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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by jackie wilson View Post
    you amaze me with the statement------racing was not a priority or a way of life at omc. I went to the omc facility in brugge belgium and i can tell you they were as fanatical about racing there as mercury were in oshkosh. Did you ever tell the likes of barry woods and cees velden, posey and sanders and jimbo that racing was not a priority. Don't know which planet you were on at the time----but i would not have liked to race against omc if they ever decided to make it a priority.
    My statement was more directed at the USA. Unfortunately it is very difficult to get any information out of Europe when you are in a so called "Western Country". Just take a look at any website. There is virtually nothing there pertaining to European outboard racing. If there is please direct me to it. A contact or two would be nice as well.

  2. #32
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    CLICK on a picture & go to "FULL SIZE" to make it larger.





  3. #33
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    Thanks for the great story Ken. Great read
    In reference to the Hydrostream Power Tour:

    Quote Originally Posted by Scream And Fly View Post
    This is seriously one of the best threads on this site ever.



  4. #34
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    Liquid, what a great read, thank you for sharing.

    So how many rotary engines were made during that time? And how many do you know exist today? I've see pictures of the display one at the Bomb. tech school.

    Thank you-

  5. #35
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    We'll see if we can get John to clarify that.

    At least 4 piled up snowmobile rotary outboard racers and 4 dedicated 4 rotor race motors were made; at least 8 ... but at any one time only 4 were "out in the wild" away from the lab.

    Bob Zipps may have a line on how many are still known.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by LIQUID NIRVANA View Post
    My statement was more directed at the USA. Unfortunately it is very difficult to get any information out of Europe when you are in a so called "Western Country". Just take a look at any website. There is virtually nothing there pertaining to European outboard racing. If there is please direct me to it. A contact or two would be nice as well.
    Hey Liquid, Boat racing reports, coverage and history in europe are a bit like yorkshire--------God made it and forgot it.

  7. #37
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    CLICK ON THE PICTURE & then "FULL SIZE" to make it bigger.




  8. #38
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  9. #39
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    great read,enjoyed learning about the history side of the outboards!!

  10. #40
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    All this -----but it was not serious----switch clouds liquid---must have been one of the projects that brought on the tits up situation. The investors were worried even way back then. Charlie strang and jack leek only ever played for real money.!!!!!!!!!! Have to disagree with you --------omc were always serious. !!!!!!!!!!

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by LIQUID NIRVANA View Post
    Epilog

    By 1975, EPA was making noises about regulating emissions on outboards. They were in fact doing lake testing in Michigan and Florida trying to prove outboard emissions harmed water quality and aquatic life. In addition, in 1974 the state of California banned any 2-cycle motorcycles from public streets, because Honda had demonstrated their 4-cycle bikes were a viable alternative to the 2-stroke machines. No emission standard, just a total ban. A rotary is actually a 4-cycle engine even though the charged cool versions mixed oil with the gas to lubricate the internal parts. An untreated rotary emitted 10 times less hydrocarbon emissions than the 2-stroke equivalent at the time. OMC was afraid if they introduced a production rotary outboard, EPA would impose a similar ban on 2-stroke outboards. OMC was in no position to replace their entire line up of outboards with rotaries. Not only had they only limited HP size of engines under development, the cost to retool the entire line up would have been prohibitive. Because of this, the rotary program was put on the back burner and the development emphasis was put on 2-cycles. The rotary group started to fall apart with the departure of several key engineering people including George Miller and myself. Before I left OMC, 4 racing rotaries were built, dyno run and put into storage. The attached HP curve is from one of those engines. Very little further development work was done on the rotaries after 1976. When BRP bought Johnson and Evinrude from the bankrupt OMC, the deal did not include any rotary technology or rights. If fact, OMC had sold all of their remaining rotary assets including parts inventory and machinery to Paul Moller of Moller International. What has happened to those 4 racing engines, I don’t know. They were not sold to Moller International. The rotary engine bucket and shroud sold on e-bay recently was the show and tell model hung in the lobby on OMC Engineering. It was not fully machined and didn’t have an engine in it. OMC went on to develop a V-8 to dominate the unlimited outboard class and Mercury created a class that only their V-6 could compete in.

