Sportbike info wanted.

[mxz]

Guys,
I am getting my motorcycle licence this spring and will be buying a bike. I am thinking of a 5-15 year old 600cc sportbike such as a FZR600 or ZX600 for my first bike. Any opinions on these types of bikes? Which ones are good, or bad?
How many miles on a used sportbike is too many?, I don't want to buy something that is nearing its end of life.?

Thanks for any help!

[mike bryan]

I've Worked In Multi Line Dealerships Over 15 Years And I'll Just Give You My Opinion. 600 Cc Jap Inline Is A Great Bet. To Me The Yamahas Are Slightly Weaker In The Long Run (clutchs, Gearboxs Etc). Any Honda Cbr 600 1991 And Up In Good Shape Is A Good All Around Bike. Any Kaw Zx600e Is A Really Good Bike But Had Some Trans Problems. The Later Zx600r Aluminum Frame Ninjas Are Fast And Bulletproof. The Suzukis After About 97 Are Nice But They Have A Very Cramped Riding Position If You Are Tall. I Have Heard Of Sportbikes Running 100k Miles But I Tend To Look For A Bike With Under 10k Miles. It All Depends On How They Are Used. If You Cannot Check Out The Bike Yourself It Might Be A Better Bet To Buy From A Reputable Dealer Where You Can Get Or Buy Some Powertrain Warranty. Going Into One Of These Motors To Fix Internal Problems Or Trans Problems Is Nasty Expensive.


Good Luck

[triple dude]

For a first bike, any of the sport 600's would be above your ability. Don't mean to sound like I'm belittling you cause I'm not. The technology (unless you go way back to 15 years old) will far exceed your skills...for awhile anyway. I doubt you'll find much in the 15 year old category that hasn't been beat to death. If nothing else but a learning resource, watch such bikes on ebay. The pictures certainly help in narrowing down what you want a bike to look like. Supplement that with you local Trader and you should be able to zero in on something. From years of buying bikes, my feeling is that most have an asking price that's way too high and they ending up selling for much less. Also check your area for motorcycle flea markets. Quite often there are bikes for sale with reasonable prices. Good luck!!!

[triple dude]

...and don't forget the helmut!!!!! A newbie combined with a sport 600 could be a dangerous combo.

[mike bryan]

Triple Dude

I Respectfully Disagree With Your Opinion On Beginner Bikes. I Would Much Rather Teach Someone To Ride A Cbr600f2 Than A 250 Ninja. The Reason Is The 250 Has No Bottom End Torque And Has To Be Revved Feverously Just To Get Underway. Ride The 600 Under About 7000 Rpm And Its About As Docile As A 400cc Then Later You Still Have Some Performance Envelope Left. I Totally Agree A New Rider Cannot Wring All The Performance Out Of The Latest 600s But Neither Can I, But I Can Sure Make Some Noise On One.

[Ziemer]

I would definitely consider the Honda CBR F2 or F3. Especially, since you're looking to get an older bike, the Honda was always at the top of the 600 class when these were current models. The FXR600 is small compared to the ZX6 or CBR so depending on your height it may be uncomfortable to ride. Also the FZR is not nearly the bike compared to the Kaw or Honda.

I had 2 F2's and never had a bit of problems. I'm about 6'2" and it was a comfortable bike for me to ride. My roomate had a GSXR 600 and the riding position was a lot tigther than the CBR, which was good for him because he was only about 5'8". If I were to get another one I would try to find one with under 10,000 miles and from an older rider. Problem is that most used sport bikes are ragged out.

[triple dude]

Triple Dude

I Respectfully Disagree With Your Opinion On Beginner Bikes. I Would Much Rather Teach Someone To Ride A Cbr600f2 Than A 250 Ninja. The Reason Is The 250 Has No Bottom End Torque And Has To Be Revved Feverously Just To Get Underway. Ride The 600 Under About 7000 Rpm And Its About As Docile As A 400cc Then Later You Still Have Some Performance Envelope Left. I Totally Agree A New Rider Cannot Wring All The Performance Out Of The Latest 600s But Neither Can I, But I Can Sure Make Some Noise On One.
Didn't mean my comment as you interpreted. I didn't mean to infer a newbie shouldn't buy a sport 600. It'd obviously be way beyond their immediate capabilities and would take some time to "grow into." But in time, they would probably be able to use whatever it had. Couldn't agree with you more on a Ninja 250. One of my kids bought one for a first bike awhile back and was bored with it in no time. on the flipside, a young guy I work with bought a new Yamaha R6 last summer for his first bike. He took his time on getting used to it without just jumpin' on and going crazy. I think he's got a pretty good handle on it now.

