Mahle Top pinned Pistons

[TBuck2003]

New piston on the market Good or Bad need some real life experiences.Going in potentially in a 260 hp 2.5.Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.Thank you.

Todd

[vector mike]

I run Mahles in mine and they work great. They aren't the new top pinned ones though.

[allyfreak2]

the new mahles are good for a lake boat or fishing, NOT racing. i have seen a few in drag motors that fell apart at about 10.5k. the merc pistons are better for drag racing. if you're not going to spend over 9k on a consistant basis go for it.

[rhickox]

Top pinned Merc pistons are Wiseco's, but price a set:eek: Knock ya D%$# in ya watchpocket.

[Jay Smith]

Todd,
I posted an inquiry a year or so ago about the new Mahles when they first hit from user opinion not salesmen ( good or bad ) I got PM 's reports nothing but BAD...Broke skirts and many failures in racing applications. If a FORGED piston won't hold up racing I'd have second thoughts about them period even in a lake Hot Rod !

My opinion,

[BoatStuff]

The original batch of Mahle 2.5L pistons had some pins come out. Mahle replaced those pieces for the parties involved, and we sent every single one back to the factory. The new ones have been improved and tested. Although there is no warranty on these, we will stand behind them!

Here is the press release from Mahle

MAHLE MotorSport Introduces New
Mercury Marine Performance Pistons

Fletcher, N.C. (March 22, 2006) – MAHLE MotorSport, leader in piston technology, has unveiled their new 2.5L Mercury Marine forged performance pistons. Made from German precision forgings for tighter tolerances and smaller weight variances, MAHLE Mercury Marine pistons are designed for serious racing applications.

The design starts with the use of a hypereutectic aluminum alloy, with a high silicon content for strength and wear resistance. The pistons are then coated with a phosphate dry film lubricant to aid break-in and protect against galling and micro-welding. For reduced friction, each piston receives a factory applied screen printed Grafal® coating on the skirts.

The pre-installed piston rings are semi-keystone rings which prevent them from sticking even under the most demanding racing conditions. A chromium ceramic coating gives the rings high thermal loadability and wear resistance.

Other features of the new MAHLE Mercury Marine piston include a new improved ring lock pin design that mechanically locks the ring location. The pins are stainless steel, which is more flexible, chemical resistant, and stronger. The pistons, rings, and pins will be packaged as a complete drop-in assembly kit.

Cheryl Iorio
Pro Marine

[us1]

The new Mahles suck unless using in a fishing motor. I have had countless pistons in here that collapsed the skirts or pulled out the wrist pins. Get new ones from Jay or I can repin the old ones.

[SAMMY CORLEY]

What are da ones Jay is sellin? I'm really confused bout dis piston crap. Also isn't there a wzard piston or somethin an how are they?



Sammy in S.C.

[Jay Smith]

Sammy glad you asked,
I'm the North American sells rep for the NEW Wizard ( wiesco ) forged racing pistons and am happy to report we have not had a single failure ( that wasn't self inflected , LOL....via running too lean , NOS, and or running the motor so hot the cowling melted to the engine ) I've sold 50-55 sets with no integrity failures to date and I can't keep enough on the shelf to handle the high demand. They are FORGED , top pinned , lightened and weight matched, angle cut on the ports, coated ( Racecote ), have a different improved cam grind on the skirts than the stockers that have proven less likely to stick or gaull, and come with a light weight 2.4 length wrist pin. The OEM stockers weigh 490- 505 ish ours weigh 433 they are now available in single and duel ring models, and with a choice of ring material configuration.( Low tention Chrome or TiN coated BTW the chrome have worked GREAT on the coated as well as the steel bored motors to date , we have MANY racers that have ran them a full season and after inspection are VERY pleased) They also come in over size models for the person that wants to over bore thier worn egged Alum sleeve motor re nic and run a fresh straight bigger bore...All for a low racer net price of $1100.00 USD this low price includes pistons, rings, pins, and clips. Also we have made available the NEW JSRE lightweight incapsolated wrist pin to fit these new slugs that are ANOTHER 15 grams lighter that the furnished ones and reduce the volumn in the block with another 10 CC's of combustable vapor....Re rings jobs are a fraction of the cost compaired to OEM costs with a set of rings costing only $240.00 USD....

Call for details... 1 281 576 5088 cst

Jay

[jeff dunn]

Sammy , the latest pistons made by mahle are fine, have them in motors turning over 10,000 . Just took a motor apart with mahles in it that I run in lake racer in the odba, no problems. The reason for taking them out is the odba says I cant run them in my motor for the rules I run . The only thing I wish merc ,and mahle would do is top pin in 2 differnt places like side pin pistons for a better seal.

[BoatStuff]

I just thought this was a cool picture of the pin.


http://65.36.182.113/images/mahlepin.jpg

[Ziemer]

Re rings jobs are a fraction of the cost compaired to OEM costs with a set of rings costing only $240.00 USD....

