Did Kidd Marine Corp make a small race cat in the 80's.

[dhpt99]

I have a small 10 foot catamaran which i thought was a cougar cub. After running the hin it said it was a kidd marine corp. Did they ever make a cougar cub replica back in 1984 ( Last to digits of the hin are 84). The badge has been painted over so it is hard to read and hard to make out.

[sofreak]

I have an 85

[dhpt99]

How many feet is that?

[sofreak]

13.5 feet. It rides pretty good in chop.

[barefootviking]

I found one of these hulls for sale in Miami. Does anyone have any performance data? I want to put a smaller motor on it and turn it into a tender.

[barefootviking]

I'm interested in hull weight and how it might handle underpowered, with maybe a 50hp 4-stroke. It'll be a project boat. Thanks.

[mark30h]

Not sure about the weight of the cougar, probably similar to the Baja Scat Cat that weighed in at about 300 lbs empty. They were designed to race APBA Cub class with 25hp, so a 50 would not be underpowered. We had a scat cat that we had a Merc 500 4cyl, then a 70 hp three cylinder Merc. More power and the torque of the 3 cylinder created some unique ride issues as it tended to drop the right bow sponson at speed . Planing with either the 50 or 70 I recall was also challenging as there was no smooth throttle transition to plane. You had to stomp the throttle, and the boat would launch straight up, and come over, then you could reduce throttle. The other weird facet was turning. Like some of their big brother cats, they tend to roll to the outside on turns as opposed to a v-bottom. Took a bit to get used to. Once used to it, and giving it some respect, it was a fun ride. Especially once the tunnel packed air. I have always regretted selling it. I dont have a comparison as to performance with lower power.

Some time ago I saw a scat cat with a 135 black max on it. They named it "double bump" as when it took off in full throttle startups, it launched straight up, and bounced twice off the rear of the sponsons before the bow would come over. Im not sure how it floated, but it did exist.

The first photo was of mine with the 70, the second, the 135.

[barefootviking]

thank you for the info. the photos help as well, so i can make some guesses about how it'll sit in the water w weight on the back. If we take on this project, i'll be sure to post photos.

Not sure about the weight of the cougar, probably similar to the Baja Scat Cat that weighed in at about 300 lbs empty. They were designed to race APBA Cub class with 25hp, so a 50 would not be underpowered. We had a scat cat that we had a Merc 500 4cyl, then a 70 hp three cylinder Merc. More power and the torque of the 3 cylinder created some unique ride issues as it tended to drop the right bow sponson at speed . Planing with either the 50 or 70 I recall was also challenging as there was no smooth throttle transition to plane. You had to stomp the throttle, and the boat would launch straight up, and come over, then you could reduce throttle. The other weird facet was turning. Like some of their big brother cats, they tend to roll to the outside on turns as opposed to a v-bottom. Took a bit to get used to. Once used to it, and giving it some respect, it was a fun ride. Especially once the tunnel packed air. I have always regretted selling it. I dont have a comparison as to performance with lower power.

Some time ago I saw a scat cat with a 135 black max on it. They named it "double bump" as when it took off in full throttle startups, it launched straight up, and bounced twice off the rear of the sponsons before the bow would come over. Im not sure how it floated, but it did exist.

The first photo was of mine with the 70, the second, the 135.

[barefootviking]

hi mark,

do you know at what minimum speed the tunnel begins to pack air or slide along? Would a 4 blade prop sized for hole shot be a good solution? The boat doesn't need to go fast, 30mph is enough. I'm looking for smooth and fun for a older owner. Do you think a little tunnel like this is a bad idea? i could buy a 14' TwinVee cat for the project, as well. I know it's a totally different animal.

thoughts?
pj

[barefootviking]

http://miami.craigslist.org/mdc/boa/4226329924.html Kidd Marine. 13'9" LOA. 5'9" beam.

I was thinking to open up the cockpit for casual seating. I know it'll add weight.

[Mark75H]

Aerodynamics become significant above 60 mph. Few sub 60 mph outboards do much with aerodynamics

[mark30h]

My opinion, (and its just my opinion) is that these boats are not a good candidate for modification. They are very light, and have little reinforcing structure. I remember the fore deck on the Baja being so thin, that you couldnt lean on it to tie a line to the deck cleat without buckling the whole thing inward, like an upsidedown kiddie pool (with the same accompanying noise). Probably the only seating mod would be to open the cockpit crossways to use a full bench seat, but you pretty much sit on the tunnel. Three across would be very tight except for very small people, and opening and reinforcing the deck fore and aft would affect the weight, balance and performance of the boat.

The guys ive talked to that ran 25-35 hp were getting from 25-40 mph, but with light loads, and usually 3 blade props. The planing issue was due to extreme cavitation on level acceleration, probably having to do with propeller height and turbulence in the tunnel area. I do remember feeling lift on the hull at around 25-30 mph depending again on weight. They are a fun boat, but if plans are to use it in another capacity other than a light fun low powered speedboat for one person, there are probably better choices.

The cool part of these boats is the history. APBA tried to create a new low cost spec racing class, with a relate to the growing offshore racing sport. There were cub class races during the mid 80's on many of the offshore racing schedules, and many of the offshore teams had these boats mounted on the trailers carrying the large boats. During the events, inshore races were hosted and many of the offshore teams wives, and kids ran these boats. A friend of mine purchased the cougar that was owned by the Ajac Hawk team. The boat was painted to replicate the large one, and even had seats in the same color and design as the wrap around stand up bolsters in the big boat, with morse controls on top of the bolster divider.

Anyway, just my thoughts.

[mark30h]

Sam, you are most likely right on the low speed lift, I do know we felt the effects with the 70 hp at WOT, but 25-30 mph lift may have been wishful thinking.

[barefootviking]

thanks for enlightening me. I'll look for a cat hull w more floatation, then. i appreciate all the knowledge i've gained from perusing this site.