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Thread: OptiMax JP
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03-22-2006, 02:41 AM #31
the reason i liked it was because I know the potential that that engine has if it were to be turned into a purebred racer motor.. the slower burn rate(more controlable) and the fuels ability to resist unassisted combustion(ping) is far superior to that f gasoline.. and im sure it is well under rated and or detuned to survive in the abusive environments the government agencys put that motor in.. it would be interesting to see a dyno sheet from one soly set up for big hp.. i would immagine that it would surpass a nearly identically built gasoline motor..
and I try my best to take notice about any new product on the market...
4-16-2014. 25 years old today... the fishin boat doesnt look to bad for a classic does she
things that were are no longer as they are today...
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03-22-2006, 09:39 PM #325000 RPM
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Originally Posted by 150aintenuff
I'll need porting, combustion chamber geometry (including plug to injector orientation, injector to piston spec, total CC, and squish % and clearence), piston profile, ring package spec, liner material and honing spec, rail pressures.
The combustion chamber will be the most important, so a 3D model in CAD would really speed up the process. That should get me started.
Oh, And we could use the stroker crank if it will help. But you better spec the bearing package also. Its going to be one h#@l of a bang as you pass 300Hp on jet fuel.
Last edited by Stinky; 03-22-2006 at 09:53 PM.
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03-23-2006, 08:20 AM #335000 RPM
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Heres some light reading and a highlight.
http://www.fitchfuelcatalyst.com/tec...aboutfuel.html
HOW DO THE OCTANE RATING OF OTHER FUELS SUCH AS DIESEL OR JET FUEL COMPARE TO GASOLINE?
Diesel and Jet fuel (along with kerosene) have, indeed, terrible octane numbers; typically about 15-25 "octane". They tend to ignite easily from high compression. Their use in a gasoline engine will quickly destroy it.
Diesel fuel is rated by its cetane number, which is determined, like octane, by running the fuel in a test engine. Instead of heptane and iso-octane we use naphthalene (cetane rating = 0) and n-cetane (cetane rating = 100). In total opposite to octane ratings, the higher the cetane rating the higher the fuel's propensity to knock!
Just as using a fuel with an octane number higher than necessary in a gas engine will gain you nothing, using a fuel with a cetane number higher than necessary in a diesel engine gains you nothing. On the other hand, where using a fuel with too low an octane number in a gasoline engine will result in a damaged engine, using a fuel with too low a cetane number of a diesel engine will just result in a rough-running (or not running at all) engine with no damage.
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03-23-2006, 10:31 AM #34
i tend to disagreee with the statment in red... moststandard diesel engines need 15+:1 compression and over 400PSI cranking compression JUST to get the fuel to light off.. any less and you just end up cranking all day long with no fire.. diesel in a gasoline engine will shut the motor off due to its slower burn rate and need for less fuel to burn effectively.. over rich condition occurs and floods the motor..
Last edited by 150aintenuff; 03-23-2006 at 02:24 PM.
4-16-2014. 25 years old today... the fishin boat doesnt look to bad for a classic does she
things that were are no longer as they are today...
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03-23-2006, 10:39 AM #35
Nick, you don't know what you are talking about. This is really starting to piss people off. I suggest you delete that post.
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03-23-2006, 12:12 PM #36Originally Posted by 1BadActionLTB Racing-"Skittles"
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03-23-2006, 12:13 PM #375000 RPM
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Originally Posted by 1BadAction
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03-23-2006, 02:22 PM #38
ok lets look at gasoline and diesel chemecally.. or by all means dont let me prove you wrong try it... go down to yer local gas station.. say filler up with diesel and see how far you get before ya flood out.. it isnt gunna blow up yer motor it isnt gunna harm a thing.. a gasoline motor doesnt build enough cranking compression to effectivly and completely burn a heaver and slower burning fuel regardless of timing, and knock sensors.. i think they(stinky yes yer included in this statment) have done great things to actually make a gasoline designed fuel system generate enough of a stratisifactation of the incomming fuel charge to effectivly convert a gasoline designed engine to run on helocopter and jet fuel... i just know there is more HP in that motor.. just like there is in EVERY motor that is mass produced they all are a compremise of something somewhere.. and jim i really dont care if I piss ya off or not...
4-16-2014. 25 years old today... the fishin boat doesnt look to bad for a classic does she
things that were are no longer as they are today...
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03-23-2006, 02:38 PM #39
C8H18 is the generic formula for pure gasoline... thus octain..
Diesel is anywhere from C10 H8 up to C22 H46 thus its low Octain rating it has ZERO berring on the fuels combustion property what so ever .. octain isnt a property you would want in a JP or diesel engine... dont believe me look here http://www.chevron.com/products/prod.../L2_4_6_rf.htm the gasoline make up is here
Originally Posted by OREGON STATE UNIVERSITY
4-16-2014. 25 years old today... the fishin boat doesnt look to bad for a classic does she
things that were are no longer as they are today...
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03-23-2006, 04:33 PM #405000 RPM
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From your link.
In a diesel engine, the fuel ignites spontaneously shortly after injection begins. During this delay, the fuel is vaporizing and mixing with the air in the combustion chamber. Combustion causes a rapid heat release and a rapid rise of combustion chamber pressure. The rapid pressure rise is responsible for the diesel knock that is very audible for some diesel engines.
Yea, higher compression heads will fix that.
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03-23-2006, 04:38 PM #415000 RPM
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Originally Posted by 150aintenuff
Increasing the cetane number of the fuel can decrease the amount of knock
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03-23-2006, 08:01 PM #42
you brought up octain and I didnt say ANYthing about cetane in my post my point was that OCTANE was not a property of diesel fuels.. Cetane and octane ratings are basically the same thing but Most of the diesel knock that people hear isnt the combustion but the injector pumps and plungers of the injectors.. the auto and truck industry have gone to great lengths to reduce the noise from the pumps and injectors and low and behold the engines are quieter arent they... I will garantee that just because a PSD or Cummins rattles that less than 20% of the rattle is from the combustion of the fuels... it ignites due to the HIGH temperatures and high injector pressures that allow it to atomize to a combustable state.. JP5, Jet A and diesel are not considered Volitle liquids gasoline is they are flamable but not volitol untill a certain temperature and pressure is reached exposing gasoline to those same pressures would create a bomb..
4-16-2014. 25 years old today... the fishin boat doesnt look to bad for a classic does she
things that were are no longer as they are today...
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03-23-2006, 08:52 PM #435000 RPM
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???????????????????????.............................
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03-23-2006, 10:08 PM #44
never mind... im done ARGUING lets get back to talkin about that motor and how good it is...
4-16-2014. 25 years old today... the fishin boat doesnt look to bad for a classic does she
things that were are no longer as they are today...
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03-25-2006, 07:47 AM #455000 RPM
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Originally Posted by 150aintenuff
No offense, but you really dont know what you are talking about
Originally Posted by 150aintenuff
about time... honestly, you should do some more research (besides just scanning tidbits on the internet) about how diesels and engines really function. There are some very good books out there... I can get you a list if you like
also, be aware there is stuff that ISNT printed which is info and knowledge that companies have invested time and engineering into learning that isnt printed for public knowledge.Last edited by jimmyb; 03-25-2006 at 07:49 AM.