That's a lot less than $600!!!:eek: :D :D Can you use those rings on stock Mercury pistons? (Obviously, either stock top pinned, or Marles top-pinned);)

[Jay Smith]

Because the rings that come in the OEM High Performance late model motors are in my opinion too small for the lan ,and if the loose ring to lan fit hasen't beat the stock lan up the answer is yes. I have people that have successfully run our rings in the OEM pistons with no issues...Heard today the the OEM rings have went up to over $750.00 a set, list !!!!!

good luck,

[ChrisXS2003]

IMHO, I think it's awesome to have two choices! I think both are good, forged pistons. Price is close on both. Mahle has an excellent name...the wizard piston are without a doubt lighter. Both come in matched (weight) sets. I'm buying two sets this winter and the jury is still out for me.


How much do ring sets cost for the Mahles...

Chris

[us1]

I didn’t think I could find this picture. Here is Bill Gohr's first experience with the new Mahle. It tore out the wrist pin and ripped off the injector. Here is the post. Talk about a BBQ:D
http://forums.screamandfly.com/forums/showthread.php?t=61804&highlight=fire

[RichS]

Seems I remember the story was Bill trying to do a qualifiing lap with the motor already on 5 cylinders. He couldn't hear the motor inside the capsule and...

[us1]

It's wild, looks like he is on fire:D

[jay j]

i bought a set from jay in feb 06 and have had nothing but good performance
they run like hell for a stock motor. i have ran a alot of faster boats with drags and 21cc heads and mine is on 93 pump gas and i still get an impressive holeshot. zeimer, i'll be down the fbi way in november and we will
see how they do in lake racer, odba says i cannot run them under ss rules with them. you need to get a set. a good alternative plus less money than
merc's pistons. also i am using the black chrome rings. thanks jay

[jbf2002]

I think that the mahle pistons will make a great 260/280 replacement piston for general use. Most of the members on this board are not racers and this product will suit my needs and then some.

It is nice to have a choice in products in addition to OEM.


j.f.

[CUDA]

Jeff Kirt Burns and my self were ordering a set of pro marine pistons for our stock powerheads set ups till YOU changed the rules:)I guess they have a better window, and are balanced.shame shame

[us1]

I guess they are making them differently than the first run that came out a couple of years ago with all the problems.

[jeff dunn]

Cuda I didnt change anything , the higher ups of odba said no, no, yes the windows are bigger but, the pistons weigh more than the mercs as the motor techs of the odba found out, the windows around the wristpin are bigger , but the other opening is smaller than the merc piston. Its ok , tested today with merc pistons and picked up another 1/10 and another mph, looking good for jasper, may take some weight out and run superstock also. The smaller windows in the merc pistons may have given me more crankcase pressure, leaves hard, see ya at jasper. Jeff

[CUDA]

Just kidding Jeff.:D Running two classes is the way to go, you have a great set up.

[The Big Al]

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD colSpan=5><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD width=10 background=/wsn/images/user/english/pl_template1/blue/banner_top.gif height=76></TD><TD noWrap align=middle width="100%" background=/wsn/images/user/english/pl_template1/blue/banner_top.gif height=76><!--WSN:COMPANY_NAME:BEGIN-->Welcome to Wizard Race Shop dba Wizard Performance Products, Inc.<!--WSN:COMPANY_NAME:END--> </TD><TD vAlign=bottom noWrap align=middle background=/wsn/images/user/english/pl_template1/blue/banner_top.gif height=76><!--WSN:SLOGAN:BEGIN-->Wizard Performance Products Contact: Dean Pink (863)660-1505<!--WSN:SLOGAN:END-->
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With 30 years of modified outboard racing experience, Wizard Performance Products has developed the ultimate piston for the high performance Mercury 2.5L engine. These pistons are manufactured to fit the Mercury top guided rod applications. (rod part # 644-818141) <!--WSN:CELL:END:INDEX=0--></TD><TD vAlign=top align=left width="50%"><!--WSN:CELL:BEGIN:INDEX=1--><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top></TD><TD></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><!--WSN:CELL:END:INDEX=1--></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top align=middle width="50%"><!--WSN:CELL:BEGIN:INDEX=2-->http://wizardraceshop.com/db1/00081/wizardraceshop.com/_uimages/DSC00447.JPG
This forged piston is lighter than other pistons causing
less thermal expansion. (approximately 435 grams)

Piston is cut with twin ring grooves, and can be run
with twin or single ring application, allowing the
second groove to serve as an oil retention area. Single ring pistons will soon be available as well.

Top pinned design has proven successful for high
RPM applications in the motorcycle and snowmobile
racing industry for many years.

These factory finished and lightened pistons have a
thermal barrier non-stick coating by RaceKote.