[DoktorC]

I've got a nice RZ for sale :). Makes a great starter bike (insurance is peanuts) and it's a 2-stroke!!! so it'll smell like boating!!

[STV_Keith]

I think most of the guys are pointing you in the right direction. Honda F2-F3 (91-97). Great all around bike with Honda build quality. Reliable, easy to find parts for and good performance. 94 and newer had the better suspension.

[mxz]

Wow, great info guys. Keep it coming.
Good info on the differences between the makes. I am about 5'7, so will be looking for a good fit for my height.
Triple dude, while I will be a newbie to street bikes, I have riding experience on 2 stroke dirt bikes, I understand your concern though.
DoktorC, what size is your RZ? 350 or 500?

[DoktorC]

It's an '88 350. Mint too!!

[STV_Keith]

Good info on the differences between the makes. I am about 5'7, so will be looking for a good fit for my height.

I know back in 88, the CBR600 had the lowest seat height in relation to the ground. Don't know if that followed to the F2/F3's, but at 5' 8.5", I didn't have a problem. :)

[triple dude]

It's an '88 350. Mint too!!
Cool bikes!! I didn't remember that they made 'em that long for outside the US. My brother had a string of them both new and used. He also had a couple 500's. I think I still have a couple Yammie brochures that show a 350 and 500 side by side with King Kenny standin' next to 'em.

[red hott]

by a 900 and grow into it 3-6 months and you will want to get rid of it
my first street bike was a 1998 cbr 900rr you should be able to find a good one for 4-5000
good luck
Tray Archer

[Riverman]

Cool bikes!! I didn't remember that they made 'em that long for outside the US.Triple - ever ride a Gamma? That is one cool bike!

[triple dude]

Little brother had a few RZ 500's AND Gamma's. He sold the last one on ebay last year. I think there's pictures of it on the Old Bike thread. It was pretty quick. Like a RZ 350 on steroids.

[racerx]

Hey Doc what do you have 4 sale is it stock,tell me about it,might be interested...Thanks Jeff

[heath brinkley]

trip, just (today) got my fzr600 motor, gearbox, electronics, for my fzr400. Kenny Roberts lookalike finds a motor.:)

MXZ, If your looking at older keep in mind, the FZR600's remained virtually unchanged for years. Which means parts are cheap and easy to get. Not to mention Airtech makes a bolt on R6 body kit to freshen up the looks.

[DoktorC]

Racer - I've got an 88 RZ350 all stock. Has a completely rebuilt engine (rods, bears, seals, pistons 1st over) but its all stock. It's a Canadian RZ which means (if you don't know) that it has the better pipes with out the cats in them. It's red and white and is in excellent shape. I bought it from a collector and rode it for about 800kms then totally redid the engine. This was 2 summers ago and I haven't ridden it since, it used to be my commuter and then I got a company truck...so between that and boating/cottage on the weekend I couldn't be bothered insuring it. It runs great and is quick..a riot to ride!!

[Scott Gilmore]

How about a 98 or 99 YZF-R1, both have LOW miles & are perfect . I have both for sale. Either would make a GREAT beginners bike !! Scott :D

[mxz]

Nice bikes Scott!!! A little too much power for me though. (for now at least)

[Scott Gilmore]

Nice bikes Scott!!! A little too much power for me though. (for now at least)

Very, manageable power, very light & super easy to ride. It's a GREAT first bike, you don't have to ride everywhere wide open !! LOL, Scott :D :eek:

[triple dude]

Nice bikes Scott!!! A little too much power for me though. (for now at least)
Scotts right. You can grow into those. Another thought is an older 600 Triumph. They weren't quite up to the Jap versions but they were decent. I'd guess they can be bought pretty reasonably???

