E-Tec 250 H.O.

[79Jcraft]

I have a 20" 250ETEC for a 20' Whaler project, cant wait to get it on there and see how it does. Hopefully in 2 weeks I will find out.

Is there a 250HO and a 250 or are they the same?

The BRP website is pretty crappy so it seems I cant figure it out, especially for us people not so much in the "know" when it comes to these things.

I was waiting for someone to mention their website...I was disapointed with it especially their comparisons to the competition's 4strokes...I am omc/brp thru and thru, was handed sown to me from my grampa and dad...but comparing apples to oranges really makes them look stupid...I would have liked to see them set up equivalent opti's and yammy's against their own. I don't expect the e-tec to beat anything and everything but if you want to get respect for your accomplishments, picking a race with the fat kid aint gonna get it. Why didn't they do the pull test with an Opti..that would have been f**kn cool to watch rather than spanking a 4 stroke..***** my old 81 235 could spank that 4 stroke!

[Instigator]

picking a race with the fat kid aint gonna get it. Why didn't they do the pull test with an Opti..

J...very true and agreed by most on this site but consider this....BRP is the ONLY company that has stood toe to toe against the 4 stroke marketing monster.

Merc and Yammid build both 2 and 4 stroke so they really can't pick one in paticular.

IMO, if it had not been for BRP sticking with the 2 strokes and their "creative" marketting the 2 stroke would probably be dead and gone by now.

Doubtful that Merc or Yammi would still spending the $$$ on 2 strokes if not for the E-Tec.

Spirit, if you put the magnetic plugs in both holes and then start checking fluid that often they will tell you what's going on.

I did that when I ran my first set of miss-matched gears. Started with petroleum based fluid to allow for some "break in/alignment" of gears. (I saw none)
Then switched to synthetic (was using cheap Sierra fluid) and kept checking plugs every time I ran the boat.

Still no signs of wear. At that point I started backing off my service frequincies.

Based on what you guys are doing and how long those motors are loaded you will need to stay on top of it.
Even w/a Sportmaster you'd have to do the same thing.

Gary

[79Jcraft]

J...very true and agreed by most on this site but consider this....BRP is the ONLY company that has stood toe to toe against the 4 stroke marketing monster.

Merc and Yammid build both 2 and 4 stroke so they really can't pick one in paticular.

IMO, if it had not been for BRP sticking with the 2 strokes and their "creative" marketting the 2 stroke would probably be dead and gone by now.

Doubtful that Merc or Yammi would still spending the $$$ on 2 strokes if not for the E-Tec.

You are 100% right and thankfully they have kept the 2stroke alive, moreso they have made it efficient and "gulp" environmental...(never thought i would hear/see myself say THAT...lol It is amazing what all the above have done to improve our sport and enjoyment. I guess i can see that they are trying to open the consumers eyes to the 2 stroke over the 4...but it would be nice to see them show some even comparison to try to entice those already knowing they want a 2 stroke, each manufacturer I am sure excel in one way or another with their 2's. Similar tests would just open our eyes as to which excels where...

[Instigator]

they have kept the 2stroke alive, moreso they have made it efficient and "gulp" environmental...(never thought i would hear/see myself say THAT...lol

Two points.

#1. I am in the O/B business and the large majority of consumers still have no clue as to the difference between a 2 and 4 stroke.
They only "know" what they are "told to THINK".

I deal with people almost daily that tell me they want a 4 stroke. Most I can educate (w/o showing brand allegiance) and they walk away in amazement to what they did not know.

(had a guy at last yrs Miami boat show at my booth ready to write a check for a 4 stroke until I enlightened him )

The 4 strokes are selling based on being compared to 20 yr old, out of tune, barely running 2 strokes not current technology D.I. 2 strokes and thats the first thing I tell these people.
Don't trust me, do your own home work.

I usually include some "Pro" 2 and "Con" 4 stroke propaganda in my advertising and you would be shocked by how many people just call to thank me because they didn't know.

I sold a guy a rebuilt V-6 p.head and charged him extra to replace complete ignition system as preventive maintenance.

He bought based on savings of repairing his 15 yr old motor vs buying new.

