping but adding efficiency.

The Hoss HPD 29 4 blade I am using is consistent on Mine and Keith's Liberators at 7-8% in the 90's. On his boat at 5900 with my 1.62 sporty on it we ran 92.

We both agree that his boat is heavier as he has 2 side saddle tanks, 2 batteries and both of us were in the boat on that run. I start to see 8% at around 97 but I'm flying real light with 1 tank in the back, only 5-7 gallons of gas, 5 life jackets and just me in the boat.

[Stitch King]

Lake Trash,

I checked out Wayne's cowl. It looks real cool, but want more of a drop-on solution. Going to cobble something up. Stay tuned....

Ken Wolkens

[Wizard]

Ken that's just awesome you have that motor dialled in. It's hard to imagine little ole fishin motor being such a beast. We need to get together soon and play with some props.

100 is just around the corner!

[Stitch King]

Dan,

Keith should have the HPD any day now... He's going to Budfest this weekend. Not sure if I can make it. Laura's truck needs brakes and the parts won't be here until next week. Might be on the home lake this weekend if a loaner truck is not available. Next weekend (8/11) should work for messing with props.

Also, these two guys are waiting for you. I step out on the dock in the morning and we just look at each other. There's a bigger one that hangs around also. Can't get a good picture of him though.

Talk Soon, Ken

[stoker2001]

Even at 6400 101mph with a 28 does not add up. Ran the calculator and it says 100 mph is 4% slip. 101 @ 6400 would mean the prop is no longer slipping but adding efficiency.

.
Talked to Ron Stiener @ Merc racing couple of days ago about this
He believes 4% is doable
You can add .5 to the pitch and the math/formula works

[WILDMAN]

Alot of times, the 4 blades actually have a lower slip ratio.

[Wizard]

This weekend may work great Ken. Give me a call when you know.

Dan

Them feesh need lippin! :D

[stoker2001]

Alot of times, the 4 blades actually have a lower slip ratio.
Stiener also mentioned he has heard of Trophys getting in the 4% range.
Myself,i have tryed at least four different Trophys and have not been impressed?
You have any luck with them?

[Stitch King]

The Hoss HPD gets 4% when it's in the 80's. Couldn't believe it at first, calculated twice just to be sure.

[Stitch King]

Wayne sent me one of his timing advance brackets. Had it bolted on and timing reset before I finished a beer.

It's a simple concept. It moves the crank angle sensor so that timing can be adjusted. In the case of my motor I only had 26 degrees of timing at 6000 rpm. I moved the whole curve up 2 degrees and have 28 at 6000.

Took it for a ride (before and after) and noticed that the boat has more power from 3-5000. More snappy than before. Didn't get to really run her tonite. Ran out of gas at 85. Fired it back up got within a 100 yards of the house then had to float it back to the lift.

Also stopped at the graphics shop today for a work related project and had them make some stickers that will give away what's under the cowl. Hint - It's the only thing that's green in the pic.

[Wizard]

Very cool Ken! You have the coolest Po mans 3hunnert around. Love the green stickies. :cool:

I sold my Triton with the hopped up EFI to a friend who still uses the heck out of it. He will be interested in the timing bracket. What did that run? Should he just call up Wayne?

I'm taking the wife and kid out to Muscamoot for the raft off on Saturday afteroon. Sounds like alot of fun with alot of cool boats. Any chance you can get out there? Would be fun to hang out. I think were going to launch in Algonac to avoid the nasty center of the lake.

Dan

[Stitch King]

Have him call Wayne. I think the Bracket was $40.00 plus ship. He will need to have the boat in the water and a trusted person at the throttle to run the motor to 6 grand while he checks timing. It's gotta be spot on otherwise KFB. (ka-fing-boom) If you guys want you can do the work on my hoist. Let me know.

Having tow vehicle brake issues. If the parts come in tomorrow I might make it out there. I heard I-94 is a mess between 696 and 59. May want to consider an alternate route.

[mercdrag]

Very cool Ken! You have the coolest Po mans 3hunnert around. Love the green stickies. :cool:

I sold my Triton with the hopped up EFI to a friend who still uses the heck out of it. He will be interested in the timing bracket. What did that run? Should he just call up Wayne?

I'm taking the wife and kid out to Muscamoot for the raft off on Saturday afteroon. Sounds like alot of fun with alot of cool boats. Any chance you can get out there? Would be fun to hang out. I think were going to launch in Algonac to avoid the nasty center of the lake.

Dan
me and my brother will be @ the raft off aswell. see you there:)

[Pete Budka]

Stitch..........
In reference to the motor picture in your thumbnail.........it seems that you have a 2" jack mounted to some transom bracket ?...........if so were did you get the jack from..........

[Stitch King]

Pete,

It's an R&R Slidemaster. If I remember correctly, it's 3".

Ken