[GP-1]

Buy what you want.. Any 600 built since about 1990 has sufficient performance to keep you excited for quite a while.. The only reason you'll think it isn't fast enough is if you race somebody with something newer. As far as miles go, I'd be more concerned about condition.. If you're looking at a 15 year old bike, I'd rather have a well cared for one with 25-30k on it than one that had sat in the garage ignored for 8 years that had only 12k on it. Yea, some of the bikes are a bit faster (the early Hondas), but any of the early 90's 600's (with the possible exception of the fat Katanas -- they really are slow) would be a great learning tool. Also, when you're buying a cheaper bike, check the condition of tires, chains, sprockets, brakes, etc.. When you're talking about a $2500 bike, the deal doesn't look as good if you immediately have to put another $500 into it.. Good luck..

[mxz]

Thanks GP-1, you gave me some good points to look for in an older bike.

[WARLOCK]

89 or newer FZR 600's or 91 or newer Honda CBR F2, 3 whatever. I think you'll find the Honda to be more comfortable but they are both great bikes. Just my opinion, later, Dave

[triple dude]

89 or newer FZR 600's or 91 or newer Honda CBR F2, 3 whatever. I think you'll find the Honda to be more comfortable but they are both great bikes. Just my opinion, later, Dave
Warlock has a Honda Dream he can fix ya up with.:D

[Balzy]

this "98" CBR600 F3 last July. Great bike. This one is MINT !!!!! I love it but don't find much time to ride. I have been riding dirt and street bikes for 30 years. Used to drag race H1 Kawy's and a couple different Z1-900 Kaw's. Todays 600's have plenty speed and power for you to grow into.

I just need to add a few checkers to match the boat and tow truck now. LOL

[triple dude]

What were you turnin' with the H1's?? I had a new one in 1971.

[Balzy]

That was so damn long ago, I don't remember. Hell, I don't remember yesterday sometimes. LOL I know it was pretty quick. It would beat a H3 to the 1/8 mile mark. Then the 750 would pull you by a bit. Not a pile though.

I never lost a race on the strip with it. If I remember the class went from 351cc to 500cc. There wasn't a pile of compitition at WIR where I raced it. maybe 6 to 10 bikes would show up. There wasn't anything in the world that would touch it except a H1 that was a couple years older than mine. I can't remember what year mine was now. I did have to run an older one once. I looked at his odometer and it was something in the 30K mile range. If figured it had to have been bored out by then so I challanged it. They tore him down and sure enough, he was .030" over on all three cyl. He got DQ'd and had to pay a $1000 fine. Phweeee, thank god he was over or I would have had to put up the grand. Hell, I was probably 17 years old, I didn't have that kind of money !!!!!!!!!!

They were fun bikes. I stuck the center cyl once and had it bores .010" over. That thing ran smoother and better than it ever did with all stock bores in it. It quit fouling the center plug too after it went oversized. It was a wheely machine on the streets too !!!!!!!!! :eek: :eek: :eek: With a passanger you could wheely that thing forever. Ahh the memories !!!!!

[triple dude]

When the powerband kicked in on those old H1's, ya better be hangin' on. I've got a 72 750 that I bought back in the mid 80's. I burnt a piston on it a few years ago while at Bike Week with racerx. The top end is modified so I bought a new piston and took it along with the old one with barrel to Gohr. He honed the cylinder and cut the piston to match the old. Good as new. It's fun to ride but has a much wider powerband.

[GP-1]

Those old Kawasaki triples were really neat bikes, but I rode one relatively recently, and you just can't go home... They still look cool, but they don't go fast, handle terribly and almost don't stop at all. The fastest 750 triple streetbike (not those pro-gas things with 1000 rpm powerbands) in the world would get so crushed by any newer 600 (even the clunky Katana) that it's not worth talking about.. Strange though.. Those old junkers are sure worth some money, aren't they? I don't think you can touch a '72-'73 H2 for under about 6k, and even those little 250's are bringing good money. Well, if you buy one, have a good budget for gas and spark plugs..

[triple dude]

My 750 doesn't run too bad in a straight line but you're right about newer 600's being able to run away from it. Even with a "built" top end and pipes, AT BEST, it'd run real high 11's. A new 600 would blow away my Kaw 750 turbo also. I watch both on ebay and the real nice triples do bring some big money. I bought mine back in 1985 for $1200 which was about what it cost new. I bought the turbo about six years ago (after selling a 79 Honda CBX) for $3000. It's original with about 6000 miles. Won't lose any money on that one. I use it more than anything else I've got.