Titanium nitride rings are now available at minimal additional cost.
<!--WSN:CELL:END:INDEX=2--></TD><TD vAlign=top align=left width="50%"><!--WSN:CELL:BEGIN:INDEX=3--><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top></TD><TD></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><!--WSN:CELL:END:INDEX=3--></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left width="50%"><!--WSN:CELL:BEGIN:INDEX=4--><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top></TD><TD>
Pistons sold as kits and include standard size pistons, wristpins, clips, chrome rings, and sold in sets of six only (due to engine balance and stability).
NEW -- now available -- titanium coated rings are now available for a slightly higher price (and also fit most Merc 2.5 race pistons)
NEW -- oversize piston kits now available (+0.024)
Retail price for standard kit is $1250. (chrome rings)
Racer net for standard kit is $1150. (chrome rings)
Dealer and distributor pricing available for large quantity purchases.
Specifications and pricing subject to change without notice.
COMING SOON -- single ring piston kits will soon be available -- call for information
Piston Southern US Distributor:
JSRE (J. Smith) 281-576-5088
Wire Distributors:
Flagship Marine, Punta Gorda, FL
Bob's Machine, Ruskin, FL
OTHER CONTACT INFORMATION:
Wizard Performance Products/Wizard Race Shop
Dean Pink (863) 660-1505 or (863) 666-8888
[email protected]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

[Dutch]

Al- how comes youre not trashing Jay here like you
did on the byuboyz site? it says right on page one
of this post where jay says they are wizard pistons.
a little different than your talk on the other site.
are you jealous of jay, or do you like to start stuff .
i am just trying to understand what you get out of it?

[jbf2002]

Funny how this thread started out about feedback on the new style Mahle pistons, and now it seems to have shifted towards whoever has something to sell or provide a service to the piston buying market.

And now it has lowered itself to the usual mud-slinging, He said.......She said stuff.

I am still confused I guess,

j.f.

[M.CHAPMAN]

j.f.
It seems that anymore on here mud-slinging has become the trend. It's confusing to me as well. I don't know if some have hidden agendas or just nothing better to do. I'm all for someone posting there experience with a particular product wheather it's good or bad. But when they don't have any first hand experience to offer they should just sit back and remain silent on the issue in my opinion.
At no time has Jay stated thet he manufactures the pistons. I know he has had some input on the final design of them. When I talked with him last year about the Wizard pistons he said that Dean Pink was the one at the head of the design. By Jay being a distributor for them he may refer to them as "our" pistons just like if you work for a dealer and refer to the products you sell as our products. You are the representative for them. Some of the posts on the Wizard pistons may have been titled JSRE pistons but at no time has Jay himself said they are made at JSRE. Who the hell really cares anyway, the pistons are an absolute great buy on a really good product. You would think everyone would be happy to see that they can get a top notch product for a more than fair price. I guess some would rather be stuck having to pay Mercury for the same basic piston at a much higher price. I have a set and like them, I have seen one that came out of an F1 motor with 500 laps on it and it looked great. As for the Mahles, i have not run any of the new ones therefore I have no opinion to offer on them.
It's really a cryin shame when people have to spend there time on a performance boating website talking trash about others. After all this aint life or death matters here. We all share a common passion for the same thing and in my opinion only should help support our fellow speed freaks rather than try and discredit them and create chaos. This of course is just my sole opinion and I'll leave it a that. Good luck to you all!!!!
-Michael

[The Big Al]

Did I trash Jay on here about these pistons?

I just posted infor and pic of the Wizard piston

[M.CHAPMAN]

Did I say you did on here?

[Instigator]

showed me these pistons at this years Rumble and he is also a distributor.
He knows how to make Johnny's and Mercs run and is nicest guy you'll ever meet. He is instrumental in Jon Wrights record holding boat as well.
Great guy and I will be buying a set from him.

[1BadAction]

The new Mahles suck unless using in a fishing motor. I have had countless pistons in here that collapsed the skirts or pulled out the wrist pins. Get new ones from Jay or I can repin the old ones.

why do they collapse the skirt? are they manufactured in germany like the other ones? generally MAHLE makes some Bad MF pistons, but if they arent good for the OBs I wouldnt want to try them in the one i'm messing with.

several guys I know of building LSx motors are running 4.125" bore mahles in apps over 1200hp and 8000 rpm :eek:

[CUDA]

The NEW Pro Marine piston are great, they fix the problems of the first batch. I just recieved a set of the OEM pistons with rings $1,475 I am forced to use them to comply with super stock rules in ODBA, yeah lots of rules but thats OK if it keeps everyone equal.

[us1]

why do they collapse the skirt? are they manufactured in germany like the other ones? generally MAHLE makes some Bad MF pistons, but if they arent good for the OBs I wouldnt want to try them in the one i'm messing with.

several guys I know of building LSx motors are running 4.125" bore mahles in apps over 1200hp and 8000 rpm :eek:

I don’t know. I had a few of them come apart and with skirt problems when they first came out. I stopped using them then. I can’t speak for later batches. This was a couple of year ago.