I told him, "of course the new motors are much better and more efficient but how many hrs use and how many yrs of ownership will you need to make up the $13K additional investment?"
And oh yeah, don't forget to include the required scheduled maint. to keep your new miracle motor in warranty.

One of my suppliers gets $300. for a 100 hr check on his 4 strokes

#2. I'm old enough to remember the death of the muscle car, big blocks, Sunoco 260, and stump pulling torque!
I, like most believed that was it and we were done with performance.

Wrong!
Now look at a 300 HP Subaru WRX 4 banger that gets 30 mpg while scaring you silly.

How bout a new Caddy coupe thats faster than the old muscle cars, gets double the mileage, handles, is comfortable and dependable?

I think we're seeing the same thing happen to our hobby right now.

The manufactures had to scramble for the last few yrs just to survive the emission standards shoved down their throats by people that thought they had the deep pockets of GM, Ford and Chrysler

Now that they've made it beyond and seem to be doing well.....maybe we will see a brand new horsepower war between the mfgs???
Already seeing it with the pig motors like the new Yammi 350 but that is also a HUGE market compared to our style of stuff which other than bassers they don't normally even acknowledge.

IMO the best is yet to come and I am willing to eat crow as I was one that though the Hi Perf O/B was doomed just a few yrs back.

Gary

[Stinky]

JIMO, if it had not been for BRP sticking with the 2 strokes and their "creative" marketting the 2 stroke would probably be dead and gone by now.

Doubtful that Merc would still spending the $$$ on 2 strokes if not for the E-Tec.

Thats the funniest thing I have ever read!

[NNT]

Heres my take on BRP's pushing of 2 strokes. They either had to dump the outboard segment altogether,push suzuki 4 strokes that were painted white or figure the ficht nightmare out and redesign/improve on it since carbed 2 strokes were soon to be killed off. They chose the last option and so far so good, but not without it's growing pains which I'm not exactly sure are all over with yet. BRP has a awesoem marketing dept and they are mighty careful who they go up against in head to head testing. They like to pick on the Yamaha 4 strokes since they know they have a power to weight advantage and it's not cutting thier own throats since they really don't have a 4 stroke dept at BRP anymore. I think all the new outboards are fairly dependable now and your pretty much safe with any of them. For the money though I think the Etecs are a little high priced for whats still out theere, but it's all in what you want. I could care less about emissions,fuel economy or self winterization, so I chose a classic carbed 90 Merc motor(would have gone with a BRP 115 V4 if I had known they were still being sold though). The extra $2500+ to go to a 90 etec just wasn't worth it to me. I don't think the 90 Etecs are as strong as the old V4 90 omc's and Merc 3 cyl 90's, just my opinion based on performance numbers I have seen.

I think BRP pushing the 2 strokes kept and maybe put the heat on Merc to up the ante with the Optis, which they have done. In the end the consumer is the winner. I hope to see a 350+ hp DFI 2 stroke, better yet I hope to have something to put it on

[Instigator]

Thats the funniest thing I have ever read!

E-Tec's are 3 star rated, Opti's are 2.

Now what?

Merc has what one more year with their current technoligy??

You like funny, there you go.

[NNT]

I thought the new opti's were 3 star? Thought they made the change when they updated the Vrats? I could care less, but if ya can't buy em no more because of that, that could be a problem

[1BadAction]

only cali envirotards worry about 2/3 star Obs, it doesnt effect what the people buy in the 49 other NORMAL states. http://www.mercurymarine.com/service...dfaqs/carb.php

How can Mercury continue to sell conventional two-stroke engines outside of California?

The EPA Marine Engine Rule does not prevent manufacturers from certifying and selling conventional two-stroke engines. It is important to note the EPA currently regulates emissions levels, not engine technology. There are a number of requirements that need to be met to sell these engines, including the maintenance of a positive credit balance, production line testing and in-use testing. Mercury is pleased to be able to continue offering select conventional two-stroke models as an additional power choice for consumers seeking a more economical propulsion package.

[Stinky]

E-Tec's are 3 star rated, Opti's are 2.

Now what?

Merc has what one more year with their current technoligy??

You like funny, there you go.

I take that back, THAT is now the funniest thing I've ever read.