[racerx]

Tripledudes triple will bring over 10 grand with out a blink of an eye on e bay,he should make about 8 to 10 on that bike,thats more profet then any 1970s Harley would ever make,and every one says they make money on HOGS HA...

[TeamSunset]

I used to ride a ported H2 with Denko chambers back around 1976 (A.K.A. FarmBoy Killers). The thing was a strippo, every extra bracket and componet hacked off the thing, drilled out everywhere '70's style'. Sure was fun to fan the clutch turning a corner onto main street. Break-loose-full-drift-wheelie...the thing damn near shattered glass between the buildings.
It was fun in its day... Air forks & S&W's...HAHA:DHAHA!!!!!!

[triple dude]

My pipes are Bill Wirges out of Prineton, Illinois. I think he held the top end speed record for a short time back in the 70's. I bought the pipes from a guy a few years ago that had bought 'em new back in the day and after a couple weeks decided they were too loud. Then he stuck them on the garage wall. They're chrome (I had no desire for black) and still have the Wirges Dynotune stickers on 'em...and they're not loud. Just wicked.:D

[Scott Gilmore]

Those old Kawasaki triples were really neat bikes, but I rode one relatively recently, and you just can't go home... They still look cool, but they don't go fast, handle terribly and almost don't stop at all. The fastest 750 triple streetbike (not those pro-gas things with 1000 rpm powerbands) in the world would get so crushed by any newer 600 (even the clunky Katana) that it's not worth talking about.. Strange though.. Those old junkers are sure worth some money, aren't they? I don't think you can touch a '72-'73 H2 for under about 6k, and even those little 250's are bringing good money. Well, if you buy one, have a good budget for gas and spark plugs..

FUNNY & true, you can't GO BACK !!! Scott :D

[GP-1]

Tripledudes triple will bring over 10 grand with out a blink of an eye on e bay,he should make about 8 to 10 on that bike,thats more profet then any 1970s Harley would ever make,and every one says they make money on HOGS HA...



Hmmmmm... If you know where they're bring 10k, we gotta get together and make some money. I saw a mint '72 H2 for $6700 a couple of months ago.. I might be wrong, but I suspect that's the most desirable one.. There are decent to nice 500's all over the place for $3500 - $4500. I have a friend that has on original (almost, it has a sissy bar) '69 H1 500.. I've been thinking for years that I need to talk him out of that thing, but it's really a piece of crap -- but that's the way it was built. I guess it was fast "in the day", but last time I rode it (10 years ago), I remember laughing.. You give it full throttle and it makes that bogging intake roar that all those old two-strokes made... and moves forward with all of about 17 horsepower -- then it comes on the powerband and probably makes 45-50 horsepower for about 1000 RPM.. That's it -- story over.. All that and 25 MPG too..

In motorcycling, the good-old-days is now....

[racerx]

Randy i seen 2 of them go in the 10s,with not orig paint..Clydes is orig paint thats real nice and its all orig,he has all stock parts to put on it,heck, i have seen rz 350s pull 55 hundred.I am lookin a a 2005 gsxr 1000 with a velocity turbo right now if he comes down a little on the price its mine,now thats a bike....

[TeamSunset]

In motorcycling, the good-old-days is now.... .....

[TeamSunset]

WTF were they thinkin?...

[triple dude]

WTF were they thinkin?...
That is funny!!! At a bike show up in Woodstock (Il) a few years ago, there was a quad with built H2 motor. Pretty wild.

[triple dude]

Hmmmmm... If you know where they're bring 10k, we gotta get together and make some money. I saw a mint '72 H2 for $6700 a couple of months ago.. I might be wrong, but I suspect that's the most desirable one.. There are decent to nice 500's all over the place for $3500 - $4500. I have a friend that has on original (almost, it has a sissy bar) '69 H1 500.. I've been thinking for years that I need to talk him out of that thing, but it's really a piece of crap -- but that's the way it was built. I guess it was fast "in the day", but last time I rode it (10 years ago), I remember laughing.. You give it full throttle and it makes that bogging intake roar that all those old two-strokes made... and moves forward with all of about 17 horsepower -- then it comes on the powerband and probably makes 45-50 horsepower for about 1000 RPM.. That's it -- story over.. All that and 25 MPG too..

