Direct Injection ECU

[vi top shatta]

Is their any one making aftermarket ecu that can run a direct injection outboard engine. What is the most do you think a average performance boater will be willing to pay before the cost out ways the benefit.

[PanRonnie]

the cost will never outway the benefit!

[powerabout]

The guys that have one of the licenses for the orbital system that merc use do consulting work and I guess would do a pak for you.
Synerject

[mrcrsr]

in theory the wolf would be able to do it(has 12 injector drivers) but i wouldn't want to think about mapping it.

[powerabout]

Maybe the Yam system with standard direct inject injectors is easier to retro fit although you need to generate the high pressure.
or work out how to drive an etec injector which would be the ultimate retro fit and a computer for the oil pump

[PanRonnie]

Maybe the Yam system with standard direct inject injectors is easier to retro fit although you need to generate the high pressure.
or work out how to drive an etec injector which would be the ultimate retro fit and a computer for the oil pump

actually the mercury system would be the easiest to use
lets forget about the cost and benefit for now

the original ecu uses 3 amp peak 1 amp hold injector drivers but 12 of them
first you would have to look what the air and fuel injector signal looks like
you can do this with a
http://www.picoauto.com/automotive-oscilloscope.html
preferably at the same time looking at the oil pump signal since we no longer have lubrication through the fuel
this is most likely a PWM signal
now if the air and fuel signal are the same you can use any sequential ecu you just have to double the injector signal
you would still need to log an original engine with the lamda and EGT data at specific loads as to have a target mixture range

if there is some offset going on
you would need 2 sequential groups of injector drivers
i don,t know of any aftermarket ecu,s that can do that right now maybe motec or EFI
but already your cost benefit is flying out the window
the better and much safer (less stuff can go wrong) would be to build the engine to standard manifold injection
a direct injection engine turning peak rpm is only slightly more economical than standard injection
it only shines at idle and slightly higher rpm,s where it uses stratified injection as opposed to homogeneous injection

now make a list of there mercury stuff you can through in the corner with the price-tag on it
oilpump, airpump, injectors fuel and air, fuel air rail, pressure regulators ,mercury ecu
and now make a list of an after-market injection setup and the cost
cheaper all the way and more reliable

[powerabout]

actually the mercury system would be the easiest to use
lets forget about the cost and benefit for now

the original ecu uses 3 amp peak 1 amp hold injector drivers but 12 of them
first you would have to look what the air and fuel injector signal looks like
you can do this with a
http://www.picoauto.com/automotive-oscilloscope.html
preferably at the same time looking at the oil pump signal since we no longer have lubrication through the fuel
this is most likely a PWM signal
now if the air and fuel signal are the same you can use any sequential ecu you just have to double the injector signal
you would still need to log an original engine with the lamda and EGT data at specific loads as to have a target mixture range

if there is some offset going on
you would need 2 sequential groups of injector drivers
i don,t know of any aftermarket ecu,s that can do that right now maybe motec or EFI
but already your cost benefit is flying out the window
the better and much safer (less stuff can go wrong) would be to build the engine to standard manifold injection
a direct injection engine turning peak rpm is only slightly more economical than standard injection
it only shines at idle and slightly higher rpm,s where it uses stratified injection as opposed to homogeneous injection

now make a list of there mercury stuff you can through in the corner with the price-tag on it
oilpump, airpump, injectors fuel and air, fuel air rail, pressure regulators ,mercury ecu
and now make a list of an after-market injection setup and the cost
cheaper all the way and more reliable

Thats why I like the etec, modded cyl head and a pak and install oil pump and feed pipes and your done, problem is an aftermarket pack to fire an etec injector doesnt exist
I was thinking retrofitting the air pump would be the issue for a Merc system?
Yes no real advantage at WOT with direct injection but plenty of other bonuses if converting from a carb engine.

Whats the down side of a conventional high pressure direct injector like the Japs use(d), all aftermarket stuff already exists for that ( just add oiling system)

I always envised a custom orbital injector but have a serious air pump so the air going through the injector will actually create boost then as a forced induction 2 stroke you skip all the open exhaust port issues not to mention who now cares about porting so a stocker could pull 10,000rpm ( as long as the exhaust is high enough and big enough?)

[PanRonnie]

Whats the down side of a conventional high pressure direct injector like the Japs use(d), all aftermarket stuff already exists for that ( just add oiling system)

none
but you can,t use an exsisting system no software to adjust the ecu !!!
again how deep are your pockets?
if we are just spit-balling here and money is no problem
i would go for the bosch solenoid direct injection system
http://www.bosch-motorsport.de/de/de..._1_160662.html
but already your 1 injector group short
there are module,s for laboratory testing
http://sine.ni.com/nips/cds/view/p/lang/nl/nid/210063

piezo injection in my mind would be the ultimate goal
where you can inject while the piston is top dead center
but these injectors don,t exist for gasoline injection at the moment
but i think it will be another 5 to 10 years before this will be avaible for the aftermarket

and by that time we will probably be using something like this
http://regennautic.com/products/e200-outboard/
<iframe src="//www.youtube.com/embed/yg1aH55cxow" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="480" width="640"></iframe>

[powerabout]

wouldnt any aftermarket pack ( sequential) drive a DFI assuming the dfi injector uses a conventional signal?

[PanRonnie]

wouldnt any aftermarket pack ( sequential) drive a DFI assuming the dfi injector uses a conventional signal?

to be clear the links above are just the injector driver boxes not the management ecu itself
all they do is provide the injector signal curve
something like this

this will be different for all injectors bosch, yamaha , bombardier
you might be able to use a standard aftermarket ecu giving the injector signal
but you would need these driver boxes
that,s a lot of expensive hardware
if you want to try it out best of luck
you might wanna start with standard fuel and injection control
that,s already a challenge
you remember the V8 projects both dead in the water
somebody with a crossflow engine never to be heard from
start small and easy make it work and then go 1 step further

[powerabout]

Ok thanks, good advice.
Brucato did a few OMC V8's and Monty does now as well.
I will start with a V4 OMC looper as Brucato has maps for them, I wonder if his controller with drive a DFI injector?

[PanRonnie]

brucato is a fuel only management system wich triggers of the ignition pulse
it will never drive a gdi injector
buy a wolf DTA or a megasquirt plzzz no Kdfi, Vems, panthera i have seen the software and i still don,t get it
i,m having fun with mine installing the last hardware bits as it will go behind the boat next year

<iframe src="//www.youtube.com/embed/46q35k1UNMM" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="480" width="640"></iframe>

start with fuel only and go from there!

[powerabout]

how about a vipac?

[PanRonnie]

I saw prices of 2000$ for an ecu
i would call that motec, EFI price range
if you start simple with a fuel only ms2
you probably have your entire set up for under a 1000$
Injectors ,fuel rail, pump, ecu, regulator
you can tap of the voltage regulator pulse driving the tach
don, t forget you are also going to need an EGT , Lamda set up, laptop if you don, t have one
it add, s up
keep it simple to start with and you enjoy the lurning curve
if you take it easy chances of you burning your engine are very low

[powerabout]

I'd be straight to a dyno to save all the grief
MSII pack will trigger from the stator wire, how about crank angle still need a magnet or something I guess that saves a tooth wheel?
What do you lose if you run the Microsquirt to get a sealed unit which surely will last longer?