    So ended one of the most exciting and talked about periods in outboard racing history; and that’s the real story.
    <!-- / message --><!-- sig -->

    Quote Originally Posted by jackie wilson View Post
    All this -----but it was not serious----switch clouds liquid---must have been one of the projects that brought on the tits up situation. The investors were worried even way back then. Charlie strang and jack leek only ever played for real money.!!!!!!!!!! Have to disagree with you --------omc were always serious. !!!!!!!!!!
    Even OMC could not fight the EPA sunshine. They (EPA) had way to much power, (Nothings changed). If the EPA got wind of how good the Rotary was in emissions (10 times better than 2 stroke outboards in 1976) & their ultra low fuel consumption then they would have banned the 2 stroke outboard instantaniously, just like they banned the 2 stroke motorbike instantaniously. Problem is it would have taken years & huge amount of money for OMC to retool a rotary range. And all other brands of 2 stroke Outboard Motors would have been history as well.

  12. #42
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    One thing has remained constant since dr wankel invented the damned thing 'it is a flawed piece of kit'. Nobody has ever made it work as a viable proposition. All the major engine manufacturers have bought into it at sometime or another, but after spending huge amounts on r&d, without exception, they all binned it. Even omc only had very limited success with it for the huge amount of lolly poured into it.
    As for the instant banning of 2 stroke motorcycles, they had been around since the 1920/ 30/s that i can remember. Pruett had at least 3 kawasaki 2 strokes for 3 or 4 years that even i can remember.
    Diesels used to be the bad boys as far as emissions went but the r&d put into them resulted in the cleanest burning motor on the market today.
    Liquid !!! It's a brilliant article and i did not mean to piss on your parade. But iv'e always been a cranky disagreeable old bastard, [that's what my kids tell me]

  13. #43
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    One thing has remained constant since dr wankel invented the damned thing 'it is a flawed piece of kit'. Nobody has ever made it work as a viable proposition. All the major engine manufacturers have bought into it at sometime or another, but after spending huge amounts on r&d, without exception, they all binned it. Even omc only had very limited success with it for the huge amount of lolly poured into it.
    As for the instant banning of 2 stroke motorcycles, they had been around since the 1920/ 30/s that i can remember. Pruett had at least 3 kawasaki 2 strokes for 3 or 4 years that even i can remember.
    Diesels used to be the bad boys as far as emissions went but the r&d put into them resulted in the cleanest burning motor on the market today.
    Liquid !!! It's a brilliant article and i did not mean to piss on your parade. But iv'e always been a cranky disagreeable old bastard, [that's what my kids tell me]

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by jackie wilson View Post
    One thing has remained constant since dr wankel invented the damned thing 'it is a flawed piece of kit'. Nobody has ever made it work as a viable proposition. All the major engine manufacturers have bought into it at sometime or another, but after spending huge amounts on r&d, without exception, they all binned it. Even omc only had very limited success with it for the huge amount of lolly poured into it.
    As for the instant banning of 2 stroke motorcycles, they had been around since the 1920/ 30/s that i can remember. Pruett had at least 3 kawasaki 2 strokes for 3 or 4 years that even i can remember.
    Diesels used to be the bad boys as far as emissions went but the r&d put into them resulted in the cleanest burning motor on the market today.
    Liquid !!! It's a brilliant article and i did not mean to piss on your parade. But iv'e always been a cranky disagreeable old bastard, [that's what my kids tell me]
    I agree with the last part of your post. Time to change mate. We all have to leave something positive & happy for our kids to remember after we have gone. Its important. We owe them that. In the meantime I wish you all the best.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by jackie wilson View Post
    One thing has remained constant since dr wankel invented the damned thing 'it is a flawed piece of kit'. Nobody has ever made it work as a viable proposition. All the major engine manufacturers have bought into it at sometime or another, but after spending huge amounts on r&d, without exception, they all binned it. ]

    I assume you are talking about marine outboard engines only ?

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