In motorcycling, the good-old-days is now....
$10,000 might be a reach but who knows what happens on ebay these days. There ws recently a 75 (Slowwwww) H2 on ebay recently that went for $8000. All the cosmetics on mine are original with Fast By Gast topend. He claimed 110 HP but I still have stock carbs (with VERY fat jets). I'd guess it's closer to 90HP?? It does run strong but I have been toying with the idea of changin sprockets to give it more low end. No way am I gonna go top end on an H2.:eek: But as back in 1972, it still puts a hurtin' on Harleys and that's still a lot of fun.:D

[TeamSunset]

Displacement wars...

[triple dude]

I've seen that six cylinder H2 in magazines. Quite a bit of work. The other one woul dhave to get people wondering,"WTF????" A few years ago a guy showed up at a Walneck show with a 70 Triumph with twin tandem motors. Looked like it came from the factory. He extended the frame, gas tank, etc. But Warlocks Honda Dream is still the one to have.;)

[TeamSunset]

It sure looks like Warlock...

[WARLOCK]

Tom,
I gotta ask....What the hell kind of crap do read to find pictures like that? That just plain scares me!!! Later, Dave
P.S. Quit making fun of the Dream!

[TeamSunset]

Sorry Dave... you're up awfully early this morning:D

[triple dude]

There was a 72 H2 on ebay over the weekend. Anybody see it?? There was something like 6 pages of questions and answers. The seller claimed it was a mint and fresh restoration. A guy came on and mentioned a couple things that weren't right about the bike. Then somebody else came on with a "What do you know?" comment. Then the other guys comes back with a laundry list of wrong items. Then it was a full blown pi**ing contest. I've never seen the ebay questions and answers maxed out before. The bike ended up selling for $8200.

[mxz]

I saw a good deal on a 96 ZX-6R in my area. Guy says it is in great shape except that 2nd gear slips a bit under hard acceleration. Any idea how much it would cost to have a shop fix a problem like this? Can it be done by the average guy?

Thanks

[Scott Gilmore]

I saw a good deal on a 96 ZX-6R in my area. Guy says it is in great shape except that 2nd gear slips a bit under hard acceleration. Any idea how much it would cost to have a shop fix a problem like this? Can it be done by the average guy?

Thanks

I'd stay away from any tranny problems on a bike they're expensive fixes & no not just any average person can fix it !! Plus the 96 ZX 6 was a very porky bike. Scott :D

[GP-1]

I'd stay away from any tranny problems on a bike they're expensive fixes & no not just any average person can fix it !! Plus the 96 ZX 6 was a very porky bike. Scott :D


I'm with Scott on this one... That bike can't be cheap enough to make it worthwhile. The transmission seems to be an weak spot on those bikes -- I've heard of others with the same (2nd gear) issue. The bottom line is that a nice one of those is worth.. what? Maybe $3000 - $3500. Getting that fixed is going to cost you over $1000, and you're still going to have a bike that was obviously ridden hard. If (a big if) I was going to buy a bike like that, I'd find a complete used motor and swap them -- it'd probably be cheaper.

[mxz]

Thanks for the info guys. Guy only wants $2000 Canadian for it but as you said it was probably ridden hard so there could be other problems lurking It also has over 30,000miles. I think I will pass on this one.

[Scott Gilmore]

Thanks for the info guys. Guy only wants $2000 Canadian for it but as you said it was probably ridden hard so there could be other problems lurking It also has over 30,000miles. I think I will pass on this one.

$2000 Canadian is pretty cheap , if the rest of the bike is ok offer him $1500. That would be a hell of a deal ! For that kind of money maybe you could live with the 2nd gear slip. Scott :D

[heath brinkley]

Send it to a good tranny shop in your area (they'll advertise in cycle news, AR, ect) and have the gears backcut, at least the first three or four. Then bang 'em as hard as you like. It'll cure that ****.

[heath brinkley]

it was probably ridden hard so there could be other problems lurking

If your looking for a used sportbike that wasn't ridden hard, plan on looking for a few years.

[heath brinkley]

I was gonna leave it alone, but I gotsta know, what is that second bike in team sunsets post ???

[triple dude]

it WAS a Kaw triple. The guy must have had a bunch of spare cylinderrs/heads laying around.

[GP-1]

If your looking for a used sportbike that wasn't ridden hard, plan on looking for a few years.