READ and edumacate.
http://northamerica.mercurymarine.co...dfaqs/carb.php

[Action Dave]

Heres my take on BRP's pushing of 2 strokes. They either had to dump the outboard segment altogether,push suzuki 4 strokes that were painted white or figure the ficht nightmare out and redesign/improve on it since carbed 2 strokes were soon to be killed off. They chose the last option and so far so good, but not without it's growing pains which I'm not exactly sure are all over with yet. BRP has a awesoem marketing dept and they are mighty careful who they go up against in head to head testing. They like to pick on the Yamaha 4 strokes since they know they have a power to weight advantage and it's not cutting thier own throats since they really don't have a 4 stroke dept at BRP anymore. I think all the new outboards are fairly dependable now and your pretty much safe with any of them. For the money though I think the Etecs are a little high priced for whats still out theere, but it's all in what you want. I could care less about emissions,fuel economy or self winterization, so I chose a classic carbed 90 Merc motor(would have gone with a BRP 115 V4 if I had known they were still being sold though). The extra $2500+ to go to a 90 etec just wasn't worth it to me. I don't think the 90 Etecs are as strong as the old V4 90 omc's and Merc 3 cyl 90's, just my opinion based on performance numbers I have seen.

I think BRP pushing the 2 strokes kept and maybe put the heat on Merc to up the ante with the Optis, which they have done. In the end the consumer is the winner. I hope to see a 350+ hp DFI 2 stroke, better yet I hope to have something to put it on

I think you hit the nail on the head(sort of). The improvement in 2stroke dfi engines (all brands) is a priority in the boating comunity. Lets face it, I love my carb motor but they are going the way of the dinosaur. How many carbureted cars are still out there? As far as price goes, wth the glut of marinas and dealerships here in South Florida, the prices are very similar from brand to brand. There isn't one motor in particular that is way more expensive than the others. Now, of course a CARB 90 Merc is going to cost alot less than a 90Etec. Does Merc make a 90 Opti? I'm also curious, WHY DO THEY MAKE VERADOS? I'm not bashing here. I love the Opti motors. I just don't understand why anyone would buy a heavier 4-stroke when they can get the same, or better, power, fuel economy, and (shudder) emissions with a DFI 2 stroke.

[Instigator]

I thought the new opti's were 3 star? Thought they made the change when they updated the Vrats? I could care less, but if ya can't buy em no more because of that, that could be a problem

mistaken but I thought thats what I read??

It may have been a yr or so ago but I know I read that the Opti as produced at the time only had a couple yrs left due to the EPA rating.

Course at this point we still don't have anybody checking anything.

[jphii]

So Gary, did you get an E-Tec block yet

[Instigator]

So Gary, did you get an E-Tec block yet

for a while.

Sleeves are out and one side porting is done.

[theoldwizard]

....BRP is the ONLY company that has stood toe to toe against the 4 stroke marketing monster.

Merc and Yammid build both 2 and 4 stroke so they really can't pick one in paticular.

IMO, if it had not been for BRP sticking with the 2 strokes and their "creative" marketting the 2 stroke would probably be dead and gone by now...

I'm new here, but let me throw in my opinion.

First, I think E-tec is amazing technology. Compared to Optimax and HPDI, it is sooooo much simpler ! In engineering and in life, Simpler is Better ! BRP took some of the money they saved on the injection system an put it in to better internal components (pistons, etc)

As for 4 stroke, I say "Vive la difference". No 4 stroke will ever beat the power-to-weight ratio of a 2 stroke. Even with a blower !

However, there is a place in the world for 4S outboards. First for people who can not be educate (Don't fight 'em ! Sell them what they want).

Second, for hulls that can handle the extra weight and applications that get many, many hours (1000's) of use per year, 4 S my be "better". Twins or triples, large (> 200HP) 2S outboards, even E-Tecs running XD100, use a lots of oil. I'm pretty certain, the "total cost of ownership" would be less for 4 strokes.

Remember that BRP also owns a (now very small) line of 4 stroke outboards. They also own one of the premier engine manufactures of the world, Rotax. The new Rotax V990 twin makes 139hp (that is about 2.2hp/cubic inch, naturally aspirated !) This engine is used in the new BRP Spyder and the new Buell 1125

So how about 250 hp V4 Johnson 4 stroke !