This might be a true statement, but there's a difference between ridden hard and abuse.. My bikes have probably been ridden hard, but they've been maintained.. It's the wheelies, speedshifting, etc., that slowly(or not so slowly) kills a bike.. They'll live a long time being ridden hard if they have good/clean oil, don't sit out in the rain, and get stuff cleaned/adjusted from time to time.

[triple dude]

MXZ, So have you zeroed in on what you're looking for or is the field still wide open??? After all this brainstormin', just don't end up buying a Harley.;)

[mxz]

Still wide open. I have narrowed it down to a used 600cc sportbike. My budget is pretty tight if I want to buy this year. I am just trying to educate myself a little bit about the different sportbikes first to see which model would suit me best. There have been lots of great tips in this thread!

A couple of my friends have Harleys but personally I don't like the cruiser bikes.

[Scott Gilmore]

Still wide open. I have narrowed it down to a used 600cc sportbike. My budget is pretty tight if I want to buy this year. I am just trying to educate myself a little bit about the different sportbikes first to see which model would suit me best. There have been lots of great tips in this thread!

A couple of my friends have Harleys but personally I don't like the cruiser bikes.


NO HARLEYS = GOOD !!!! Scott :D

[triple dude]

If ya wanted to forget the "sport" part, you could also look at old Honda 750/900's. There's lots of 'em out there and many are pretty clean. Certainly not as fast as a newer 600 but it'd at least get you into the game for cheap $$$$.

[GP-1]

If ya wanted to forget the "sport" part, you could also look at old Honda 750/900's. There's lots of 'em out there and many are pretty clean. Certainly not as fast as a newer 600 but it'd at least get you into the game for cheap $$$$.

I actually was looking for one recently.. It seems that now (at least according to their owners) these bikes have taken on "classic" status. Try to find an old 750/900/1100F Honda in nice shape --they're (especially the 1100) pretty darn expensive. I see decent CBR600F2 Hondas all over for $2300 - $2800.. A nice CB900F or CB1100F is at least 3K -- minimum.. All this depends on how old a bike you want... There are 600 Ninjas out there for $1200.. I wouldn't buy one, but they're out there. There are also plenty of first generation (Hurricanes) 600 Hondas out there at good prices, but -- in my mind anyway -- the performance upgrade you get when you go to the newer bike ('91 F2) justifies the additional cost. In my opinion, that's the first "modern" 600 sportbike. They're really not much different than the F4 that sits in the showroom today...

[stv pro]

through the years i have owned 5 or 6 of the '82-'83 suzuki gs1100e bikes-- for the money i had on hand at the time they were by far the fastest, best all around bike for my money.. i also owned a '82 cb900f supersport back then but those bikes had the absolute worst electrical system of any bike i ever owned-- when mine was running right it was pretty fast but it only ran right for a little while-- then i got run off the road and broke a lot of bones on that one, so i just dont have a good feeling bout them!

i think any of the early to mid 90's 600's can be had for a really good price, especially if your willing to take a drive to pick one up-- small price to pay for getting the bike you want and the price you want..
personally, i have never liked the smaller bikes like the 600's cause they reminded me of the small motorcross bikes, they scream on top end but have no power if they arent up above 8grand give or take.. the last few bikes i have had have been an early zx-10, a '89 model and it went 168mph on radar when it was tested in one magazine and did the 1/4mi in 10.something.. that was a great bike but the wheelbase was a bit long for doing wheelies, and i love stunting and have been riding differently then most way before all the freestyle videos and kids doing it these days! my latest bike is a gsxr1000 and even now with 29kmi on it the bike still amazes me every time i ride it!! anytime under 100mph if you hit the gas the front wheel comes right up, its just awesome in every aspect and i havent had anyone beat me, yet that is.. the handling on this bike is truly amazing, the forks are so sturdy(frame too) compared to any of the older bikes i have owned and i can put it up on the front wheel at 80mph without blinking an eye..

anyways, sorry to ramble, i have been riding all my life and i just lvoe being on a bike-- it really is a beautiful thing, i hope you find a nice bike for a great price.. watch the sand and gravel, esp after it rains, watch out for the other people, ya know defiensive driving, and have fun..i cant wait for some nice weather and the streets to be clean of all the salt and junk on them now!! shiney side up and good luck!